Pacman can't escape this one now that Sergio has called his bluff...
Thoughts?
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Pacman can't escape this one now that Sergio has called his bluff...
Thoughts?
where there's no will... there's no way.
i'd love to see it tho.
No way ever does this fight happen. Nooooooooooooo way!!!! Maybe when Martinez is 43-44 years old..
They'll insist on 148 and then price themselves out of the fight!!! Guaranteed!
When roach was interviewed about Mosely trying to get the fight he tried boiling Mosely down to 142 and when Shane said you fought Oscar
at 147 Roach said your not Oscar your better than Oscar.
Same thing with Martinez, he'll say you fought Margarito at 150 and they'll say your not Margarito, your better than Margarito. Roach is on record and on Video stating that he will never give any fighter an advantage over PAC and their only out for big money fights.. And they'll end up trying to fight the winner of Cotto vs Margarito
I think Sergio will look worse than Oscar if he tries to make 150.
A 70% Sergio is still pretty good, he'll rehydrate probably to 160-164. If he survives that ok he'll abruptly hand manny his rear
Yes because Mayweather doesn't do nothing like this does he? No he just prefers to weigh in over the proposed weight limit then pay his opponent off, this after making him move up two weight classes in the first place.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
What does Mayweather have to do with anything anyone said in this thread?Quote:
Originally Posted by skel1983Yes because Mayweather doesn't do nothing like this does he? No he just prefers to weigh in over the proposed weight limit then pay his opponent off, this after making him move up two weight classes in the first place.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
You obviously don't know JT. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by shzaWhat does Mayweather have to do with anything anyone said in this thread?Quote:
Originally Posted by skel1983Yes because Mayweather doesn't do nothing like this does he? No he just prefers to weigh in over the proposed weight limit then pay his opponent off, this after making him move up two weight classes in the first place.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
Quote:
Originally Posted by skel1983You obviously don't know JT. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by shzaWhat does Mayweather have to do with anything anyone said in this thread?Quote:
Originally Posted by skel1983Yes because Mayweather doesn't do nothing like this does he? No he just prefers to weigh in over the proposed weight limit then pay his opponent off, this after making him move up two weight classes in the first place.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
Mayweather is the fighter who should take flack for not fighting Martinez if anyone. Hasn't Manny climbed enough weight classes.
Why is Martinez dodging the winner of the Super Six? Why is not willing to climb to 170 to fight the winner of Dawson Hopkins?
Manny has gone from straw weight to 150lbs. That's the highest climb in modern boxing history. I'd say he's done enough.
I hear Wlad is willing to starve himself to 170 if Pacquiao can manage to bloat himself to that weight.
I dont really like this idea for Sergio... 150?? i guess he's getting really desperate for a mega fight...
Pampered Lucian Bute is willing to face him at 165 but i dont think that's a good idea for sergio either...
Well my fellow Saddo genisuses. The premise of the 1st fellas post was Pac's camp must of opened their yap and shot off that they would fight Martinez at 150? Hence the term called their bluff
<br />Quote:
Originally Posted by skel1983<br />Quote:
Originally Posted by shza<brQuote:
Originally Posted by skel1983<br />Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
<br />
Yes because Mayweather doesn't
do nothing like this does he? No he
just prefers to weigh in over theproposed weight limit then pay
his opponent off, this after making
him move up two weight classes in
the first place.
<br /
What does Mayweather have to do
with anything anyone said in thisthread?
<br />
You obviously don't know JT. <img
src="images/smilies/wink.gif"
border="0" alt="" title="Wink"
smilieid="4" class="inlineimg" />
<br />
Well i don't know aside from my avatar I didn't bring Mayweather into the thread? Apparently Skel thinks I did even though I can't find 1 mention of his name on my response???
Oh Bilbo I'm surprised at you? Manny turned pro at 16. So you don't think it's reasonable for a athlete who was and is still maturing physically to gain 40 lbs, especially seeing he has a nutritionist and strength and strength and conditioning coach. His weight class achievement is severely overrated seeing he had consistently weighed in on fight night in the 142-144 range way back as far as fighting 130? With the exception of Margarito and Clottey who was a punching bag and thru 2 punches around tell me the last guy Manny fought in his prime that he didn't out weigh?? You realize you won't find it anywhere with in the last 5-6 years. He outweighed Oscar Delahoya by a pound and a 1/2 in their fight...
Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
He was fighting at 129 just over 3 years ago so what does it matter what age he turned pro?
He's fought in 5 weight classes (well almost 150, say 4 and a half) in 3 and a half years.
Who else has matched that? :confused:
Ok if Manny is always fighting smaller guys, then who has he fought recently he did outweigh?
It's ridiculous to suggest he was the bigger man going in against Mosley and Hatton.
Floyd has fought legitimately at 154. He's not fought below welterweight since 2005, that's 6 years at welter. He's has no excuse for not moving back up to 154 if he believes he's the best ever.
As for Manny, I don't remember him claiming that at every opportunity. He's always just been very humble and won't care less if you don't rate him or not. He'd still shake your hand and let you pose for a photo with him.
Floyd on the other hand, well we saw against Larry...he cares.
So man up, and move up.
I think Martinez should fight Floyd at a catch weight, then come in at what ever weight he wants, lose the whole purse because of the penalty, knock Floyd out, become a legend.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 0james0
haha that would be great.
The real fight I wanna see is Leftylee vs Jtrock. The skinny chav like British kid vs the fat ass American. That would be even a better fight than Sergio vs Pac.
<br />Quote:
Originally Posted by generalbulldog
<br />
Yea clearly, 5'11 190 registers me as a fat reared American nonetheless keep up the good posting
100% Agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimanuel Boogustus
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat100% Agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimanuel Boogustus
Didn't Oscar weigh in at 142 though?
Oscar did something seriously wrong in his preparation imo. Mosley was able to come down and be highly effective. Nothing to suggest Martinez would be a corpse at 150, going on the example one Oscar alone.
Hopkins was able to drop weight. It depends on the kind of discipline and body Martinez has.
He was a career welterweight after all.
Pacquiao fighting Martinez at 150 would be a no-win situation for him. If he defeated Martinez, it will be like the post-Oscar fight criticisms all over again. If Manny loses, he will be criticized for losing a fight where he tried to gain an advantage with the catchweight.
I think he'll do it properly & be close to his bestQuote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat100% Agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimanuel Boogustus
Be effin great if sergio did something like this but can't see it happening, I mean this is the dude that oppened his second fight with pwil with a "good luck". Don't think he can effectively make 150 but I can see him trying for pac or pbf.Its to bad there really is no megafight for martinez at his weight, I mean sure the winner of the ss6, but again it wouldn't be a megafight since none of those guys are that big of a name, and sergio isn't a big mw. Sergio needs to just fight barker, go to germany and beat sturm, then move up to smw and beat the last man standing and call it a day.Quote:
Originally Posted by 0james0
This. He'll be a punching-bag at that weight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimanuel Boogustus
How does Martinez even know if he can make 150 anymore? He sure is desperate for that big payday. Not that I begrudge him one as he deserves it, but when you are willing to become skeletor and potentially do an Oscar then it is probably best it doesn't happen.
The last time he was even close to that weight was 2003. There's no way he comes in at even 50% at 150.Quote:
Originally Posted by miles
I disagree, he was under 154 just in '09 & he's always come in under 160. I think he could make the weight without sacrificing to much. But its irrelevant as Pac won't take the fight anywayQuote:
Originally Posted by CFHThe last time he was even close to that weight was 2003. There's no way he comes in at even 50% at 150.Quote:
Originally Posted by miles
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
id just like to see manny and wlad at heavyweight
Lou DiBella went on record to say that Martinez would have to "kill himself" to make 154 now. I'd be amazed if Martinez could even get himself down to 150, let alone be effective down there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cressa121
If Martinez is too big to go down, and is looking for the big fights then why not move up and fight Bute? That guy is crying out for a decent opponent, having to make do to with B listers like Jesse Brinkley and Brian Magee as all the other top guys are tied up in the Super Six.
That's the same thing that be said about ever Floyd Mayweather fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by InTheNeutralCorner
To be fair to Martinez, why don't they just allow him to keep his weight while he fights Pacquiao and Mayweather at the same time?
So, let Martinez just fight someone his own size. Or he can challenge someone two weight divisions up to a catchweight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ant LiveThat's the same thing that be said about ever Floyd Mayweather fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by InTheNeutralCorner
I understand wanting to fight Floyd and Pacman. But if Martinez can't get neither, why is he not chasing the champions at 154?
Alvarez vs Martinez
K9 vs Martinez
Cotto vs Martinez
Margarito vs Martinez
Trout vs Martinez
And I know JccJr don't want it, call him out!!! Martinez needs to promo himself.
The fight to be made is
Martinez vs Andre Dirrell at 164
But the one thing in supporting Martinez is that he has spent most of his career at lower weights. If he is truly able to fight at 150 then bring it on, but I just don't think he can make that without killing himself. Going down to 150 is far less evil than Mayweather fighting Marquez heavy and then refusing the CW.Quote:
Originally Posted by InTheNeutralCornerSo, let Martinez just fight someone his own size. Or he can challenge someone two weight divisions up to a catchweight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ant LiveThat's the same thing that be said about ever Floyd Mayweather fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by InTheNeutralCorner
I'd like to see that. Instead of asking someone that's already been through 8 weight classes to move up again, he should go up himself if he wants bigger and better fights. There's plenty of great opponents for him at super middleweight, aside from Bute he could fight the Kessler/Stieglitz winner, Dirrell if he ever returns and then there's Froch and Ward too. I've probably missed someone out there.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboQuote:
Originally Posted by Cressa121
If Martinez is too big to go down, and is looking for the big fights then why not move up and fight Bute? That guy is crying out for a decent opponent, having to make do to with B listers like Jesse Brinkley and Brian Magee as all the other top guys are tied up in the Super Six.
Really I don't know why he doesn't consider it. It's a lot more realistic then asking Pacquiao to come up again.
Imo it's because he's not a true middleweight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cressa121I'd like to see that. Instead of asking someone that's already been through 8 weight classes to move up again, he should go up himself if he wants bigger and better fights. There's plenty of great opponents for him at super middleweight, aside from Bute he could fight the Kessler/Stieglitz winner, Dirrell if he ever returns and then there's Froch and Ward too. I've probably missed someone out there.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboQuote:
Originally Posted by Cressa121
If Martinez is too big to go down, and is looking for the big fights then why not move up and fight Bute? That guy is crying out for a decent opponent, having to make do to with B listers like Jesse Brinkley and Brian Magee as all the other top guys are tied up in the Super Six.
Really I don't know why he doesn't consider it. It's a lot more realistic then asking Pacquiao to come up again.
He's never weighed in at 160. He was 157 against Paul Williams and just over 153 against Kermit Cintron.
The idea that he would be a corpse at 150 is just plain untrue imo. Everyone judges off the nightmare experience of Oscar De La Hoya and assumes it's impossible to drop weight, but if he's serious about it it wouldn't be that hard for him, else he wouldn't offer to do it.
There are numerous examples of fighters able to move down. Shane Mosley and Zab Judah have done it fine in the last couple of years. Kenny Florian in the UFC dropped down to 145 lb featherweight division in his last fight and looked awesome, totally dominating Diego Nunes and is now in line for a title shot there. He has fought in 4 weight classes in the UFC now and actually started out at 180 lbs. He's 35 as well.
Martinez is a small middleweight, he moved up because of the opportunity. There are no same day weigh in's any more, he knows he can move down and that's why he's pushing for it. Conversely, he obviously knows he's too small to move up, which is why he never makes any noise about the stars above him.
Martinez has fought as low as welter, although not in years. Remember he only stepped up to middle to fight Williams when Pavlik/ Williams came apart. Its not like he had to move up because he was having trouble making weight! If he thinks he can get down to 150 for a huge money fight with Pacquaio then all power to him
The reason Martinez is looking for the big fights is because he wants a big pay day. Does Bute offer a bigger pay day than what Martinez could get now at or around where he would normally fit in, which is 154-160? Given what Kessler, Pavlik, and Johnson have said, I doubt it. I imagine Martinez is getting paid high six figures or $1M or there abouts for his HBO fights now and I believe Bute is paying Johnson $500k and offered Pavlik, $1.1M. Going up to fight a bigger guy for the same amount of money doesn't make sense from a financial viewpoint.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboQuote:
Originally Posted by Cressa121
If Martinez is too big to go down, and is looking for the big fights then why not move up and fight Bute? That guy is crying out for a decent opponent, having to make do to with B listers like Jesse Brinkley and Brian Magee as all the other top guys are tied up in the Super Six.
In addition, Martinez from when he was 25-30 was a welterweight/junior middleweight. In the next couple of years, he grew into a full junior middleweight, and now at 35, I believe really he is at his best between 154 and 160.
However, he has to get over the idea of fighting Pacquiao because it will never happen. Pacquiao was most hurt after the Margarito fight, which was at 150. I don't see why he would go back up to 150 to face a tougher opponent in Martinez.
I actually think the best fight for Sergio Martinez right now given $ as the main incentive is the winner of the Cotto v. Margarito fight at 154. Big pay day at a division Martinez can fight in. Will Top Rank let that happen? Doubt it.