Was Lennox Lewis the greatest HW of ALL-TIME?

Someone who knows a thing or 2 about HW greats thinks so: George Foreman. I am starting to think there may be something to this. Lewis smoked the 2 guys who smoked him. Its hard to picture 5'10" Rocky Marciano fighting this giant. Its just as hard to picture Joe Frazier, who couldnt get past Foreman at 6'3", being able to fight 6'5" Lewis. Its hard to imagine Sonny Liston, Floyd Patterson or even Joe Louis fighting someone 6'5". I truly believe Lewis' height seriously and his reach seriously CONTRIBUTED to him being practically unbeatable.

Only guy I can imagine giving him a problem is 1965 Cassius Clay. Clay would dazzle him with speed and shuffle, and his stamina would outlast Lewis'. Larry Holmes had a tough time with Cooney---so it would be even tougher with Lewis. Dempsey, Tunney were too small for Lewis.

How about that Kansas farmer who KO'd Jack Johnson? ;D

he's surely one of the greatest. The only guys I'd pick against him are Ali and Holmes with his lighting jab.
Otherwise ,I agree many of the guys you mentioned are too small or just not as good/ or dont have the style to beat Lennox

Head to head on their best nights, the guys who I think could beat him are:

Tyson
Holmes
Ali
Holyfield
Foreman (only if by KO)

Lewis is definitely top ten HW all time for me though I can't really decide where to put him - arguments and counter arguments I have with myself have him sometimes as high as 3rd and then as low as 8th or 9th :-\

I just wish he was around now in his prime to take out the Klitschkos. Wlad would be an easy early night for him possibly inside 3 minutes. Vitali would take a bit longer.


Lets not forget he wasn't in his prime when he stopped him inside of 6 inhis last fight - shit I just used boxrec to see when it was. 8 years ago !!!! Where does time go.....

I'm a huge Lewis fan but I don't think he's the greatest. I still think Ali holds that title at-leased the 1960s Ali. I'd put Lewis in the top 3 though, his hight and reach are part of it. But if you watch him in his second Rachman fight at 36 years old he is amazing. So much better than the Klits today, he fires more right hands in one round than Wlad does on whole fights. His jab is also far harder than any active heavyweight today.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8QctkR_TxUk

there's a video of Lennox here, he looks in good shape, better than Foreman and Larry Holmes were at 45. God I'd love to know how good he'd be at this age.

"NO"....next question

Lewis is certainly a historic fighter and, as one of the first giant athlete types that will dominate the division for the next generation, he merits a place in history.

Because of his size and athleticism, he would be hard to beat, just like the Klits. The Klits are one dimensional, but they do what they do so well that its hard to see anyone beating them in the near future. Lewis had technical flaws too - his defence wasnt great, he pawed with the jab and he lost focus during fights. Having said that, he would be competitive with most fighters in history if he jumped into a time machine. He is therefore one of the BEST fighters in history.

What that doesn't tell us is what would happen if Ali had been born in 1970 instead of 1940, or if Joe Loius had been his own great grandson ...... better nutrition, good diet, early technical training etc may have meant that they too would have been 6'7" or more nowadays.

For me - a measure of true GREATNESS is how far ahead of the opposition people were AT THEIR TIME. Louis made 25 defences if the undisputed crown, Marciano never lost etc. Lennox did get splatted himself a couple of times by inferior contemporaries, and he never absolutely dominated the division like Ali did. I would argue, therefore, that those fighters were GREATER than Lennox.

Another way of thinking about it may be the 100metres sprint. Asafa Powell has run faster times than Jesse Owens, so he is arguably better ........ but he has not been so far ahead of the field or created history like Owens, so Owens is GREATER.

Just my interpretation of 'Greater', its worth a good debate though?

Head2Head, possibly.. Lennox was one of the very first supersized HW who had the mobility and the skills of a smaller fighter and a guy like that is very hard to beat... ON his best night, he beats everybody.. I have no doubts that he would put a beatdown on Joe Louis, Frazier and the Alis of the world.. Size disparity is a big factor in this case and he'd beat em all...

No.

Top 10? Maybe!

On his best night did he have the potential to beat anyone? Definitely.

Prime for prime though I'd have Foreman smashing him all over the place and I also think he got his timing of Holyfield perfect too. I think Holyfield on the night he destroyed Tyson would have taken any version of Lewis.

I don't like this because it sounds like I'm getting at Lewis and I really am not. I love the guy and to be honest I miss him and what he brought to the game, but the greatest of all time? For me, NO, but I won't come down too hard on anyone who thinks he is.

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

"NO"....next question

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Agreed, Ali & Holmes would have beaten him imo

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Originally Posted by BIG H

Head to head on their best nights, the guys who I think could beat him are:

Tyson
Holmes
Ali
Holyfield
Foreman (only if by KO)

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agree, a past his prime Holyfield took him to the limit in the rematch, so i'm pretty sure the same Holyfield that fought Bowe would have given him as much hell and most likely would have beaten him, IMO a prime Larry Holmes would have beaten him as well, had a better jab (IMO the best jab ever in the history of the HW division) and a good strong straight right, would have disrupted Lewis' tempo all night

on 2nd thought, having swung far in Lewis' favor after years of discrediting him, I will come back around a bit against him and say that he wouldnt have fared any better against some smaller figthters liek frazier than he fared against Tua, which is this: a boring fight, play-it-safe thing. Tua also was lazy and risk-averse in that fight, something guys like Tyson, Frazier and even Marciano would NEVER be. Has anyone ever seen those 3 shorties fighting cautiously? Therefore Lewis would have his hands full against even guys as short as Rocky, since they wouldnt cower out and chciken out like many recent fighters have against him, after tasting his huge jab and counter right uppercuts, alot just resigned themselves to fighting from the outside and getting picked apart/KO'd. Maybe Marciano would get KO'd fast with his in-your-face style, but atleast he'd have more of a chance at knocking Lewis out than the way Tua fought Lewis. Hey, I think the Rock could maybe crack Lewis' ribs if he ever got inside and landed a nice Suzie-Q.

Bes of 3 my answer is yes , and personally i dont buy this 1965 Clay guff ,

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Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust

on 2nd thought, having swung far in Lewis' favor after years of discrediting him, I will come back around a bit against him and say that he wouldnt have fared any better against some smaller figthters liek frazier than he fared against Tua, which is this: a boring fight, play-it-safe thing. Tua also was lazy and risk-averse in that fight, something guys like Tyson, Frazier and even Marciano would NEVER be. Has anyone ever seen those 3 shorties fighting cautiously? Therefore Lewis would have his hands full against even guys as short as Rocky, since they wouldnt cower out and chciken out like many recent fighters have against him, after tasting his huge jab and counter right uppercuts, alot just resigned themselves to fighting from the outside and getting picked apart/KO'd. Maybe Marciano would get KO'd fast with his in-your-face style, but atleast he'd have more of a chance at knocking Lewis out than the way Tua fought Lewis. Hey, I think the Rock could maybe crack Lewis' ribs if he ever got inside and landed a nice Suzie-Q.

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The fight against Tua was a masterclass and a complete shut out. Whether or not you found it 'boring' has no basis in how effective it was or how likley he was ever t0 lose that fight.

9 times out of 10 Lennox Lewis would have beaten Ali

it might be hard to swallow because of the fairy tales of Ali but its true

id put lewis in the top 2 or 3 HWs of all time

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Originally Posted by erics44

9 times out of 10 Lennox Lewis would have beaten Ali

it might be hard to swallow because of the fairy tales of Ali but its true

id put lewis in the top 2 or 3 HWs of all time

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I don't know about 9 out of 10 times - I can picture them being pretty even like the Frazier fights (obviously in a different way because of the differing styles).

I know it's a cop-out answer but I'd still put Ali as the greatest just for everything he achieved in and out of the boxing ring. It's very rare that you get a superstar who is the absolute best at his sport, fights everybody put in front of him, has a chin, has the skills and has the charisma/worldwide appeal that Ali had. You just can't touch that.

In terms of pure boxing, Ali in his prime gives every heavyweight in history a run for their money imho..But styles make fights.

As far as Lewis, he was very under-appreciated while boxing. Another case of "missed when he was gone. I'd put him within the top 5 heavy's of all time.

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Originally Posted by BIG H

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Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust

on 2nd thought, having swung far in Lewis' favor after years of discrediting him, I will come back around a bit against him and say that he wouldnt have fared any better against some smaller figthters liek frazier than he fared against Tua, which is this: a boring fight, play-it-safe thing. Tua also was lazy and risk-averse in that fight, something guys like Tyson, Frazier and even Marciano would NEVER be. Has anyone ever seen those 3 shorties fighting cautiously? Therefore Lewis would have his hands full against even guys as short as Rocky, since they wouldnt cower out and chciken out like many recent fighters have against him, after tasting his huge jab and counter right uppercuts, alot just resigned themselves to fighting from the outside and getting picked apart/KO'd. Maybe Marciano would get KO'd fast with his in-your-face style, but atleast he'd have more of a chance at knocking Lewis out than the way Tua fought Lewis. Hey, I think the Rock could maybe crack Lewis' ribs if he ever got inside and landed a nice Suzie-Q.

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The fight against Tua was a masterclass and a complete shut out. Whether or not you found it 'boring' has no basis in how effective it was or how likley he was ever t0 lose that fight.

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Tua was certainly no Frazier or Marciano though. I'd personally favour Frazier over Lewis. We all KNOW Frazier would just keep coming at Lewis through all the punishment, BUT how would Lewis fare when Joe hit him with that hook?

I can't make my mind up about Marciano against Lewis, but it wouldn't have been easy either way.

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Originally Posted by rjj tszyu

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Originally Posted by BIG H

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Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust

on 2nd thought, having swung far in Lewis' favor after years of discrediting him, I will come back around a bit against him and say that he wouldnt have fared any better against some smaller figthters liek frazier than he fared against Tua, which is this: a boring fight, play-it-safe thing. Tua also was lazy and risk-averse in that fight, something guys like Tyson, Frazier and even Marciano would NEVER be. Has anyone ever seen those 3 shorties fighting cautiously? Therefore Lewis would have his hands full against even guys as short as Rocky, since they wouldnt cower out and chciken out like many recent fighters have against him, after tasting his huge jab and counter right uppercuts, alot just resigned themselves to fighting from the outside and getting picked apart/KO'd. Maybe Marciano would get KO'd fast with his in-your-face style, but atleast he'd have more of a chance at knocking Lewis out than the way Tua fought Lewis. Hey, I think the Rock could maybe crack Lewis' ribs if he ever got inside and landed a nice Suzie-Q.

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The fight against Tua was a masterclass and a complete shut out. Whether or not you found it 'boring' has no basis in how effective it was or how likley he was ever t0 lose that fight.

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Tua was certainly no Frazier or Marciano though. I'd personally favour Frazier over Lewis. We all KNOW Frazier would just keep coming at Lewis through all the punishment, BUT how would Lewis fare when Joe hit him with that hook?

I can't make my mind up about Marciano against Lewis, but it wouldn't have been easy either way.

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He was no Frazier agreed. But not sure that Tua wouldn't have gone 49-0 against Marciano's opposition ;)

yes he certainly completed dominated Tua, boring as all hell as it was; but he couldnt really seriously hurt or let alone finish him. Tua fought un-gallantly and hardly took risks to press Lewis. My point is if a pressure fighter like Frazier or Tyson really pressed Lewis, good chins that they had of iron practically, and willing to take a few to give a few, how well would Lewis have dealt with 1988 Tyson? I dont know, Im just wondering what others think.

As for 1965 Clay being guff, well, listen, that dude WAS magic in that year, as in '66, '67 as well.

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Originally Posted by Althugz

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Originally Posted by erics44

9 times out of 10 Lennox Lewis would have beaten Ali

it might be hard to swallow because of the fairy tales of Ali but its true

id put lewis in the top 2 or 3 HWs of all time

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I don't know about 9 out of 10 times - I can picture them being pretty even like the Frazier fights (obviously in a different way because of the differing styles).

I know it's a cop-out answer but I'd still put Ali as the greatest just for everything he achieved in and out of the boxing ring. It's very rare that you get a superstar who is the absolute best at his sport, fights everybody put in front of him, has a chin, has the skills and has the charisma/worldwide appeal that Ali had. You just can't touch that.

In terms of pure boxing, Ali in his prime gives every heavyweight in history a run for their money imho..But styles make fights.

As far as Lewis, he was very under-appreciated while boxing. Another case of "missed when he was gone. I'd put him within the top 5 heavy's of all time.

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if someone asked me who was the greatest hw of all time I could answer Ali because of his charisma and what he achieved outside the ring

hes not the greatest hw boxer of all time, he would have lost to a number of others most of the time

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he would have lost to a number of others most of the time

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like who?

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Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust

yes he certainly completed dominated Tua, boring as all hell as it was; but he couldnt really seriously hurt or let alone finish him. Tua fought un-gallantly and hardly took risks to press Lewis. My point is if a pressure fighter like Frazier or Tyson really pressed Lewis, good chins that they had of iron practically, and willing to take a few to give a few, how well would Lewis have dealt with 1988 Tyson? I dont know, Im just wondering what others think.

As for 1965 Clay being guff, well, listen, that dude WAS magic in that year, as in '66, '67 as well.

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Minus the hand speed and one punch pop it almost describes the Mercer Lewis slugged it out with. I'm not entirely sure Tyson could soak up the Lewis artillery that Mercer had and Mikes jab was almost a throw away jab where Rays was short, sturdy and did damage that night. The biggest hitters Tyson faced up to then were Smith and Bruno and maybe Tucker, all stung him at one point. Best vs best I lean to Lewis to take Tyson. Would have been nice scrap

yeah gotta agree, lewis/tyson may have been an 80s foreman/frazier

Lets put another name out there...Jack Johnson...he was a hell of a boxer with great skills...i reckon he could have given everyone a tough fight...even Lewis

job biscuit (Johnson would have slaughtered Marciano)!!!

eh eh!!!

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Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust

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he would have lost to a number of others most of the time

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like who?

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lennox lewis, vitali klitchko, wladimir Klitchko

david haye ;D

no.

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Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust

yes he certainly completed dominated Tua, boring as all hell as it was; but he couldnt really seriously hurt or let alone finish him. Tua fought un-gallantly and hardly took risks to press Lewis. My point is if a pressure fighter like Frazier or Tyson really pressed Lewis, good chins that they had of iron practically, and willing to take a few to give a few, how well would Lewis have dealt with 1988 Tyson? I dont know, Im just wondering what others think.

As for 1965 Clay being guff, well, listen, that dude WAS magic in that year, as in '66, '67 as well.

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Bob Hayes was olimpic 100 m champion in 1964 , you think he would hold up against Usain Bolt ?
Clay was a top fighter but its ridiculous to think he would have beaten all of todays massive HW'S , the guy was out fought by glass jawed Ken Norton.
No way in hell he beats Lewis best of 3 , sorry i just dont buy the living in the past bullshit, yes some old time fighters who have to make weight could beat todays fighters of the same weight , but im sorry clay was a pup compared to Hw's like Lewis.

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Originally Posted by erics44

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Originally Posted by Althugz

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Originally Posted by erics44

9 times out of 10 Lennox Lewis would have beaten Ali

it might be hard to swallow because of the fairy tales of Ali but its true

id put lewis in the top 2 or 3 HWs of all time

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I don't know about 9 out of 10 times - I can picture them being pretty even like the Frazier fights (obviously in a different way because of the differing styles).

I know it's a cop-out answer but I'd still put Ali as the greatest just for everything he achieved in and out of the boxing ring. It's very rare that you get a superstar who is the absolute best at his sport, fights everybody put in front of him, has a chin, has the skills and has the charisma/worldwide appeal that Ali had. You just can't touch that.

In terms of pure boxing, Ali in his prime gives every heavyweight in history a run for their money imho..But styles make fights.

As far as Lewis, he was very under-appreciated while boxing. Another case of "missed when he was gone. I'd put him within the top 5 heavy's of all time.

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if someone asked me who was the greatest hw of all time I could answer Ali because of his charisma and what he achieved outside the ring

hes not the greatest hw boxer of all time, he would have lost to a number of others most of the time

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same can be said about Lewis, a small Oliver McCall was able to spark him in a round, so what tells you that Joe Frazier wouldn't be able to follow suit?

I see the Lewis nuthuggers are out in force! Lewis was as slow as a three toed sloth, he was smoked twice himself, won a disputed rematch with Holyfield, i don't even think that one was close, Lewis thought after the draw all he had to do was turn up to win. He was given a gift decision. He never fought Bowe. He was at times lazy, lumbering and easily hit.

Who would beat him ?

Liston KO's Lewis inside 5
Ali wins a wide UD
Frazier KO's Lewis inside 5 (Frazier had no problems with a taller ALI in 1971)
Foreman (1973/4) KO's Lewis inside 5
Holmes wins a wide UD
Tyson (1986-89 KO's Lewis inside 5

There is a quick half dozen.
He would have trouble with Norton, Lyle, Shavers (can you imagine what would happen if Shavers hit him?) I give Terrell a chance!

If he fought Vitali again he would've been Knocked out! Lewis behind on all score cards at time of stoppage. Wlad would beat him too!

Greatest of all time? Shit, he's not even the greatest of the past 20 years!

The Third man between having kts dick in your mouth and your just blind hate of Lewis its just funny. I mean we can name a lot of fighters that trouble Ali that should not have in his prime. Liston best win is Patterson thats it fucking blown up light heavyweight. Tyson lost ever big fight he was ever in what makes Lewis any different. The fight with Holyfield was close but first fight the real deal got own and i am Holyfeild fan a huge Holyfeild but he lost that fight strait up i can say that much. Now i would not have Lewis in the greatest of all time but if you don't have Lewis in the top 10 heavy then you don't know shit. Also Bowie wanted nothing to do with Lewis don't know why his name even coming up in this thread, with Lewis resume and beating every man put in front of him he deserves alot more then what people are giving him.

I think Ali takes it , Lewis is another boring Steward fighter who got by on his size and power. If Ali could take apart a prime Foreman, I don't doubth he could figure out the 1 2 Lewis style. Either Lewis bores the crap out of everyone and just 1 2 at range or Ali lights him up. But its definately not goin to Lewis 9 of 10 fights.

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Originally Posted by Mr140

The Third man between having kts dick in your mouth and your just blind hate of Lewis its just funny. I mean we can name a lot of fighters that trouble Ali that should not have in his prime. Liston best win is Patterson thats it fucking blown up light heavyweight. Tyson lost ever big fight he was ever in what makes Lewis any different. The fight with Holyfield was close but first fight the real deal got own and i am Holyfeild fan a huge Holyfeild but he lost that fight strait up i can say that much. Now i would not have Lewis in the greatest of all time but if you don't have Lewis in the top 10 heavy then you don't know shit. Also Bowie wanted nothing to do with Lewis don't know why his name even coming up in this thread, with Lewis resume and beating every man put in front of him he deserves alot more then what people are giving him.

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Not from me he isn't. I have no hate toward Lewis at all, i just believe him to be over rated and not a top 10 all time great heavyweight Champion. Reading your reply does remind me a lot of how Lewis must have felt after being hit by Hasim Rahman! :o

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

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Originally Posted by erics44

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Originally Posted by Althugz

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Originally Posted by erics44

9 times out of 10 Lennox Lewis would have beaten Ali

it might be hard to swallow because of the fairy tales of Ali but its true

id put lewis in the top 2 or 3 HWs of all time

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I don't know about 9 out of 10 times - I can picture them being pretty even like the Frazier fights (obviously in a different way because of the differing styles).

I know it's a cop-out answer but I'd still put Ali as the greatest just for everything he achieved in and out of the boxing ring. It's very rare that you get a superstar who is the absolute best at his sport, fights everybody put in front of him, has a chin, has the skills and has the charisma/worldwide appeal that Ali had. You just can't touch that.

In terms of pure boxing, Ali in his prime gives every heavyweight in history a run for their money imho..But styles make fights.

As far as Lewis, he was very under-appreciated while boxing. Another case of "missed when he was gone. I'd put him within the top 5 heavy's of all time.

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if someone asked me who was the greatest hw of all time I could answer Ali because of his charisma and what he achieved outside the ring

hes not the greatest hw boxer of all time, he would have lost to a number of others most of the time

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same can be said about Lewis, a small Oliver McCall was able to spark him in a round, so what tells you that Joe Frazier wouldn't be able to follow suit?

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yep that did happen but i dont think you can sum up Lewis' career on that performance

999 times out of 1000 lewis would beat McCall

about the same ratio with frazier

I would go as far to say that Frazier is the most over rated HW of all time

I think sportmen of 2010's are generally better trained, more healthy, stronger, bigger, faster, have better technic, etc than those of 1960's, 1970's, 1980's. Besides in internet world teams behind boxers have much more knowledge about weakness and strongness of boxers. Knowledge of boxing is now better than ever before - even in times of Lenox Lewis. That's why there many things support this list of all time best heavyweight champions:

1. Vitali Klitschko
2. Wladimir Klitschko
3. Lenox Lewis
4. Mike Tyson
5. Muhammad Ali
6. Larry Holmes
7. George Foreman
8. Joe Frazier
9. Sonny Liston
10. Rocky Marciano or Joe Louis

You can think about it by comparing athletics like Carl Lewis vs. Usain Bolt, Jim Hines vs. Carl Lewis or Bekele vs. Lasse Viren (Emil Zatopek vs. Paavo Nurmi). The problem is that we tend to appreciate too much these old time heroes with no critic at all.

On the other hand i have to say that Joe Louis in his time and Muhammad Ali in his time were surely showing much more skill and technic than any of their rivals at the same time of before. It's not their fault if knowledge of boxing, know how, is now much more better. It's just unfair to compare Muhammad Ali to Vitali Klitschko just as computer of 1950's to supercomputer of our time.

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Originally Posted by Matias64

I think sportmen of 2010's are generally better trained, more healthy, stronger, bigger, faster, have better technic, etc than those of 1960's, 1970's, 1980's. Besides in internet world teams behind boxers have much more knowledge about weakness and strongness of boxers. Knowledge of boxing is now better than ever before - even in times of Lenox Lewis. That's why there many things support this list of all time best heavyweight champions:

1. Vitali Klitschko
2. Wladimir Klitschko
3. Lenox Lewis
4. Mike Tyson
5. Muhammad Ali
6. Larry Holmes
7. George Foreman
8. Joe Frazier
9. Sonny Liston
10. Rocky Marciano or Joe Louis

You can think about it by comparing athletics like Carl Lewis vs. Usain Bolt, Jim Hines vs. Carl Lewis or Bekele vs. Lasse Viren (Emil Zatopek vs. Paavo Nurmi). The problem is that we tend to appreciate too much these old time heroes with no critic at all.

On the other hand i have to say that Joe Louis in his time and Muhammad Ali in his time were surely showing much more skill and technic than any of their rivals at the same time of before. It's not their fault if knowledge of boxing, know how, is now much more better. It's just unfair to compare Muhammad Ali to Vitali Klitschko just as computer of 1950's to supercomputer of our time.

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good post mate, hits the nail on the head

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Originally Posted by Dark Lord Al

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Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust

yes he certainly completed dominated Tua, boring as all hell as it was; but he couldnt really seriously hurt or let alone finish him. Tua fought un-gallantly and hardly took risks to press Lewis. My point is if a pressure fighter like Frazier or Tyson really pressed Lewis, good chins that they had of iron practically, and willing to take a few to give a few, how well would Lewis have dealt with 1988 Tyson? I dont know, Im just wondering what others think.

As for 1965 Clay being guff, well, listen, that dude WAS magic in that year, as in '66, '67 as well.

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Bob Hayes was olimpic 100 m champion in 1964 , you think he would hold up against Usain Bolt ?
Clay was a top fighter but its ridiculous to think he would have beaten all of todays massive HW'S , the guy was out fought by glass jawed Ken Norton.
No way in hell he beats Lewis best of 3 , sorry i just dont buy the living in the past bullshit, yes some old time fighters who have to make weight could beat todays fighters of the same weight , but im sorry clay was a pup compared to Hw's like Lewis.

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What a load of shit. A very old George Foreman who Ali KO'd in his absolute peak came back and won THE HW title in Lennox Lewis' era. Evander Holyfield was smaller than Ali and past his prime and still gave Lewis serious problems in the second fight. Ali would be champ in any era without doubt.

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Originally Posted by Matias64

I think sportmen of 2010's are generally better trained, more healthy, stronger, bigger, faster, have better technic, etc than those of 1960's, 1970's, 1980's. Besides in internet world teams behind boxers have much more knowledge about weakness and strongness of boxers. Knowledge of boxing is now better than ever before - even in times of Lenox Lewis. That's why there many things support this list of all time best heavyweight champions:

1. Vitali Klitschko
2. Wladimir Klitschko
3. Lenox Lewis
4. Mike Tyson
5. Muhammad Ali
6. Larry Holmes
7. George Foreman
8. Joe Frazier
9. Sonny Liston
10. Rocky Marciano or Joe Louis

You can think about it by comparing athletics like Carl Lewis vs. Usain Bolt, Jim Hines vs. Carl Lewis or Bekele vs. Lasse Viren (Emil Zatopek vs. Paavo Nurmi). The problem is that we tend to appreciate too much these old time heroes with no critic at all.

On the other hand i have to say that Joe Louis in his time and Muhammad Ali in his time were surely showing much more skill and technic than any of their rivals at the same time of before. It's not their fault if knowledge of boxing, know how, is now much more better. It's just unfair to compare Muhammad Ali to Vitali Klitschko just as computer of 1950's to supercomputer of our time.

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A lot of truth in this. What would be interesting is how the likes of Ali would've done if they did have the benefits of today that you describe.

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Originally Posted by Matias64

I think sportmen of 2010's are generally better trained, more healthy, stronger, bigger, faster, have better technic, etc than those of 1960's, 1970's, 1980's. Besides in internet world teams behind boxers have much more knowledge about weakness and strongness of boxers. Knowledge of boxing is now better than ever before - even in times of Lenox Lewis. That's why there many things support this list of all time best heavyweight champions:

1. Vitali Klitschko
2. Wladimir Klitschko
3. Lenox Lewis
4. Mike Tyson
5. Muhammad Ali
6. Larry Holmes
7. George Foreman
8. Joe Frazier
9. Sonny Liston
10. Rocky Marciano or Joe Louis

You can think about it by comparing athletics like Carl Lewis vs. Usain Bolt, Jim Hines vs. Carl Lewis or Bekele vs. Lasse Viren (Emil Zatopek vs. Paavo Nurmi). The problem is that we tend to appreciate too much these old time heroes with no critic at all.

On the other hand i have to say that Joe Louis in his time and Muhammad Ali in his time were surely showing much more skill and technic than any of their rivals at the same time of before. It's not their fault if knowledge of boxing, know how, is now much more better. It's just unfair to compare Muhammad Ali to Vitali Klitschko just as computer of 1950's to supercomputer of our time.

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But someone like Vitali Klitschko is slower and robotic, and is nowhere near as athletic as the great Heavyweight's of the past. So i don't really understand your point.

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Originally Posted by rjj tszyu

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Originally Posted by Dark Lord Al

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Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust

yes he certainly completed dominated Tua, boring as all hell as it was; but he couldnt really seriously hurt or let alone finish him. Tua fought un-gallantly and hardly took risks to press Lewis. My point is if a pressure fighter like Frazier or Tyson really pressed Lewis, good chins that they had of iron practically, and willing to take a few to give a few, how well would Lewis have dealt with 1988 Tyson? I dont know, Im just wondering what others think.

As for 1965 Clay being guff, well, listen, that dude WAS magic in that year, as in '66, '67 as well.

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Bob Hayes was olimpic 100 m champion in 1964 , you think he would hold up against Usain Bolt ?
Clay was a top fighter but its ridiculous to think he would have beaten all of todays massive HW'S , the guy was out fought by glass jawed Ken Norton.
No way in hell he beats Lewis best of 3 , sorry i just dont buy the living in the past bullshit, yes some old time fighters who have to make weight could beat todays fighters of the same weight , but im sorry clay was a pup compared to Hw's like Lewis.

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What a load of shit. A very old George Foreman who Ali KO'd in his absolute peak came back and won THE HW title in Lennox Lewis' era. Evander Holyfield was smaller than Ali and past his prime and still gave Lewis serious problems in the second fight. Ali would be champ in any era without doubt.

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#no way , a guy who cant ko Ken Norton , isnt beating Lewis , i think the brothers grim would also fair well against so called greats of the past.
This isnt like comparing Ray Robinson to Hagler at 160 lbs , we are talking massive weight differences.

Top 5 behind Ali, Loius, Holmes and Tyson:p