I respect Wards credentials too much give give Dawson A real shot. Dawson is not good on the clinch and Ward is a gold medalist @LightHeavy
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I respect Wards credentials too much give give Dawson A real shot. Dawson is not good on the clinch and Ward is a gold medalist @LightHeavy
I think it would turn out somewhat like the Hopkins fight. Maybe easier for Dawson as Ward will work more.
Dawson still has the better resume at this point
Wouldn't mind seeing the fight, but Dawson needs to fight the Cloud/ Pascal winner & Ward needs to face Bute, then this fight can happen
Good fights either way
Well we know he won't be fighting Ismayal Silakh lol
I'd like to see Dawson give Campillo a shot. That would be a hell of a fight.
I saw ward beats Dawson on points and froch would stop Dawson as Dawson is not very mobile
Did this all happen in a dream.;DQuote:
Originally Posted by Dropanuke
Reality
How was Mr Froch this morning did you serve him a nice soft boiled egg.;DQuote:
Originally Posted by Dropanuke
I have wanted this fight to happen since Ward won the Super 6 and I've favored Dawson the whole time, but it's a close fight -- the closest fight either of those guys is going to get.
Dawson is bigger, faster, and more powerful than Ward. Ward knows more tricks, is dirtier, and is better inside. Sound familiar?
That Froch comment from dropanuke is the dumbest thing someone other than eric has said here in a long time.
Dawson is timid look @ how he fought pascal good boxing but ward is a different type.
Ward takes this for me, he's got more drive or whatever you want to call it. Even in the hop fight dawson was content with doing barely enough to win, ward wouldn't let him win that way...dawson is talented but to me his style looks stuck between two worlds always, defense/offense never seamlessly blending the two together...
Ward would upset Dawson (mental) I think.
It's a fight for fans of the sweet science, but it won't be a fun fight to watch for the casual fan that is looking for more of a dust up. Of course, I'm hype on the prospect of it happening. ;D
I like Ward, with the caveat that I want to see him at 175 first before I officially make an endorsement. I understand Dawson offered to drop down in weight, but the fight should be at 175. By the way, I respect the hell out of Dawson for calling Ward out too.
Ward is fully capable of using dirty tactics like Hopkins, but he's a smart boxer too. I think aside from reach Ward has all the advantages. I think Ward would win this pretty easily and people would be complaining about it being a garbage fight. The key words after the fight would be as follows
Dirty
Clinching
Headbutts
Dominated
Ward definitely has some serious advantages in certain ways (heart/drive being the most important, as others have pointed out). But it's not just reach for Dawson. He is definitely faster than Ward and he definitely hits harder. I also think his defense is better (though very different in style). They both have excellent balance and footwork.Quote:
Originally Posted by killersheep
Ward has a better resume than Dawson and I really believe Ward is not appreciated enough. Ward should clean out super middle by beating Bute and maybe Direll and then move up to light heavy.
Not sure I agree with that at all -- only if you rated Carl Froch highly (I didn't). The Kessler win is Ward's best. Dawson has wins over Adamek, Tarver (2x), a still-very-good version of Glen Johnson (2x), and now Hopkins.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
I'm not saying definitively that Dawson is *better* than Ward; but I really don't think Ward has a better resume. (That's fine, he's younger.)
Dawson has lost to Pascal who has been owned by Hopkins twice.Quote:
Originally Posted by shzaNot sure I agree with that at all -- only if you rated Carl Froch highly (I didn't). The Kessler win is Ward's best. Dawson has wins over Adamek, Tarver (2x), a still-very-good version of Glen Johnson (2x), and now Hopkins.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
I'm not saying definitively that Dawson is *better* than Ward; but I really don't think Ward has a better resume. (That's fine, he's younger.)
That is true. He had no business losing that fight but he did. I still think he has more significant wins than Ward though.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterDawson has lost to Pascal who has been owned by Hopkins twice.Quote:
Originally Posted by shzaNot sure I agree with that at all -- only if you rated Carl Froch highly (I didn't). The Kessler win is Ward's best. Dawson has wins over Adamek, Tarver (2x), a still-very-good version of Glen Johnson (2x), and now Hopkins.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
I'm not saying definitively that Dawson is *better* than Ward; but I really don't think Ward has a better resume. (That's fine, he's younger.)
WARD - last 5 fights
12-17-11: UD over Carl Froch 12 pt margin
5-14-11: UD over Arthur Abraham 27 pt margin
11-27-10: UD over Sakio Bika 28 pt margin
6-19-10: UD over Allen Green 36 pt margin
11-19-09: TD over Mikkel Kessler 16 pt margin
====================
Dawson - last 5 fights
4-28-12: MD over Bernard Hopkins 12 pt margin
10-15-11: NC vs. Bernard Hopkins
5-21-11: UD over Adrian Diaconu 18 pt margin
8-14-10: TD Loss to Jean Pascal -13 pt margin
11-7-09: UD over Glen Johnson 10 pt margin
Ward's resume is much better AND his style makes him look the clear victor to judges in these situations, I think BCD is a fantastically skilled pure boxer, but his style is all wrong for this fight.
I really don't get where you guys are coming from with this "much better resume" line. Abraham and Green aren't even legitimate contenders. Even Diaconu is a better win than any of the Ward wins except Kessler and Froch. If you want to hang it on the loss to Pascal, I can respect that but I don't see it any other way.Quote:
Originally Posted by killersheep
Ward just won the Super 6 (aside from Bute) it was the best 168 had to offer at the time, he came out on top.Quote:
Originally Posted by shzaI really don't get where you guys are coming from with this "much better resume" line. Abraham and Green aren't even legitimate contenders. Even Diaconu is a better win than any of the Ward wins except Kessler and Froch. If you want to hang it on the loss to Pascal, I can respect that but I don't see it any other way.Quote:
Originally Posted by killersheep
Dawson has been fighting old men, old men with big names, but old men none the less. Diaconu had potential, but Pascal beat him. I'm not saying Dawson hasn't taken risks, because he has and it's not like his resume is bad. Ward has cleared his division except for Bute (which is the fight I want to see). Dawson NEEDS to avenge his loss against Pascal, that win will put him ahead of Ward.
If you were to be asked of Dawson's qualities in the ring what would you say?
Same can be asked of Ward.
Their speed is comparable but ward control distance with angles and footwork rather than a jab (not a good or bad thing, it’s just how he does it) where as Chad does it with a stiff right handed jab.
Power would naturally be in Chads favour as he is the bigger man and fought at LHW for I believe his entire career.
To me the only important factor is technique. I've never seen Chad fight on the inside. Ward lived there against Green, I never seen Chad make opponents be forced to resort to popping a single shot, with ward I have. To be fair Chad is a fantastic boxer but I seen him become very uncomfortable in fights were as with Ward...well he reminds me of a younger Hopkins in most aspects.
Although it would be great to see champions fighting each other; the fight itself doesn't really appeal to me.
NO! Damnit Dawson, fight Cloud you S.O.B!!! I don't want to see any more Dawson vs a cagey boxer, I'm over it.
How difficult would it be to get through Ward-Hopkins....Jesus, where's my gun?
I get the impression that you believe Cloud will give Dawson a tougher fight than Ward?Quote:
Originally Posted by El Kabong
Dawson needs to make some noise as a fighter and there is no bigger fight for him than beating Ward. However I cannot see him beat Ward at super middle, and Ward would probably lose at light heavy at this stage to Dawson. Either way Dawson needs the fight more than Ward.
Not to speak for Lyle, but I believe it's mostly because he is a HUGE Cloud supporter.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterI get the impression that you believe Cloud will give Dawson a tougher fight than Ward?Quote:
Originally Posted by El Kabong
Cloud ahould be giving Campillo a rematch before calling out anyone. But he'll lose to Pascal anyway. He's just not that good (and he CLEARLY lost his last fight(.Quote:
Originally Posted by El Kabong
If you want a tough brawl type of fight though, Pascal versus Cloud fits the bill in my opinion. Frankly, Chad Dawson should face the winner and clear up any debate as to who the top dog is at 175, although I understand facing Ward may make the most sense from a monetary point of view.Quote:
Originally Posted by shzaCloud ahould be giving Campillo a rematch before calling out anyone. But he'll lose to Pascal anyway. He's just not that good (and he CLEARLY lost his last fight(.Quote:
Originally Posted by El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by RantcatratIf you want a tough brawl type of fight though, Pascal versus Cloud fits the bill in my opinion. Frankly, Chad Dawson should face the winner and clear up any debate as to who the top dog is at 175, although I understand facing Ward may make the most sense from a monetary point of view.Quote:
Originally Posted by shzaCloud ahould be giving Campillo a rematch before calling out anyone. But he'll lose to Pascal anyway. He's just not that good (and he CLEARLY lost his last fight(.Quote:
Originally Posted by El Kabong
Agreed Dawson should fight the Cloud/ Pascal winner
Ward/ Dawson doesn't strike me as a fan friendly fight:-\
#1 Cloud has been waiting for fucking ever....that's the ONLY reason he ever fought Campillo. So if Cloud can wait then Campillo can wait.Quote:
Originally Posted by shza
#2 Cloud will KO Pascal who IMO isn't strong enough to fight in the style he does and Cloud will whup him like a little child. Cloud went toe to toe with Johnson who is still tougher than Pascal.
And yes everyone, I think Chad Dawson is beatable and the faster he fights Tavoris Cloud the sooner you'll see it. Chad Dawson doesn't use his height and reach to his advantage, he's lanky but would rather fight in close, shoulder to shoulder with someone than use distance (which is why he never KO's anybody). Cloud loves to put the pressure on fighters and he loads up on his punches....I still question Dawson's chin and hell he lost to Pascal and looked bad doing it so of course a fighter that's better using that style would be harder for Dawsone to beat.
How did this turn into a Cloud thread?
...because fuck you that's how! ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by killersheep
Lyle what did you mean by Cloud being "better using that style", than Pascal? Pascal beat Dawson by picking his spots and flurrying on the inside then getting out of range in time, he really disrupted Dawsons footwork and didn't let him get into rhythm. Cloud couldn't do this at all because he has slow hands and feet, which I think will be very clear when he fights Pascal.
Better record, more knockouts....just saying Thunder Cloud man.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
You are doing it again putting yourself into a corner. Cloud may not be worth all this support. You are like the poster Finito is with Kevin Mitchell.Quote:
Originally Posted by El KabongBetter record, more knockouts....just saying Thunder Cloud man.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Hah, yeah right. Do you know Cloud personally or something? Dawson has no reason to even worry about that plodder for now, if he beats Pascal(he won't) then maybe that's worth looking at but Ward is still a much better fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by El KabongBetter record, more knockouts....just saying Thunder Cloud man.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
I think Showtime has rejected this fight!
Sounds like a competitive fight but would not attract many fans. They are both well known for stinking up fights and this could be a dull one. Saying that they are both at the top and would be the right fight to make.
However I would not mind seeing a Ward vs Martines fight. I know one of them would have to move up or down a weight bet they are both at the top of there devisions and there are not many people in there devisions that have a chance against them.
Good fight but would edge towards Ward winning with his awkward style.