Enzo Maccarinelli handed six month drugs ban

The latest boxer to be busted. Enzo Mac handed a 6 month ban for testing positive. Obviously a boxer who is well, well, well on the slide but another former "World" champion none the less.

So...Larry get's 4 years...Enzo gets 6 months.. :rolleyes:

Sure, you can find what he took in over-the-counter supplements (like Jack3d and HemoRage) but surely a banned substance on their list is a banned substance and should receive the same punishment? It again, also proves the point about the area of PED's being such a grey area. It's banned in competition but ok for the average Joe to use?

BBC Sport - Enzo Maccarinelli handed six month drugs ban

So much variation..doesnt make sense. They should ban all drug users for ten years.

There is a big diffrence between something found in a nasal spray and admitting to taken 13 different substances over a 6 year period including anobolic steriods and human growth hormone. Enzo has taken over 20 drug tests over his career , he bought something out of a magazine which was legal is only crime was not checking the ingredients . Larry was taken banned substances which he knew what they were and the damage they could do to his opponents. There is a big diffrence between the two cases and only an idiot would compare them.

He will take it on the chin,:p

Total transparency is the only way to go. You take anything on this list, your gone for X amount of time. There cant be different levels of taking the piss, you either are or you aren't. I didnt know isn't good enough.

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Originally Posted by Trecco bay

There is a big diffrence between something found in a nasal spray and admitting to taken 13 different substances over a 6 year period including anobolic steriods and human growth hormone. Enzo has taken over 20 drug tests over his career , he bought something out of a magazine which was legal is only crime was not checking the ingredients . Larry was taken banned substances which he knew what they were and the damage they could do to his opponents. There is a big diffrence between the two cases and only an idiot would compare them.

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View Profile: Althugz - Boxing Forums

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Originally Posted by Trecco bay

There is a big diffrence between something found in a nasal spray and admitting to taken 13 different substances over a 6 year period including anobolic steriods and human growth hormone. Enzo has taken over 20 drug tests over his career , he bought something out of a magazine which was legal is only crime was not checking the ingredients . Larry was taken banned substances which he knew what they were and the damage they could do to his opponents. There is a big diffrence between the two cases and only an idiot would compare them.

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Complete bollocks. You take something on the banned substance list and you're gone should be the rule. Otherwise you can come up with an excuse for every day of the week as to "why" you took it. Larry was only caught for taking one thing on that list too. You're clueless.

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Originally Posted by Trecco bay

Enzo has taken over 20 drug tests over his career , he bought something out of a magazine which was legal is only crime was not checking the ingredients .

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For that reason...... I'm out!

Sorry, I mean I've got no sympathy.

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Originally Posted by Memphis

Total transparency is the only way to go. You take anything on this list, your gone for X amount of time. There cant be different levels of taking the piss, you either are or you aren't. I didnt know isn't good enough.

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Exactly - Someone who gets it.

Imagine if our Justice system operated in the same way... :rolleyes:

You're saying that PEDs are a 'grey area', but you want black and white punishment? ???

From what I've heard the packaging didn't even stipulate that it contained this PED. If it's over the counter and doesn't say on the container that it contains a PED surely the company that supplies it should be sued and the fighter should be excused after he has sat out whilst his body clears itself of the drug?

Then more fool him for buying his suppliments from Londis ;D

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Originally Posted by AdamGB

Imagine if our Justice system operated in the same way... :rolleyes:

You're saying that PEDs are a 'grey area', but you want black and white punishment? ???

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Did you seriously just display your idiocy by comparing our justice system with boxing providing a list of PED's that you are NOT allowed to take? It's not like Larry commited murder and Enzo got shifted for nicking penny sweets. BOTH took something that enhances performance :rolleyes: Christ, some people on here..:vd:

The LIST isn't a grey area. It's printed in black and white what you can and can't take. It's up to the athlete to check those ingredients.

The grey area I'm talking about is how the public are quick to label one person a "cheat" but then it seems most of you are ok with the PED being in an over the counter supplement?? Most of you are hypocrites - Larry got caught for EPO which provides more oxygen in a fight, Enzo's PED is a weight loss agent and a stimulant which gives you more energy and tunnel vision focus...If anything, Enzo got a double benefit.

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Originally Posted by rjj tszyu

From what I've heard the packaging didn't even stipulate that it contained this PED. If it's over the counter and doesn't say on the container that it contains a PED surely the company that supplies it should be sued and the fighter should be excused after he has sat out whilst his body clears itself of the drug?

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The ingredients will always stipulate what is contained in the supplement, buddy.

Why did larry admit to taking 13 different substances over 4 years ?

Uk anti doping said their investigation into olubamiwo had emerged from intelligence provided by the us drug enforcement administration relating into the trafficking of anabolic steriods, human growth hormone and insulin growth factor .
Uk anti doping chief executive andy Parkinson's said " this is an extreme example of someone who has engaged in an intentional and uncompromising doping program over a sustained period with little regard for his own health , the reputation of the sport he competed in or his fellow competitors .

A bit different by being caught with a bit of epo , I suggest althugz gets a bit more clued up before he starts sticking up for poor larry who everyone's picking on.

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Originally Posted by Trecco bay

Uk anti doping said their investigation into olubamiwo had emerged from intelligence provided by the us drug enforcement administration relating into the trafficking of anabolic steriods, human growth hormone and insulin growth factor .
Uk anti doping chief executive andy Parkinson's said " this is an extreme example of someone who has engaged in an intentional and uncompromising doping program over a sustained period with little regard for his own health , the reputation of the sport he competed in or his fellow competitors .

A bit different by being caught with a bit of epo , I suggest althugz gets a bit more clued up before he starts sticking up for poor larry who everyone's picking on.

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Haha, you told me to get a clue AFTER you asked me why Larry admitted to taking 13 different PED's?
I see we have another "Google expert" on our hands.. :rolleyes:
and Larry did only get caught using EPO..they sprung a test on him due to this intelligence. There was never any proof that he had taken anything that he had ordered beyond the EPO which he tested positive for. I guess UKAD put him in a position where it was more beneficial for him to confess.

It's like saying he murdered someone a lot where as Enzo murdered somebody a little bit..it's DUMB.

It's a bit like Enzo having enough cannabis to roll a joint , and larry importing large quantities of cannabis and then when caught says it's for personnel use rather than being charged with supplying

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Originally Posted by Trecco bay

It's a bit like Enzo having enough cannabis to roll a joint , and larry importing large quantities of cannabis and then when caught says it's for personnel use rather than being charged with supplying

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How does your shitty analagy relate to BOTH of them each being on a SINGLE performance enhancer whilst fighting? :vd:

Honestly, it's ok..I give up..you win. Indulging you is hurting my head..:eek:

Just trying to get through to you why Enzo gets a 6 nth ban and poor persecuted larry gets 4 years , the bbbc didn't just sit down and said we don't like larry let's give him 4 years , there was a lot more to it than that .

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Originally Posted by Althugz

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Originally Posted by rjj tszyu

From what I've heard the packaging didn't even stipulate that it contained this PED. If it's over the counter and doesn't say on the container that it contains a PED surely the company that supplies it should be sued and the fighter should be excused after he has sat out whilst his body clears itself of the drug?

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The ingredients will always stipulate what is contained in the supplement, buddy.

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Apparently this one didn't!

Maccarinelli comments on positive doping test

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Originally Posted by Althugz

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Originally Posted by rjj tszyu

From what I've heard the packaging didn't even stipulate that it contained this PED. If it's over the counter and doesn't say on the container that it contains a PED surely the company that supplies it should be sued and the fighter should be excused after he has sat out whilst his body clears itself of the drug?

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The ingredients will always stipulate what is contained in the supplement, buddy.

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Nope.

If you knew half as much as you are trying to let on you would know just how much shit the term 'propiatery blend' can cover... You'd also know that it us not unheard of for suppliment companies to change or lie about what is in a product.

Why do you think Jack3D is constantly being pulled? It's just been banned AGAIN for featuring an ingredient which was claimed to be derived from a geranium, but was actually a synthetic featured on several ban lists.

Can I just ask... Did you seriously just compare something found in most preworkout formulas to fucking EPO?!?

I mean, I know you're mates or a big fan of larry's or some shit... but, really?! :vd:

Was claiming that anabolic steroids wouldn't aid in his power development because they 'don't make you grow more fast twitch muscle cells' (hint: nothing makes you 'grow more' cells. It's a physiological impossibility!...) not enough? :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by AdamGB

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Originally Posted by Althugz

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Originally Posted by rjj tszyu

From what I've heard the packaging didn't even stipulate that it contained this PED. If it's over the counter and doesn't say on the container that it contains a PED surely the company that supplies it should be sued and the fighter should be excused after he has sat out whilst his body clears itself of the drug?

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The ingredients will always stipulate what is contained in the supplement, buddy.

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Nope.

If you knew half as much as you are trying to let on you would know just how much shit the term 'propiatery blend' can cover... You'd also know that it us not unheard of for suppliment companies to change or lie about what is in a product.

Why do you think Jack3D is constantly being pulled? It's just been banned AGAIN for featuring an ingredient which was claimed to be derived from a geranium, but was actually a synthetic featured on several ban lists.

Can I just ask... Did you seriously just compare something found in most preworkout formulas to fucking EPO?!?

I mean, I know you're mates or a big fan of larry's or some shit... but, really?! :vd:

Was claiming that anabolic steroids wouldn't aid in his power development because they 'don't make you grow more fast twitch muscle cells' (hint: nothing makes you 'grow more' cells. It's a physiological impossibility!...) not enough? :rolleyes:

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:vd: You are seriously dumb beyond words..honestly, you lower my IQ everytime I respond to your complete and utter nonsense..The scary part is how much confidence you have in your stupidity.

Listen...read slowly..

Who decides whether methylhexaneamine is worse than EPO?? You?? Of course not, you dumb shit. So how can you then turn around and say "OMG OMG you're comparing an over the counter supplement to something that's banned".

Do you even know the law when it comes to what can be promoted as an over the counter supplement and something that's banned? No, you don't. It's as simple as bringing something out that has NO MEDICAL USAGE. If something has no medical usage it can be sold over the counter until complaints are made and the long process to ban it has been completed/proven.

For example, when prohormones were banned, they used this loophole to bring out a supplement called M1T which was a STEROID. They called it a "pro-steroid" and it was sold over the counter. It had zero medical use because they created it in a lab. Oh but because it was an over the counter supplement, in your infinite wisdom, it wouldn't have been as bad as things on the banned list..even though it was probably far more effective than most things on there.

NOW do you see the grey area that I'm talking about??

They eventually got it banned. Tons of stuff on the banned list were over the counter supplements at one point you absolute goof! :vd: Ephedrine, pro-hormones (which are steroids) and probably soon to be, methylhexaneamine which is found in Jack3d and HemoRage. I assume Enzo used one of those two.

It actually pains me that you can be this dumb and be so cock-sure about it.

If this post, born out of your stupidity has at least educated some of the forum posters about the huge grey area and contradiction that is the supplement industry, then you will have at least served some purpose.

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Originally Posted by AdamGB

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Originally Posted by Althugz

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Originally Posted by rjj tszyu

From what I've heard the packaging didn't even stipulate that it contained this PED. If it's over the counter and doesn't say on the container that it contains a PED surely the company that supplies it should be sued and the fighter should be excused after he has sat out whilst his body clears itself of the drug?

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The ingredients will always stipulate what is contained in the supplement, buddy.

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Nope.

If you knew half as much as you are trying to let on you would know just how much shit the term 'propiatery blend' can cover... You'd also know that it us not unheard of for suppliment companies to change or lie about what is in a product.

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Propietary blends still list ingredients you div - Just not the exact quantities they are listing in. I really hope that nobody is taking notice of your shit. This is, unfortunately, how misinformation spreads.

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Originally Posted by rjj tszyu

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Originally Posted by Althugz

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Originally Posted by rjj tszyu

From what I've heard the packaging didn't even stipulate that it contained this PED. If it's over the counter and doesn't say on the container that it contains a PED surely the company that supplies it should be sued and the fighter should be excused after he has sat out whilst his body clears itself of the drug?

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The ingredients will always stipulate what is contained in the supplement, buddy.

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Apparently this one didn't!

Maccarinelli comments on positive doping test

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DO NOT listen to Adam on this matter Rjj...I assure you he knows SHIT about the topic.

"The advert stated that it was an approved substance and I checked the ingredients which had no reference to any banned substance that I was aware of."

Those are the key words. Isn't that the excuse every athlete uses? Look, I know on the back of both products that contain this stuff, the ingredient is listed on the back. If athletes are so unsure, then they need someone in camp who knows this stuff. Being naive shouldn't be an excuse for taking something that's banned if that's the rules the UKAD are implementing.

He used and should be given the same punishment..IMO of course.

The product Enzo used is called dexaprine , and it states that it can be used by athletes and doesn't mention any banned substances , Enzo even gave it to the bbbofc to analyse it, it was just an honest mistake

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Originally Posted by Trecco bay

The product Enzo used is called dexaprine , and it states that it can be used by athletes and doesn't mention any banned substances , Enzo even gave it to the bbbofc to analyse it, it was just an honest mistake

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Plain as day, my friend - 1,3-Dimethylphenylamine

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Ingredients:

Dexaprine Tri-Phase Ignition System:
650 mg ** Thermogenic Amine Mood Enhancement Complex:
Citrus Aurantium (30% Active Amines), 1,3-Dimethylphenylamine
** Extended Release Energy Complex:
Caffeine Anhydrous, Theophylline
** Anabolic Protein Synthesis Enhancing Complex:
3,3 Diiodo L Thyronine (200 mcg), 3,5 Diiodo L Thyronine (100 mcg)

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SPOT THE DIFFERENCEBOXER 1

"I had to make money and the mind-frame I was in at the time dictated my actions....
In the past I saw idols of mine being found guilty of using performance enhancing drugs, the likes of Shane Mosley, Evander Holyfield and James Toney (twice) and upon seeing the punishments they were handed, I thought that I could do the same and be unlikely to get caught or receive the same punishment "

“Yes I had been doping for six years but for most of you guys to think my opponents were not because of their physiques is quite ridiculous. Although I will not mention any names the majority of the boxers you all love so dear are on the stuff, fact and this is from me talking to them, seeing them buy the stuff or talking to their training personnel. Cheating is when you are the only person doing something and since I know that I wasn’t the only person doing it, it can’t be defined as cheating.
“A large minority if not majority of boxers are doping and the naivety of the public to think that mine is an isolated case is staggering. Also I am surprised I get so much stick but the guys I look up to in the sport like Roy Jones, Shane Mosley and James Toney who have all been caught don’t get as much stick.”

BOXER 2

"I have been tested over 20 times in my career and have never failed any random or post-fight doping test, but on this occasion, due to my naivety, I have tested positive for a banned substance.I am very conscious of my reputation within the sport of boxing and even prior to the decision, that has been released, I promised to fully accept any punishment that was given as a result of this positive test,...Furthermore, I voluntarily vacated ......... to allow my opponent, ......., the opportunity to re-challenge for it whilst I serve my suspension, as I could not bear the thought of holding such a prestigious championship if anyone thought that I hadn't won it fairly."

Whilst their attitudes pre and post are clearly polar opposites they both got caught taking something they shouldnt.

Whether they knew about it or not is a mute point as far as Im concerned.

Naivety isnt an excuse.

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Originally Posted by Memphis

Whilst their attitudes pre and post are clearly polar opposites they both got caught taking something they shouldnt.

Whether they knew about it or not is a mute point as far as Im concerned.

Naivety isnt an excuse.

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You are quite correct it is no excuse. The fact remains though each case is clearly different and should be judged accordingly.

In a way I see Enzo as being more stupid than Larry. Larry didnt give a shit, Enzo apparently did and still fucked up

If your job is dependant on you having a driving license and you a) Have a bottle of vodka on the go in your van/cab b) have a few pints the night before and get pinged in the morning your still just as much sacked.

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Originally Posted by Memphis

In a way I see Enzo as being more stupid than Larry. Larry didnt give a shit, Enzo apparently did and still fucked up

If your job is dependant on you having a driving license and you a) Have a bottle of vodka on the go in your van/cab b) have a few pints the night before and get pinged in the morning your still just as much sacked.

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Exactly

I feel that people are missing the point here. I'm not comparing their attitudes on the matter. Yes, their attitudes are clearly different. It's totally obvious that Enzo was naive to the matter..I do actually believe him. Whether I'm right or wrong to do so..

BUT, you let Enzo off the hook, then you set the precedent. 6 Months? That punishment might be worth it to some boxers who now have a "cut and paste" naiveity excuse should they be caught on ANYTHING.

I'm dealing in facts here.

End of the day, BOTH fighters were on PED's against their opponent. I know that many of you feel that this endagers the opponent so why is Enzo's naiveity ok? Facts are, he took what he took and gained an "unfair" advantage. As Memphis said, naivety is no excuse. If his opponent had died and then he tested positive and cited that it was "an accident", I guarantee you'd be singing different tunes. (Not that I believe there is anymore risk of fatal injury by somebody being on something - Too many variables to make that assertion)

6 months out wont disrupt Enzo's career one bit will it? Its almost pointless banning him.

For what its worth I also buy what Enzo is saying. Doesnt change anything though Im afraid.

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Originally Posted by Memphis

6 months out wont disrupt Enzo's career one bit will it? Its almost pointless banning him.

For what its worth I also buy what Enzo is saying. Doesnt change anything though Im afraid.

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Totally - He'll be in training camp for the last 3-4 months of his ban and it's practically the amount of time off modern fighters take anyway.

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Originally Posted by Memphis

In a way I see Enzo as being more stupid than Larry. Larry didnt give a shit, Enzo apparently did and still fucked up

If your job is dependant on you having a driving license and you a) Have a bottle of vodka on the go in your van/cab b) have a few pints the night before and get pinged in the morning your still just as much sacked.

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You haven't carried your analogy through to it's logical conclusion though. If the authorities (in this case the Police) caught you over the drink drive limit, the punishment (in this case the length of driving ban and possible imprisonment) handed out by the Magistrate would be entirely different dependent on the amount of alcohol consumed, whether you were aware of being over the limit,the amount of times you subsequently admitted to doing so, and many other extenuating circumstances. When it comes to driving, Alcohol is not a performance enhancing drug though, so the example does not really fit.

The two distinct punishments may seem entirely arbitrary until you take into account the fact that if Larry were to be given 6 months for each admitted breach he would soon tot up a sentence of 6 and a half years. Instead, despite the fact that he admitted cheating for 6 year,s he was only given a four year ban. With a BSc in Pharmaceutical chemistry he could hardly claim ignorance.

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Originally Posted by Althugz

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Originally Posted by AdamGB

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Originally Posted by Althugz

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Originally Posted by rjj tszyu

From what I've heard the packaging didn't even stipulate that it contained this PED. If it's over the counter and doesn't say on the container that it contains a PED surely the company that supplies it should be sued and the fighter should be excused after he has sat out whilst his body clears itself of the drug?

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The ingredients will always stipulate what is contained in the supplement, buddy.

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Nope.

If you knew half as much as you are trying to let on you would know just how much shit the term 'propiatery blend' can cover... You'd also know that it us not unheard of for suppliment companies to change or lie about what is in a product.

Why do you think Jack3D is constantly being pulled? It's just been banned AGAIN for featuring an ingredient which was claimed to be derived from a geranium, but was actually a synthetic featured on several ban lists.

Can I just ask... Did you seriously just compare something found in most preworkout formulas to fucking EPO?!?

I mean, I know you're mates or a big fan of larry's or some shit... but, really?! :vd:

Was claiming that anabolic steroids wouldn't aid in his power development because they 'don't make you grow more fast twitch muscle cells' (hint: nothing makes you 'grow more' cells. It's a physiological impossibility!...) not enough? :rolleyes:

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:vd: You are seriously dumb beyond words..honestly, you lower my IQ everytime I respond to your complete and utter nonsense..The scary part is how much confidence you have in your stupidity.

Listen...read slowly..

Who decides whether methylhexaneamine is worse than EPO?? You?? Of course not, you dumb shit. So how can you then turn around and say "OMG OMG you're comparing an over the counter supplement to something that's banned".

Do you even know the law when it comes to what can be promoted as an over the counter supplement and something that's banned? No, you don't. It's as simple as bringing something out that has NO MEDICAL USAGE. If something has no medical usage it can be sold over the counter until complaints are made and the long process to ban it has been completed/proven.

For example, when prohormones were banned, they used this loophole to bring out a supplement called M1T which was a STEROID. They called it a "pro-steroid" and it was sold over the counter. It had zero medical use because they created it in a lab. Oh but because it was an over the counter supplement, in your infinite wisdom, it wouldn't have been as bad as things on the banned list..even though it was probably far more effective than most things on there.

NOW do you see the grey area that I'm talking about??

They eventually got it banned. Tons of stuff on the banned list were over the counter supplements at one point you absolute goof! :vd: Ephedrine, pro-hormones (which are steroids) and probably soon to be, methylhexaneamine which is found in Jack3d and HemoRage. I assume Enzo used one of those two.

It actually pains me that you can be this dumb and be so cock-sure about it.

If this post, born out of your stupidity has at least educated some of the forum posters about the huge grey area and contradiction that is the supplement industry, then you will have at least served some purpose.

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This is a great example of the patronizing nature you posting on this subject often takes. Calling people names and flouncing around with your pseudo intellect just makes you look even more ridiculous than your micro trunks.

I posted in the Larry thread and you accused me of getting my info from the Sun:-\ my information actually came from Oxford journals, the BBC and Pharmaknowhow. Then @AdamGB whom I assume from his posts in the Ask the trainer section, is a coach, trainer or some other type of fitness professional is dismissed by you as "dumb beyond words", "cock sure" , and "a div" the lists goes on. The point is if you really want to educate posters then perhaps you should refrain from alienating a great many of them with your attitude. At the risk of sounding once again like an "odious little c**t" , I am well aware that you can raise your testosterone levels to quite a high level without the aid of drugs,hormones and supplements, and you sound like you may have overdosed and turned into an angry little man:o;D

Althugz still can't get it through his thick head , perhaps he is blinded by his infatuation with larry , that the two cases are different , that is why their bans are not the same .Larry case was part of an investigation into anobolic steriods and growth hormones that where being smuggled into the uk, and some of them could have got into gyms where young boxers could have been tempted into buying them . That is why the bbbofc reflected in their ban a longer sentence , if larry had been caught with just epo in his system he probably would have got a 6 mth ban

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Originally Posted by Greenbeanz

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Originally Posted by Memphis

In a way I see Enzo as being more stupid than Larry. Larry didnt give a shit, Enzo apparently did and still fucked up

If your job is dependant on you having a driving license and you a) Have a bottle of vodka on the go in your van/cab b) have a few pints the night before and get pinged in the morning your still just as much sacked.

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You haven't carried your analogy through to it's logical conclusion though. If the authorities (in this case the Police) caught you over the drink drive limit, the punishment (in this case the length of driving ban and possible imprisonment) handed out by the Magistrate would be entirely different dependent on the amount of alcohol consumed, whether you were aware of being over the limit,the amount of times you subsequently admitted to doing so, and many other extenuating circumstances. When it comes to driving, Alcohol is not a performance enhancing drug though, so the example does not really fit.

The two distinct punishments may seem entirely arbitrary until you take into account the fact that if Larry were to be given 6 months for each admitted breach he would soon tot up a sentence of 6 and a half years. Instead, despite the fact that he admitted cheating for 6 year,s he was only given a four year ban. With a BSc in Pharmaceutical chemistry he could hardly claim ignorance.

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Getting banned is the conclusion though mate isn't it. There's no legal proceedings following the punishment handed out by their professional body. If that were the case then of course, one would be handed a much harsher punishment.

Im not sure what you mean by it not being valid because booze isnt performance enhancing.?

I seriously don't know where to start with that rambling mess of a rant.

Firstly, I didn't think it was possible for your IQ to be lowered... But you seem intent on proving that a negative IQ could exist... that's one thing (the only thing) you've shown me to be wrong about.

At least you have the humility to admit that your posts are becoming stupider with each one you make.

You're right, I don't get to decide if EPO is stronger than Jack3D, or red bull, or beechams all in one, or the magic water michael jordan gave to the looney toons in space jam for that matter.

Do you know who does? The people who decided to ban enzo and poor, poor larry.

Like you seem so desperate for everybody to understand - they know it's a grey area. But you're the cretin who think such a complex issue requires black abd white punishment.

What's the agenda here? Enzo punished more or Larry less?

Lets face it, if your man crush larry hadn't been banned your opinion wouldn't be the contradictory one you hold. :rolleyes:

You take a banned substance, you get a ban - but because everybody isn't as backwards as you the circumstances are judicated and the length of the ban decided.

And believe me, nobody wants to pick on Larry or take it easy on Enzo.

(remember you're the one with agenda)

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Originally Posted by Greenbeanz

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Originally Posted by Memphis

In a way I see Enzo as being more stupid than Larry. Larry didnt give a shit, Enzo apparently did and still fucked up

If your job is dependant on you having a driving license and you a) Have a bottle of vodka on the go in your van/cab b) have a few pints the night before and get pinged in the morning your still just as much sacked.

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You haven't carried your analogy through to it's logical conclusion though. If the authorities (in this case the Police) caught you over the drink drive limit, the punishment (in this case the length of driving ban and possible imprisonment) handed out by the Magistrate would be entirely different dependent on the amount of alcohol consumed, whether you were aware of being over the limit,the amount of times you subsequently admitted to doing so, and many other extenuating circumstances. When it comes to driving, Alcohol is not a performance enhancing drug though, so the example does not really fit.

The two distinct punishments may seem entirely arbitrary until you take into account the fact that if Larry were to be given 6 months for each admitted breach he would soon tot up a sentence of 6 and a half years. Instead, despite the fact that he admitted cheating for 6 year,s he was only given a four year ban. With a BSc in Pharmaceutical chemistry he could hardly claim ignorance.

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Of course he couldn't. Last I checked you can get Jack3D in health food stores... Not too sure the same can be said about EPO :vd: