Romney vs. Obama - 2012 Presidential Debates - Let's score it!

The first debate between these 2 starts tonight @ 9:00-10:30 p.m. Eastern Time
Location: University of Denver in Denver, Colorado. Considering what's at stake, this will be some high drama tonight, it should be worth a peek. :)

2012 Presidential Debate Schedule � 2012 Election Central

I'm just going to go ahead and count myself out of this thread. Whilst I enjoy a good debate with my fellow forum members I will not be watching the debate because I have heard everything Barack Obama has had to say for quite some time and I find no reason to support him so Mitt Romney wins simply by showing up because Obama and Biden are morons and our country has suffered them long enough.



Ooooh and anyone that cares to disagree with that can fuck right off.

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

I'm just going to go ahead and count myself out of this thread. Whilst I enjoy a good debate with my fellow forum members I will not be watching the debate because I have heard everything Barack Obama has had to say for quite some time and I find no reason to support him so Mitt Romney wins simply by showing up because Obama and Biden are morons and our country has suffered them long enough.



Ooooh and anyone that cares to disagree with that can fuck right off.

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obama and biden are piss and piss is all. only thıng worse than obama would be obama gets shot aqnd then we have presıdent fuckıng joe dukakıs bıden the chump-ass suck-face boot-licker.

I'll tune in tonight but I have no expectation of hearing something new or concrete from either.

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Originally Posted by VictorCharlie

I'll tune in tonight but I have no expectation of hearing something new or concrete from either.

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I'd rather have a Libertarian holding the power in the Executive Branch as well, but someone who isn't an isolationist because I don't think it matters if we brought everyone home and never helped anyone or "stuck our noses in other peoples' business" people are jealous of our success, our dominance, and they'll just take shots at our mainland to try and bait us into a fight anyway.

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Originally Posted by Mars_ax

The first debate between these 2 starts tonight @ 9:00-10:30 p.m. Eastern Time
Location: University of Denver in Denver, Colorado. Considering what's at stake, this will be some high drama tonight, it should be worth a peek. :)

2012 Presidential Debate Schedule � 2012 Election Central

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I think Lyle has already scored it.

;)

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

I'm just going to go ahead and count myself out of this thread. Whilst I enjoy a good debate with my fellow forum members I will not be watching the debate because I have heard everything Barack Obama has had to say for quite some time and I find no reason to support him so Mitt Romney wins simply by showing up because Obama and Biden are morons and our country has suffered them long enough.



Ooooh and anyone that cares to disagree with that can fuck right off.

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I'm going to watch a bit of it, i'm curious to see how well Romney does, a good showing might boost his numbers in the polls. I don't know how long i'll be able to stomach looking at Obama.

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Originally Posted by VictorCharlie

I'll tune in tonight but I have no expectation of hearing something new or concrete from either.

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I'm just interested in seeing how these 2 match up in a debate. I feel pretty sure they already know what they're going to be asked, and have a scripted answer, but there could be some surprises. It might be worth a couple brews.

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

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Originally Posted by VictorCharlie

I'll tune in tonight but I have no expectation of hearing something new or concrete from either.

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I'd rather have a Libertarian holding the power in the Executive Branch as well, but someone who isn't an isolationist because I don't think it matters if we brought everyone home and never helped anyone or "stuck our noses in other peoples' business" people are jealous of our success, our dominance, and they'll just take shots at our mainland to try and bait us into a fight anyway.

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Leave the world alone and I am sure you will notice people people start to ignore you more. What creates bitterness are invasions, drones, the ardent support of Israel etc etc. Actually try living in peace and see if it makes a difference because America really has been at permanent war since WW2.

As for the debates....load of old tosh. As if these two clowns have anything productive to offer. I'm not interested.

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Originally Posted by Gandalf

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

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Originally Posted by VictorCharlie

I'll tune in tonight but I have no expectation of hearing something new or concrete from either.

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I'd rather have a Libertarian holding the power in the Executive Branch as well, but someone who isn't an isolationist because I don't think it matters if we brought everyone home and never helped anyone or "stuck our noses in other peoples' business" people are jealous of our success, our dominance, and they'll just take shots at our mainland to try and bait us into a fight anyway.

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Leave the world alone and I am sure you will notice people people start to ignore you more. What creates bitterness are invasions, drones, the ardent support of Israel etc etc. Actually try living in peace and see if it makes a difference because America really has been at permanent war since WW2.

As for the debates....load of old tosh. As if these two clowns have anything productive to offer. I'm not interested.

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Thanks for sharing miles.

2 guys arguing who is going to steal more of peoples income

I must say.... Romney's doing pretty good on the economy portion of the debate.
Only problem for me is "credibility".
He talks a good game, but would he follow up on his intentions if he got to the White House??
I can't shake the perception that he's lying just to get votes.

That really is the crux of it Tito. Does Romney really believe what he is saying? Does the President have something other than not more of Bush policies to run on? I do feel the President has been on the defensive most of the time. He should have known this would be the case and have a better detailed vision.

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Originally Posted by VictorCharlie

That really is the crux of it Tito. Does Romney really believe what he is saying? Does the President have something other than not more of Bush policies to run on? I do feel the President has been on the defensive most of the time. He should have known this would be the case and have a better detailed vision.

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I completely agree, Victor. So far I've taken a few things from the debate as it's still going on. #1, Romney is a much better debater than I was giving him credit for. He's giving Obama all he can handle and more. Even the Tweets crossing the bottom of the screen (how distracting!) seem to think so. #2, Romney is saying all the right things economy-wise... but is he being honest about his intentions? It's maddening not being able to read into his thought process.

I'm anxious to see how they do in other topics.

I think Romney is doing a good job, it's obvious that he's had a strong background in business and management, something Obama lacks.

Although the Tweets are distracting, I liked one particular one that shot a dig at both:

"Romney is pretending he cares. Maybe Obama should try that."

I have zero confidence in Obama being able to lead this country in the right direction.

If Romney was smart he'd divorce himself of the Bush administration. He should flat out say that the Bush policies on spending and big government are not in line with the GOP's principles or his personal ones. That statement alone would put to bed much of the blame game.

Obama seems really flat in this debate, Romney seems to have all the energy.

In my humble opinion, advantage Romney in the 1st debate.

Early on Romney reminded me of Frosty when he first got locked in the greenhouse, then he settled into calm offensive. Obama has to do away, wont happen, with that condescending head swivel smirk while he stares at the podium pretending to write. He was stale. Been there, done that.

Nothing new at all...aside from Romney blurting out that he likes Big Bird :-X

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Originally Posted by Spicoli

Early on Romney reminded me of Frosty when he first got locked in the greenhouse, then he settled into calm offensive. Obama has to do away, wont happen, with that condescending head swivel smirk while he stares at the podium pretending to write. He was stale. Been there, done that.

Nothing new at all...aside from Romney blurting out that he likes Big Bird :-X

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I can't imagine any American voter in their right mind wanting 4 more years of Obama's bullshit.

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Originally Posted by VictorCharlie

That really is the crux of it Tito. Does Romney really believe what he is saying? Does the President have something other than not more of Bush policies to run on? I do feel the President has been on the defensive most of the time. He should have known this would be the case and have a better detailed vision.

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Recorded the debate and watching it this morning. Having some knowledge of Mormonism I have huge doubts about what Mormons believe in. Putting that aside...

Romney is doing well, but its always easier to be the person attacking than someone with a record to defend. I agree that he should have put a line in the sand between him and the old Republicans of George W. As a Brit, you know I'm going to be an advocate of a national health system of some kind, and I feel Obama's got the argument on Medicare.

Some Twitter chatter for you guys

Bill Maher‏@billmaher

i can't believe i'm saying this, but Obama looks like he DOES need a teleprompter


Michael Moore‏@MMFlint

"President Romney?" Anybody worried now? Get it the F together, Team Obama. And the rest of us? What are WE doing tomorrow?


.....ouch, babe

Dennis Miller Show‏@DennisDMZ

Arthur Conan Doyle's Lestrade had more of a clue than Obama


Dennis Miller Show‏@DennisDMZ

Obama is now looking for Ferdie Pacheco. "He's a bleeder...He's a bleeder!"


Dana Perino‏@DanaPerino

maybe debate commission should add that little league rule - when the other team is that far ahead, you just call it a day



.....and I DID end up watching the debate from start to finish (I was drunk and thought I might as well) and Mitt Romney just steamrolled Barry, I mean WOW. That was a Mike Tyson-esque first round, Obama got stunned right off the bat and never recovered and now JOE BIDEN is the guy that has to stop the slide.....duuuuude, not looking good right now for the Libs.

Ha ha ha.... what can I say, bro. You gotta accept events as they occur. Romney DID look a lot better than Obama in the debate, that's for sure. Whether I believe half the things he says he'll do is another story... but he did hand Obama his ass last night.

And regarding Biden coming up next, well...... I've never defended Biden (I don't think), so..... damn.... not looking good for the defending champs. And LOL at the "bleeder" Tweet.

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Originally Posted by TitoFan

Ha ha ha.... what can I say, bro. You gotta accept events as they occur. Romney DID look a lot better than Obama in the debate, that's for sure. Whether I believe half the things he says he'll do is another story... but he did hand Obama his ass last night.

And regarding Biden coming up next, well...... I've never defended Biden (I don't think), so..... damn.... not looking good for the defending champs. And LOL at the "bleeder" Tweet.

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But you believe Barack "I'll cut the deficet in half" Obama?

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

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Originally Posted by TitoFan

Ha ha ha.... what can I say, bro. You gotta accept events as they occur. Romney DID look a lot better than Obama in the debate, that's for sure. Whether I believe half the things he says he'll do is another story... but he did hand Obama his ass last night.

And regarding Biden coming up next, well...... I've never defended Biden (I don't think), so..... damn.... not looking good for the defending champs. And LOL at the "bleeder" Tweet.

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But you believe Barack "I'll cut the deficet in half" Obama?

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I believe the following:

Obama believes in what he's saying.... but hasn't come through.

Romney is a good speaker and debater.... but lies about what his true intentions are. Once he's elected, he'll revert back to his original intentions. And we'll be stuck for 4 years of 180-degree turnaround.

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Originally Posted by TitoFan

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

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Originally Posted by TitoFan

Ha ha ha.... what can I say, bro. You gotta accept events as they occur. Romney DID look a lot better than Obama in the debate, that's for sure. Whether I believe half the things he says he'll do is another story... but he did hand Obama his ass last night.

And regarding Biden coming up next, well...... I've never defended Biden (I don't think), so..... damn.... not looking good for the defending champs. And LOL at the "bleeder" Tweet.

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But you believe Barack "I'll cut the deficet in half" Obama?

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I believe the following:

Obama believes in what he's saying.... but hasn't come through.

Romney is a good speaker and debater.... but lies about what his true intentions are. Once he's elected, he'll revert back to his original intentions. And we'll be stuck for 4 years of 180-degree turnaround.

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So Obama THINKS he's telling the truth but can't get anything done whereas you say something to the effect of "Mitt Romney knows he's lying but he does a good job of presenting his lies"?

OOOOOOkay???

Barack Obama campaigned on Hope & Change to become President and well the Hope has disappeared and the "change" is all we're left with, although I'm not sure how much "change" one can accomplish with the very same political hacks that were in the Clinton White House.

Mitt Romney took Barry to school last night and I wouldn't be shocked if he did it again. I KNOW Joe Biden is going to get hammered by Paul Ryan.

Is there some saying about a country getting the leader it deserves?

I believe the conlcusion you've come to is that :

a) Obama is honest, but unable to achieve his lofty goals.
b) Mitt Romney is a lying evil genius.

Having watched the whole thing now, it seemed to me that Obama was too polite to butt in and talk over Romney or the presenter, while Romney did it quite a bit, which gave him the forceful edge and didn't get told to pipe down by the presenter.

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

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Originally Posted by TitoFan

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

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Originally Posted by TitoFan

Ha ha ha.... what can I say, bro. You gotta accept events as they occur. Romney DID look a lot better than Obama in the debate, that's for sure. Whether I believe half the things he says he'll do is another story... but he did hand Obama his ass last night.

And regarding Biden coming up next, well...... I've never defended Biden (I don't think), so..... damn.... not looking good for the defending champs. And LOL at the "bleeder" Tweet.

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But you believe Barack "I'll cut the deficet in half" Obama?

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I believe the following:

Obama believes in what he's saying.... but hasn't come through.

Romney is a good speaker and debater.... but lies about what his true intentions are. Once he's elected, he'll revert back to his original intentions. And we'll be stuck for 4 years of 180-degree turnaround.

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So Obama THINKS he's telling the truth but can't get anything done whereas you say something to the effect of "Mitt Romney knows he's lying but he does a good job of presenting his lies"?

OOOOOOkay???

Barack Obama campaigned on Hope & Change to become President and well the Hope has disappeared and the "change" is all we're left with, although I'm not sure how much "change" one can accomplish with the very same political hacks that were in the Clinton White House.

Mitt Romney took Barry to school last night and I wouldn't be shocked if he did it again. I KNOW Joe Biden is going to get hammered by Paul Ryan.

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What's so hard to believe? It's a matter of perception. IMO, Obama comes across as more honest, regardless of how poorly he projected himself last night. Honesty and effectiveness are two different things. You can be honest about your intentions and not come through. Since the country does not run on intentions, he'd have no one to blame but himself if he lost the election.

Romney, on the other hand, is obviously a practiced debater... who had the advantage last night of being able to criticize what Obama has done or hasn't done, from the vantage point of not having the chance to mess up himself. He did his homework..... he took Obama to school, as you well put it..... and he did himself a lot of good in the polls. Congratulations.

Did he backtrack on some earlier campaign statements about his intentions on taxes and the deficit? Probably..... Obama hinted as much. But in retrospect, who cares. What matters is that Romney, whether or not he was lying through his rich, upper-class teeth.... came across as the clear winner last night.

At least I'm big enough to accept that. Had the situation been reversed, however, I would've bet my house that you would've scoffed and claimed otherwise.... or would've dismissed the whole thing altogether. We both know that.

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Originally Posted by TitoFan

What's so hard to believe? It's a matter of perception. IMO, Obama comes across as more honest, regardless of how poorly he projected himself last night. Honesty and effectiveness are two different things. You can be honest about your intentions and not come through. Since the country does not run on intentions, he'd have no one to blame but himself if he lost the election.

Romney, on the other hand, is obviously a practiced debater... who had the advantage last night of being able to criticize what Obama has done or hasn't done, from the vantage point of not having the chance to mess up himself. He did his homework..... he took Obama to school, as you well put it..... and he did himself a lot of good in the polls. Congratulations.

Did he backtrack on some earlier campaign statements about his intentions on taxes and the deficit? Probably..... Obama hinted as much. But in retrospect, who cares. What matters is that Romney, whether or not he was lying through his rich, upper-class teeth.... came across as the clear winner last night.

At least I'm big enough to accept that. Had the situation been reversed, however, I would've bet my house that you would've scoffed and claimed otherwise.... or would've dismissed the whole thing altogether. We both know that.

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The road to Hell is paved with good intentions

Mitt Romney taught Obama a lesson on the economy last night. Obama didn't want to be there, he is not leadership material, and he's dropped the ball big time on foreign policy....this debate over domestic stuff should have been EASY for Obama to win but his policies haven't helped the economy and he didn't remember to attack the "special interest issues" the 47% comment, the 'War on Women' :vd:, Don't Ask Don't Tell, etc....Obama looked lost and I don't want a President that looks lost. W had a horrible first debate in 04 but he had Dick Cheney to whup up on poor John Edwards to back him up....Obama has Biden, and this whole debate situation could spiral out of control very quickly.

Mitt Romney has run businesses, he's held executive office in the public & private sectors, and last night he looked and sounded like a leader. When he started hitting on bipartisanship that sunk Obama's Battleship because Barry went into office with an attitude of "I won, you lost, we (the Democrats) are going to tell you what we are going to do" and the Republicans were kicked out of any negotiations or left because they wouldn't be heard from by the President. That debate was a total rout

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Originally Posted by Gandalf

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

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Originally Posted by VictorCharlie

I'll tune in tonight but I have no expectation of hearing something new or concrete from either.

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I'd rather have a Libertarian holding the power in the Executive Branch as well, but someone who isn't an isolationist because I don't think it matters if we brought everyone home and never helped anyone or "stuck our noses in other peoples' business" people are jealous of our success, our dominance, and they'll just take shots at our mainland to try and bait us into a fight anyway.

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Leave the world alone and I am sure you will notice people people start to ignore you more. What creates bitterness are invasions, drones, the ardent support of Israel etc etc. Actually try living in peace and see if it makes a difference because America really has been at permanent war since WW2.

As for the debates....load of old tosh. As if these two clowns have anything productive to offer. I'm not interested.

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I like what Gandalf is saying. I can remember when you saw the news and everyone was yelling America, America, America with smiles on their faces.
Trying to be the "World Police" is stupid and wrong. Trying to promote democracy with a gun is stupid and wrong.
The USA needs a strong military force, no one can deny that, learning when and where to use it is the problem.
This thread was about the debate, which the President clearly lost.
I want Obama out of there, he doesn't have what it takes. I do not trust anything he says or does. He had done a piss poor job, in my opinion.

Again, congrats. I hope if Romney wins he'll turn out to be the "cure-all" you believe he'll be. Personally, I'm not related to either.... so it's no skin off my back who wins. Bottom line is: whatever is best for the country.

Obama lost the debate just on style last night. (I've seen a bunch of clips, not the whole thing.) Romney was engaged and on message, he didn't waste a word. Obama was hesitant, timid and looked like he didn't want to be there. The optics were terrible for Obama, he was hardly looking at Romney and Romney looked and sounded the part. So for the 95+% of Americans who don't know much or anything about the various policies, Romney won the debate easily.

Romney was either evasive about things he's full of shit on (tax cuts, spending etc.) or just outright full of shit (claiming his healthcare "policy" covers pre-existing conditions) and Obama just let him slide on everything. Absolutely piss poor performance by Obama. If he loses this election this debate will be seen as the turning point.

Will it move the needle in the election? This election comes down to about one million undecided people in half a dozen states, according to the political scientists. In these crucial half a dozen states Obama leads by 5-10 points. It'll be interesting to see if that changes over the next week when the new polls come out.

The race will tighten anyway regardless of how the debates go and this election will probably turn on which party can get their base to turn out to the polls in the biggest number.

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Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing

Obama lost the debate just on style last night. (I've seen a bunch of clips, not the whole thing.) Romney was engaged and on message, he didn't waste a word. Obama was hesitant, timid and looked like he didn't want to be there. The optics were terrible for Obama, he was hardly looking at Romney and Romney looked and sounded the part. So for the 95+% of Americans who don't know much or anything about the various policies, Romney won the debate easily.

Romney was either evasive about things he's full of shit on (tax cuts, spending etc.) or just outright full of shit (claiming his healthcare "policy" covers pre-existing conditions) and Obama just let him slide on everything. Absolutely piss poor performance by Obama. If he loses this election this debate will be seen as the turning point.

Will it move the needle in the election? This election comes down to about one million undecided people in half a dozen states, according to the political scientists. In these crucial half a dozen states Obama leads by 5-10 points. It'll be interesting to see if that changes over the next week when the new polls come out.

The race will tighten anyway regardless of how the debates go and this election will probably turn on which party can get their base to turn out to the polls in the biggest number.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3id-Fb8ooY

......WHEW....what a laugh...my stomach hurts from that one. The polls that show that are basing voter turnout on the 2008 election and I hate to be the one to break it to you but I'm having my doubts that the Democrats will be all that fired up this go round.

Obama got effectively crushed last night. Basically steam-rolled by a well-prepared, aggressive and ready for battle Romney. He missed many opportunities as Lyle mentions, and didn't drive home any of the strengths of the arguments he had in his arsenal. Which were many.

About 10 mins in, I was sitting there watching him sputtering...knowing he was listening to a complete flip on Romney's entire primary platform, one series of lies after another...and he totally didn't call him out on it. Like barely even once. And if that doesn't happen early , that misdirection gains weight and becomes meat...the kind of meat that people will begin consuming whether it ends up leaving them with a bad stomach ache or not. He needed to not only bring the attacks of his campaign, the 47% etc...he needed to call BS right there, "Sir, you are Lying. LIAR LIAR PANTS ON FIRE LYING."

When all is said and done, the fact checkers are finished, I doubt the fabrications will mean all that much. People will just remember that it appeared as one man was ready for battle, the other seemed indifferent. And if it continues for 2 more debates Obama and his admin. will be in serious trouble.

Time to get more aggressive. Like even more. I'd be starting first thing morning.. .

"Of all the things said last night from Mtt Romney, there is only one I beiieve. This guy is out to kill Big Bird."



http://img.ibtimes.com/www/data/imag...g-bird-sad.jpg

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

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Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing

Obama lost the debate just on style last night. (I've seen a bunch of clips, not the whole thing.) Romney was engaged and on message, he didn't waste a word. Obama was hesitant, timid and looked like he didn't want to be there. The optics were terrible for Obama, he was hardly looking at Romney and Romney looked and sounded the part. So for the 95+% of Americans who don't know much or anything about the various policies, Romney won the debate easily.

Romney was either evasive about things he's full of shit on (tax cuts, spending etc.) or just outright full of shit (claiming his healthcare "policy" covers pre-existing conditions) and Obama just let him slide on everything. Absolutely piss poor performance by Obama. If he loses this election this debate will be seen as the turning point.

Will it move the needle in the election? This election comes down to about one million undecided people in half a dozen states, according to the political scientists. In these crucial half a dozen states Obama leads by 5-10 points. It'll be interesting to see if that changes over the next week when the new polls come out.

The race will tighten anyway regardless of how the debates go and this election will probably turn on which party can get their base to turn out to the polls in the biggest number.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3id-Fb8ooY

......WHEW....what a laugh...my stomach hurts from that one. The polls that show that are basing voter turnout on the 2008 election and I hate to be the one to break it to you but I'm having my doubts that the Democrats will be all that fired up this go round.

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Show me cross tabs from a poll that shows it's based on 2008 turnout. Actual data from an actual poll rather than a link to some nonsense you read somewhere.

Excellent post, Youngblood..... and right on point.

:rolleyes: oh the PBS/NPR argument again "Oh please, PLEASE don't make us have to survive in the private sector!!!" :shakehead:

Seasame Street will do just fine without any government funding, as weill certain other shows, but if Romney didn't say what he was going to cut funding for he would have left a bigger openning for a counter attack "Romney hasn't provided specifics on his cuts, he must want to kill all the old people and throw the young ones out of public schools".

That debate is bound to have shaken Obama's confidence and damn Joe Biden has to come save the day....HAHAHAHAHA that's going to be EPIC

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Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing

Show me cross tabs from a poll that shows it's based on 2008 turnout. Actual data from an actual poll rather than a link to some nonsense you read somewhere.

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Bup, bup, bup....you provide your polls