Hearns vs Mayweather & Hagler vs Hopkins

Just saw the threat below about the perfect fights and these two really stuck in my mind when i saw them posted by someone - Who would you guys pick!? Prime for Prime with Hearns Mayweather at 140

I struggle to even imagine Hearns vs Mayweather - just can't work it out! Mayweather probably wouldn't be able to put Tommy down even if his chin is edgy and if Hearns landed what SSM did on Floyd (given Flloyd was past his prime then) then I would'nt see him lasting - However he is so so quick - but so was Leonard and Hearns still tagged him a hell of a lot! SO I suppose I would go for - HEARNS

Hagler Hopkins!? Hopkins i'm thinking would be most effective when fighting like he has done the last 6 or 7 years which is actually his prime I would say with his best results - Hagler wouldnt take no headbutting shit I wouldnt have thought - Id go for Marvin 116-112 probably.

Opinions!?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by oakleyno1

Just saw the threat below about the perfect fights and these two really stuck in my mind when i saw them posted by someone - Who would you guys pick!? Prime for Prime with Hearns Mayweather at 140

I struggle to even imagine Hearns vs Mayweather - just can't work it out! Mayweather probably wouldn't be able to put Tommy down even if his chin is edgy and if Hearns landed what SSM did on Floyd (given Flloyd was past his prime then) then I would'nt see him lasting - However he is so so quick - but so was Leonard and Hearns still tagged him a hell of a lot! SO I suppose I would go for - HEARNS

Hagler Hopkins!? Hopkins i'm thinking would be most effective when fighting like he has done the last 6 or 7 years which is actually his prime I would say with his best results - Hagler wouldnt take no headbutting shit I wouldnt have thought - Id go for Marvin 116-112 probably.

Opinions!?

---

Tommy Hearns for 12 rounds outboxed SRL, he also outclassed an excellent defensive fighter in Wilfred Benitez. I've never seen anyone outbox Tommy Hearns, and i don't think Mayweather would either because he hasn't got the size or reach.

To beat Hearns you have to be aggressive, i don't think Mayweather would be willing to take that chance against the hard hitting Hearns, i think it would look alot like the Benitez fight with Mayweather not getting dominated. But losing the rounds being too cautious and in the end loses a decision.

As for B-hop/Hagler i really couldn't tell you, i think this is a 50/50 match up and it would also depend on which version of each fighter we are on about.

Hagler in his early days was a boxer/mover, but in his championship reign he was much more of a come forward aggressive fighter. Where as its the total opposite for Hopkins who at first was a come forward aggressive fighter, who then changed his style into a slick boxer in his later career.

Hearns knocks Floyd out.
I give the edge to Hagler over Hop. I think Haglers switch hitting gives him the edge in a points win.

I have always thought Hearns would have a great chance of beating Floyd. Tommy had a GREAT jab to go with his long reach...and he of course could lay the hammer down and put you to sleep. As crafty as Hopkins is...I see Hagler beating him.

Hearns knocks Floyd's block off

Worst possible match up for him

I do not think Hearns fought at 140lb as professional but he would probably lose at that weight if he fought Floyd.

Hearns would beat Floyd as he would have done Leonard had it been 12 rounds. Floyd knows he would have to fight more aggressively but Hearns would catch him and hurt him, so Floyd survives a beating for 12 rounds.

Hagler would beat Hopkins through aggressive and effective boxing but B Hop would give as good as he gets and I think it would end up a good street fight.

I think Hearns would KO Floyd. Shout me down if I'm wrong but I don't think that Money May has ever faced a jabber anything like Hearns. I think that Hearns would just fire streight shots at Floyd all night long and they would land. You can't do the whole sholder role thing against a guy who's super fast, six foot tall and accurate like Tommy Hearns was in his prime.

Hagler vs BHop is a weird one. I really have no idea I don't think that Hagler showed his A game against SRL but at the same time he could not stop Duran either.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mctaggert

I think Hearns would KO Floyd. Shout me down if I'm wrong but I don't think that Money May has ever faced a jabber anything like Hearns. I think that Hearns would just fire streight shots at Floyd all night long and they would land. You can't do the whole sholder role thing against a guy who's super fast, six foot tall and accurate like Tommy Hearns was in his prime.

Hagler vs BHop is a weird one. I really have no idea I don't think that Hagler showed his A game against SRL but at the same time he could not stop Duran either.

---

One match up i always wanted to see was a prime Vernon Forrest vs Floyd Mayweather, Forrest had a tremendous jab that could neutralize speed. I think that would of been a very interesting match up.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ICB

Tommy Hearns for 12 rounds outboxed SRL, he also outclassed an excellent defensive fighter in Wilfred Benitez. I've never seen anyone outbox Tommy Hearns, and i don't think Mayweather would either because he hasn't got the size or reach.

---

This..... on Hearns-Mayweather.

On Hagler-Hopkins, I'd have to say Hagler.
He's got too much firepower for Hopkins, and he was too much of a wily veteran to fall for Hopkins' shenanigans.

I'll take Hopkins over Hagler. I think Hopkins would be too quick and slick, and would take a competitive decision.

Mayweather/Hearns is a tougher one, and you have to keep in mind that we're going prime vs prime and Hearns had his prime at WW and MW, and Floyd was peak at super-featherweight to light-welterweight. That being said, at WW I'll still take Floyd.

What I find funny is the people who think beating Floyd is just simply a matter of throwing a bunch of straight punches and jabs. Then when guys fight Floyd and have a low punch output they say "Jeez if he just threw more jabs/punches he would have won!" Doesn't it seem weird that the key to beating Mayweather is so simple, yet no one has managed to do it for 17 years?

Floyd is a master defensive technician and counter puncher. Guys go in with the intention to throw a ton of punches, but start second guessing themselves and can't set right when they're eating lightning fast lead right hands and left hooks. I gaurentee you, Hearns has his offense severely stunted by Floyd, and he eats a lot of flush shots.

I know people will bring up that he outboxed Leonard, but Mayweather is better than Leonard in just about every catagory, and also has a different style.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Beanflicker

I'll take Hopkins over Hagler. I think Hopkins would be too quick and slick, and would take a competitive decision.

Mayweather/Hearns is a tougher one, and you have to keep in mind that we're going prime vs prime and Hearns had his prime at WW and MW, and Floyd was peak at super-featherweight to light-welterweight. That being said, at WW I'll still take Floyd.

What I find funny is the people who think beating Floyd is just simply a matter of throwing a bunch of straight punches and jabs. Then when guys fight Floyd and have a low punch output they say "Jeez if he just threw more jabs/punches he would have won!" Doesn't it seem weird that the key to beating Mayweather is so simple, yet no one has managed to do it for 17 years?

Floyd is a master defensive technician and counter puncher. Guys go in with the intention to throw a ton of punches, but start second guessing themselves and can't set right when they're eating lightning fast lead right hands and left hooks. I gaurentee you, Hearns has his offense severely stunted by Floyd, and he eats a lot of flush shots.

I know people will bring up that he outboxed Leonard, but Mayweather is better than Leonard in just about every catagory, and also has a different style.

---

Hagler edges Hopkins and Tommy quite literally kicks the snot out of Floyd at 147. Its also a crock that Floyd peaked out at 126 and 135. Makes little difference. Tommy is all wrong for him at any weight. I'm not sure Floyd could deal with Saddler at 126 let alone a hypothetical Hearns at that weight.

Hearns KO winner over Mayweather easily!!! Mayweather offers no power so Tommy would be working freely!! Hearms 6'1" 147, Floyd 5'7" 145 its such a miss match its ridiculous!!!

Hagler over Hopkins it will take Marvelous time to run Hopkins down because Bernard won't fight Hagler he'll stink the ring out and run and tap and run and try to hold!! Marvelous will eventually get Hopkins to slow down and he won't let Hopkins steal like Leonard did to Hagler. Were talking prime Hagler not the older version who fought Leonard. Hopkins does nthing better than Hagler does except run!! Who has Hopkins ever beated thats a great fighter? He's over his head with a "high work rate" Hagler. Ray.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by IamInuit

Hagler edges Hopkins and Tommy quite literally kicks the snot out of Floyd at 147. Its also a crock that Floyd peaked out at 126 and 135. Makes little difference. Tommy is all wrong for him at any weight. I'm not sure Floyd could deal with Saddler at 126 let alone a hypothetical Hearns at that weight.

---

I have no problem with people thinking Hearns beats Mayweather, because Hearns was a hell of a champ and could knock out any man with his right hand.

But when people are saying he knocks out Floyd early or dominates Floyd... that's just crazy talk. In Floyd, you're talking about THE GREATEST defensive fighter of all time. Willie Pep, Benitez, hell even Whitaker - none of these guys had the defensive capabilities of PBF. And seeing how much Hearns struggled offensively against Benitez, I think it's a little niave to say Hearns just blows Mayweather out of the water.

You don't think Floyd was at his peak from 130-140? The best I ever seen Floyd look - possibly the greatest virtuoso performance I've ever seen - was vs Corrales at 130.
Floyd went up to 147 and 154 to secure big money fights, but really he was never a "true" 147 or 154lber.

As for Saddler, Floyd never fought below super feather anway, but assuming they could fight... Saddler gets dominated.

Hearns would spark Floyd in 2 rounds, Hagler would beat the shit out of Slopkins.;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dia bando

Hearns would spark Floyd in 2 rounds, Hagler would beat the shit out of Slopkins.;)

---

Of course. Why wouldn't they... :rolleyes:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Beanflicker

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dia bando

Hearns would spark Floyd in 2 rounds, Hagler would beat the shit out of Slopkins.;)

---

Of course. Why wouldn't they... :rolleyes:

---

Why NOT.;D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Beanflicker

I know people will bring up that he outboxed Leonard, but Mayweather is better than Leonard in just about every catagory, and also has a different style.

---

Ray Leonard was a lot better than Mayweather is at welter. Leonard is better is every department and had far greater punch power. Floyds best weight is below welter where he is a great fighter. The current welterweights are not as good as when Tito, Quartey and ODH held the titles.

Are you fucking kidding me Mayweather a better boxer then Leonard must be a joke. If his peak was 135 then him pretty much losing to Cor doesn't say much about his peak. Leonard offence was leagues above Mayweather and he was fighting guys like Duran, Hearns, and Benitez at there peaks. I mean tell me what does Mayweather do better then Ray when it comes to offense because i don't see much and to beat Hearns you need to have the offence Leonard did and also have chin to take the shots.

I can't believe how much people are under estimating Mayweather. Mayweather at his peak was ridiculous. He still is to be honest.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ono

I can't believe how much people are under estimating Mayweather. Mayweather at his peak was ridiculous. He still is to be honest.

---

Agreed, however I do believe Tommy would be too much for him. Hearns could certainly bang but let's not forget he was a damn fine boxer himself. I see Tommy winning on points and possibly having Floyd down.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tyke72

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ono

I can't believe how much people are under estimating Mayweather. Mayweather at his peak was ridiculous. He still is to be honest.

---

Agreed, however I do believe Tommy would be too much for him. Hearns could certainly bang but let's not forget he was a damn fine boxer himself. I see Tommy winning on points and possibly having Floyd down.

---

Maybe, but i look at how comfortably Floyd dealt with Corrales (the closest physically any of his opponents have been to Hearns) and i just don't see Hearns whitewashing him. I understand Hearns was far better, and his style wasn't overly similar, but the reach and the height only differ by a couple of inches, so the Corrales fight shows that Mayweather wouldn't have much trouble finding his range.

Mayweather's best weapon for me is his ability to completely shut his opponents offence down. Hearns had a great jab, and Mayweather can give early rounds away against a fighter with a good jab - like he did against Oscar. But once he makes his adjustment, he just shuts you down. I remember after the Oscar fight and people were saying "If only Oscar carried on jabbing."

It's just not as simple as that. Mayweather adjusts and finds a way to win. I'm not saying he'd beat Hearns, because Hearns was a physical beast, but to say Hearns would dominate - that's stupid talk.

Hearns and Hagler to win both.

Hearns is all wrong for Mayweather and Corrales is a poor comparison as he didn't fight like Hearns and was at his best at smaller weights. With that excellent jab, Floyd would be having issues and with a man that hit very hard. Floyd would never fight a truly dangerous fighter like Hearns.

Hagler against Hopkins is more interesting, but Hagler didn't play games and would hunt his man down. Hopkins would win some rounds, but Hagler is the stronger, more durable fighter. I see it being an 8 rounds to 4 kind of fight if you are going to fight 12 rounds.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mr140

I mean tell me what does Mayweather do better then Ray

---

How about...

1) Counter punching
2) Accuracy
3) Hand speed
4) Punch choice (knowing what to throw and when, to leave himself less vulnerable.)

Combined with superior...

1) Footwork
2) Defence
3) Boxing fundamentals

Floyd is by far and away a much better boxing talent than Ray Leonard. And Ray was a great fighter, Floyd is just in a league of his own.

To sum it up, Ray was a bigger puncher than Floyd and that's about it.

And to be fair, Floyd was considered a boxer/puncher at his lower starting weights and had a very respectable KO ratio.

Anyone who thinks Hearns outboxes Floyd is absolutely nuts. You guys need to watch more of Hearn's fights other than the KO reel. His defense had a lot of holes and he didn't have the greatest chin in the world either.

Think Rays root work was better then Floyds to be honest with you also his combination punching was better as well when he go on the offence. Floyd in his prime pretty much lost to Costillo and his best win is a older Oscar. I have hard time determining what he would do with fights that are in different leagues and are atg as well. The closet thing was Oscar and he in no way dominated him i sure you can look better when you oppents are not as great. Hearns, Duran, Hagler and Benitez were atg and Leonard beat them all i mean i will go look at the flim but i think he was a better fighter in the ring.

Hearns may have not had the best chin in the world but Mayweather didn't have the power of Leonard or a Hagler either. I mean Mayweather has had a reach advantage in all his fights as well or damn near. Your saying Mayweather is above these guys but his resume doesn't show me he could hang. I mean Castillo pretty much beating him in prime and rematch being really close as well. Then you have Oscar at the tail end of his career who took at least 116 112 against him at worst. I don't see Mayweather out boxing Hearn's because no one ever did and he does not have the attack like Leonard did at welter. Mayweather is a great fighter but i mean his comp is not even as strong as the 90's was above welter. He has caught alot of fighters at the tail end of there careers which was not his fault but it holds him back in think he could out fight a Hearns or a Leonard.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Beanflicker

Anyone who thinks Hearns outboxes Floyd is absolutely nuts. You guys need to watch more of Hearn's fights other than the KO reel. His defense had a lot of holes and he didn't have the greatest chin in the world either.

---

Well he outboxed a defensive wizard in Wilfred Benitez, so why is it nuts to think that ?

@Beanflicker do u really believe all what you listed? I like floyd hes very talented. But he hasnt had the defining fights leonard did to show us what hes really all about... What other legend has floyd beat? Oscar? Cotto? These guys are great fighters but not legends like duran,benitez,hagler,hearns. And leonard had all the fundimentals to beat all of these men..... Does floyd?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Domiko

@Beanflicker do u really believe all what you listed? I like floyd hes very talented. But he hasnt had the defining fights leonard did to show us what hes really all about... What other legend has floyd beat? Oscar? Cotto? These guys are great fighters but not legends like duran,benitez,hagler,hearns. And leonard had all the fundimentals to beat all of these men..... Does floyd?

---

Bean is serious, he over admires Floyd. :)

You would have to to be that naive

There is a kind of hubris with many Mayweather fans when it comes to any comparison to any fighter in history. Now it’s gone from Hearns to Leonard. Imo Hearns would knock Floyd out but the Leonard fight is a much better contest. I’m not going to quibble about when Floyds prime was or is. If he primed out at 135 then he has no business being compared to Hearns or Leonard, I mean what’s the point? Compare him then to the atg lightweights and I can think of several that would also beat Floyd.

These claims of advantages for Floyd over Leonard are incorrigible and I’m not trying to personally insult anyone. Wilfredo Benitez is arguably just as effective as Floyd as a counter puncher and overall defensively. Although Leonard admitted after the fight that he never missed with so many punches he still stopped him. I’m not convinced Mayweather beats a prime Benitez or Duran for that matter at any weight. Mayweather has never beaten anyone near those two alone in his entire career. Duran would have destroyed Castillo or anyone else Floyd fought at 135 and 147 and Wilfredo would have toyed with any welter Floyd has fought thus far. And don’t try calling me a Floyd hater.

Hagler vs mayweather?

I know different weights but mayweather could move up...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Domiko

Hagler vs mayweather?

---

Leonard retired for 3 years prior to fighting Hagler. In honesty I think he waited him out. Leonard got ring size and gloves in the contract to boot. Floyd could be doing the same with Martinez w/o retiring.

I think its unreasonable to match Floyd to a prime Hagler at 160 just as I thought in Haglers time that it was unreasonable to expect him to fight Michael Spinks at 175.

Would push floyd to the very limit though! It was a great era and thats what floyd misses out on hes too good sometimes. When he beat cotto i thought he did it easy and then i thought hes too good its almost boring..

126
How does Floyd do?

10 guys

Pep not sure why I always add another p.
Armstrong
Sanchez
Saddler
Mab
Saldivar
Pedroza
Chocolate
Attell
Kilbane

135

10 guys

Benny L
Gans
Duran
Armstrong
Ortiz
Oscar
Dejesus
Arguello
Williams
Buchanan

147

10 guys

Robinson
Leonard
Hearns
Duran
Ross
Napoles
Gavilan
Walcott
Griffith
Basilio

Break them down for me?

That is a tough question I think without looking into it in a lot of detail that he could compete and beat all the fighters at 126 and 135lb at 147lb he would lose to Robinson Leonard Hearns and have a close fight with Duran, unsure about Ross, Napoles Gavilan Walcott Griffith and Basilio.