How would you rate Ward's resume?

How good or bad would you say Ward's resume is? Just as a reminder, he's fought and beaten:

Froch

Kessler

Bika

Abraham

Green

Dawson

I'd say it's very good. He's fought and beaten most of the top fighters in his weight class, many of them in dominant fashion. However, there are a couple of names missing, such as Bute and the Dirrells.

As it is though, it's a very good resume, especially when you consider he hasn't even had 30 fights yet.



If Ward had one punch knockout power, I can't think of anyone at 160-175 who would be favorite against him.

His resume is very very good but what's next. It's been a while now...

To raise his stock, he really should be looking at fighting some of the now-perceived danger-men of 175.

He'd have to be a draw assuming he beat those guys.

his resume is brilliant - kessler and froch and dawson - all by probably 3-4 point margins and stopping dawson -

I think he should fight froch again after froch's recent form - it would enhance his legacy to do it again IMO -

moving up to 175 who is there? Super middle is still a much much better division even if lots of its top ten are into their 30's now

Superb. That record puts him among the best ever supermiddles already.

Either new kids on the block come through, like Groves, or he'll have to move up in weight

Extraordinary. Him and Mares has the best resumes of all the young guys. They were brave enough to enter the tournament and this is what they've become. I would say its almost impossible to top their resumes considering their age and the amount of fights they had as a pro.

Nothing special. Froch fair enough, but Froch is a limited, limited fighter. Ward coasted on home victories and is now seemingly in retirement. I think he has a lot to prove, but being on a year long break, he is not going to convince me.

[QUOTE=Gandalf;

Froch is limited in the same way that ward does not concussive power and kessler struggles on the back foot - he is slow (ish) but is actually a very well rounded fighter - he can box, brawl, chase (see dirrell fight - a limited fighter would have been UD'd every time but froch literally chased, literally threw,fouled and MADE a way to win - even if you think dirrell won it was razar thin)

A limited fighter does not been bute inside 6, go toe to toe with kessler twice, beat pascal, taylor, abraham etcetc who are all different types of fighter -

If Ward had more options in his division and was more marketable outside of Oakland he would be considered on par with Mayweather

[QUOTE=oakleyno1;1179279][QUOTE=Gandalf;

Froch is limited in the same way that ward does not concussive power and kessler struggles on the back foot - he is slow (ish) but is actually a very well rounded fighter - he can box, brawl, chase (see dirrell fight - a limited fighter would have been UD'd every time but froch literally chased, literally threw,fouled and MADE a way to win - even if you think dirrell won it was razar thin)

A limited fighter does not been bute inside 6, go toe to toe with kessler twice, beat pascal, taylor, abraham etcetc who are all different types of fighter -[/QUOTE]

Old Taylor, limited Pascal, arms up Abraham, Calzaghe done Kessler. Froch was and is limited. It revealed itself against Ward and that is Ward's big win.

I like Froch, but if that is the pinacle of Wards career then it isn't massive. It really isn't. You should outbox Froch as he has been before.

Gandalfs beef is legit. He beat Kessler sure and his head was one of the best punches in the fight. He beat Carl. Abraham was an overrated hype job when he was a middleweight. More so at 168. A lazy 6 minute fighter. Bika has been a gate keeper for 5 years or more. Allan I wanna stare at me feet Green has been stuck in cement and has been a glorified opponent for the last 5 or so years. That leaves Dawson. A man that had not fought at 168 in 6 years and had to tear sustained muscle off. They should have just nailed both his feet to the floor before the bell sounded. Remember Oscar/Manny? Same thing.Its the reason resumes should be scrutinized. Sorry but its really not a stand out ledger.


Now before all his super fans get their ginch in a winch, I'm not saying he's not a great fighter.

Andre is the 2nd best p4p fighter in the world today and I personally cant wait to see his next fight and hope his shoulder surgery improves whatever movement he couldnt put into his punches before.

Ward hasnt ducked anyone and has a great calm about him.

Ward is still quite young and has many years to add to his legacy.

Lets hope a froch rematch happens or he moves up to light heavy in the next 2years or so.
Either way, he is very difficult to beat at this stage.

Outstanding record. You're always going to get plums like Miles who want to belittle what people have achieved but his record speaks for itself.

If there was a single champion that Ward was yet to topple everyone would be pissing their pants at how amazing he's been in getting there and in so few fights. As it is he's pretty much beaten everyone so it starts to work against him and all that's left to do is slag him off.

I think Ward would give Stevenson a boxing lesson.

Very very good. Have to remember he was still a prospect more or less before the super six, Kessler had to have been favoured there. That was quite a dirty effort from Ward granted, but if we are discussing his resume it's hard to fault him. He's beaten everyone you could expect him to have at 68, I doubt either Bute or Dirrell would have wanted to share a ring with him and that's here nor there given their track record over the last few years. As Fenster said, either Groves emerges as a new threat or Ward may as well move up asap.

Would love to see him fight Kovalev. Don't think the winner of Cloud-Stevenson has anything for him to be honest, he'd shut either out in a likely dull affair.

Ward is the second best p4p fighter in the world and best super middle. He has had the injury but I can see him beating Froch after a warm up. His real challenges may be at light heavy.

I would like to see ward on one of those 24/7 specials or something.

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Originally Posted by imp

I would like to see ward on one of those 24/7 specials or something.

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I do not think he is exciting enough to carry one of those off.

Very good. He's beaten all the names you'd need him to beat at his weight class.

Now he needs to find that challenge that's going to further propel his career

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Originally Posted by Master

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Originally Posted by imp

I would like to see ward on one of those 24/7 specials or something.

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I do not think he is exciting enough to carry one of those off.

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I agree but there is the possibility that he'll use up all of boxing's allotted god shout outs and no one will be able to do it again, ever.

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Originally Posted by Memphis

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Originally Posted by Master

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Originally Posted by imp

I would like to see ward on one of those 24/7 specials or something.

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I do not think he is exciting enough to carry one of those off.

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I agree but there is the possibility that he'll use up all of boxing's allotted god shout outs and no one will be able to do it again, ever.

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Yeah, hes not exciting but he still is a nice guy and perhaps that might even make him more appealing.

Worth a go.

It is very good. It merits his p4p mention. I would caution that to consider it great one necessarily rates Froch and Kessler highly, as they are his two most significant wins.

Froch's resume arguably is close to as good as Ward's, but he'll always be a step behind in ranking because he lost to Ward and he lost to Kessler in their first fight. However, Froch has wins over Pascal, Bute, Andre Dirrell, and Kessler too, the first three of which Ward doesn't have. I know some people thought Froch lost to Dirrell, but at least Froch fought Dirrell. We don't know what would have happened had Dirrell fought Ward.

Where does Ward go now? There doesn't appear to be anyone else at super middleweight for him to face. There are a bunch of contenders at 175 in Stevenson, Kovalev, Hopkins (GB), and the Pascal/Bute winner, but if he doesn't need to step up in weight, should he do so and take the additional risk?

GGG is a potential future foe, but GGG has a stacked division to take care of first. I'm not sure why he would jump up to face Ward now, when he could take on the other top guys at middleweight first.

Ward is a very good fighter, but his style of boxing will never give him a large fan base,
ever one he's faced he has beaten them, he has a first class resume.

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Originally Posted by Rantcatrat

It is very good. It merits his p4p mention. I would caution that to consider it great one necessarily rates Froch and Kessler highly, as they are his two most significant wins.

Froch's resume arguably is close to as good as Ward's, but he'll always be a step behind in ranking because he lost to Ward and he lost to Kessler in their first fight. However, Froch has wins over Pascal, Bute, Andre Dirrell, and Kessler too, the first three of which Ward doesn't have. I know some people thought Froch lost to Dirrell, but at least Froch fought Dirrell. We don't know what would have happened had Dirrell fought Ward.

Where does Ward go now? There doesn't appear to be anyone else at super middleweight for him to face. There are a bunch of contenders at 175 in Stevenson, Kovalev, Hopkins (GB), and the Pascal/Bute winner, but if he doesn't need to step up in weight, should he do so and take the additional risk?

GGG is a potential future foe, but GGG has a stacked division to take care of first. I'm not sure why he would jump up to face Ward now, when he could take on the other top guys at middleweight first.

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Dirrell is a basket case, who says he wanted to fight Ward at any point? It would have happened if the super six had panned out differently, and I'd agree that's a hard style for Ward but he's so much tougher upstairs. Bute for all we know was fairly content being fed mid level guys in his backyard until the Froch beatdown, you don't think Ward would've taken that fight instead? He's in a bad spot because guys he beats are still worth a lot more money than he is, it's hardly a knock on his resume surely.

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Originally Posted by p4pking

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Originally Posted by Rantcatrat

It is very good. It merits his p4p mention. I would caution that to consider it great one necessarily rates Froch and Kessler highly, as they are his two most significant wins.

Froch's resume arguably is close to as good as Ward's, but he'll always be a step behind in ranking because he lost to Ward and he lost to Kessler in their first fight. However, Froch has wins over Pascal, Bute, Andre Dirrell, and Kessler too, the first three of which Ward doesn't have. I know some people thought Froch lost to Dirrell, but at least Froch fought Dirrell. We don't know what would have happened had Dirrell fought Ward.

Where does Ward go now? There doesn't appear to be anyone else at super middleweight for him to face. There are a bunch of contenders at 175 in Stevenson, Kovalev, Hopkins (GB), and the Pascal/Bute winner, but if he doesn't need to step up in weight, should he do so and take the additional risk?

GGG is a potential future foe, but GGG has a stacked division to take care of first. I'm not sure why he would jump up to face Ward now, when he could take on the other top guys at middleweight first.

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Dirrell is a basket case, who says he wanted to fight Ward at any point? It would have happened if the super six had panned out differently, and I'd agree that's a hard style for Ward but he's so much tougher upstairs. Bute for all we know was fairly content being fed mid level guys in his backyard until the Froch beatdown, you don't think Ward would've taken that fight instead? He's in a bad spot because guys he beats are still worth a lot more money than he is, it's hardly a knock on his resume surely.

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What your saying Ward is not entertaining.!;)

Look how long JC stayed at supermiddleweight.

There should be no pressure for ward to move up in weight if there is still money in a froch rematch.

Any weight ward moves into is a problem for everyone else.

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Originally Posted by Dia bando

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Originally Posted by p4pking

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Originally Posted by Rantcatrat

It is very good. It merits his p4p mention. I would caution that to consider it great one necessarily rates Froch and Kessler highly, as they are his two most significant wins.

Froch's resume arguably is close to as good as Ward's, but he'll always be a step behind in ranking because he lost to Ward and he lost to Kessler in their first fight. However, Froch has wins over Pascal, Bute, Andre Dirrell, and Kessler too, the first three of which Ward doesn't have. I know some people thought Froch lost to Dirrell, but at least Froch fought Dirrell. We don't know what would have happened had Dirrell fought Ward.

Where does Ward go now? There doesn't appear to be anyone else at super middleweight for him to face. There are a bunch of contenders at 175 in Stevenson, Kovalev, Hopkins (GB), and the Pascal/Bute winner, but if he doesn't need to step up in weight, should he do so and take the additional risk?

GGG is a potential future foe, but GGG has a stacked division to take care of first. I'm not sure why he would jump up to face Ward now, when he could take on the other top guys at middleweight first.

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Dirrell is a basket case, who says he wanted to fight Ward at any point? It would have happened if the super six had panned out differently, and I'd agree that's a hard style for Ward but he's so much tougher upstairs. Bute for all we know was fairly content being fed mid level guys in his backyard until the Froch beatdown, you don't think Ward would've taken that fight instead? He's in a bad spot because guys he beats are still worth a lot more money than he is, it's hardly a knock on his resume surely.

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What your saying Ward is not entertaining.!;)

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I'm always entertained by boxing at a high level, but yes even I don't relish watching him fight and totally understand some people not liking him at all. He's a very smart fighter, clearly the 2nd best boxing brain out there imo, but just doesn't have the physical tools to put any sizzle on top of it all. He was trying to be Roy Jones for a while before he fought anyone half decent and it got him in big trouble. If he was just a tad faster, or had a bit more pop he would be torturing guys.

You can't factor in entertainment value when judging a fighters record. It's just simple facts and figures.

Ward is about as genuine a world champ you can get in this pathetic multi-champ boxing world. He's not only beat his closest rivals he has formlines that put him above all the top men he hasn't faced.

Who wants to list supermiddles with better records? Lets go

Quite true, but entertainment value does clearly affect the ability to land fights so it's not unrelated. If he were as popular as Froch, maybe that rematch would already have happened in the States, or Bute would've fought him first instead, etc etc.

If I'm Froch, I wouldn't take on Ward again until I fought every other person out there because it appears Froch is better than everyone else, but Ward. Sometimes one guy's style is another guy's foil. Froch can beat Groves and unify with Stieglitz. Give Bute a rematch if Bute beats Pascal. Face Kessler again if Kessler wants another go. All those matches are more winnable for Froch and make him as much money.

Ward might only have the option of jumping up. Right?

Also, if Ward is number two p4p, how high is Froch ranked? He has to be top ten or borderline top ten.

I like froch.

But the smart move as Rant says is to bide his time and leave ward until last..the money he can make elsewhere will finish off his career and he can then step up to light heavy for his last couple of fights.

Ward has achieved so much in a short time frame,

One of the best at 168 of all time.

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Originally Posted by Memphis

Outstanding record. You're always going to get plums like Miles who want to belittle what people have achieved but his record speaks for itself.

If there was a single champion that Ward was yet to topple everyone would be pissing their pants at how amazing he's been in getting there and in so few fights. As it is he's pretty much beaten everyone so it starts to work against him and all that's left to do is slag him off.

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There are fighters that Ward should be fighting now. Instead all he wants are tune up fights. Ward had the easiest time in the super six and fought limited fighters. Froch has shown how to beat Kessler fairly, but Ward simply butted him into submission. Ward beat Froch, but Froch can do a lot better than he did.

I really don't see the big deal with Andre Ward and once he steps up to LHW, there are plenty of names, and several with a fair shot of beating him. Kovalev would likely bounce his chin all over the canvas.

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Originally Posted by p4pking

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Originally Posted by Rantcatrat

It is very good. It merits his p4p mention. I would caution that to consider it great one necessarily rates Froch and Kessler highly, as they are his two most significant wins.

Froch's resume arguably is close to as good as Ward's, but he'll always be a step behind in ranking because he lost to Ward and he lost to Kessler in their first fight. However, Froch has wins over Pascal, Bute, Andre Dirrell, and Kessler too, the first three of which Ward doesn't have. I know some people thought Froch lost to Dirrell, but at least Froch fought Dirrell. We don't know what would have happened had Dirrell fought Ward.

Where does Ward go now? There doesn't appear to be anyone else at super middleweight for him to face. There are a bunch of contenders at 175 in Stevenson, Kovalev, Hopkins (GB), and the Pascal/Bute winner, but if he doesn't need to step up in weight, should he do so and take the additional risk?

GGG is a potential future foe, but GGG has a stacked division to take care of first. I'm not sure why he would jump up to face Ward now, when he could take on the other top guys at middleweight first.

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Dirrell is a basket case, who says he wanted to fight Ward at any point? It would have happened if the super six had panned out differently, and I'd agree that's a hard style for Ward but he's so much tougher upstairs. Bute for all we know was fairly content being fed mid level guys in his backyard until the Froch beatdown, you don't think Ward would've taken that fight instead? He's in a bad spot because guys he beats are still worth a lot more money than he is, it's hardly a knock on his resume surely.

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Agreed. Ward-Dirrell was scheduled before Dirrell pulled out of the Super 6, iirc that was when Green stepped in as Dirrell's replacement. Since then he's become an irrelevance because of a lack of activity. There wasn't really a window for Ward to fight Bute either as Bute fought Froch a few months after Froch-Ward. It can't be a knock on Ward that those 2 fights didn't happen.

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Originally Posted by Cressa121

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Originally Posted by p4pking

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Originally Posted by Rantcatrat

It is very good. It merits his p4p mention. I would caution that to consider it great one necessarily rates Froch and Kessler highly, as they are his two most significant wins.

Froch's resume arguably is close to as good as Ward's, but he'll always be a step behind in ranking because he lost to Ward and he lost to Kessler in their first fight. However, Froch has wins over Pascal, Bute, Andre Dirrell, and Kessler too, the first three of which Ward doesn't have. I know some people thought Froch lost to Dirrell, but at least Froch fought Dirrell. We don't know what would have happened had Dirrell fought Ward.

Where does Ward go now? There doesn't appear to be anyone else at super middleweight for him to face. There are a bunch of contenders at 175 in Stevenson, Kovalev, Hopkins (GB), and the Pascal/Bute winner, but if he doesn't need to step up in weight, should he do so and take the additional risk?

GGG is a potential future foe, but GGG has a stacked division to take care of first. I'm not sure why he would jump up to face Ward now, when he could take on the other top guys at middleweight first.

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Dirrell is a basket case, who says he wanted to fight Ward at any point? It would have happened if the super six had panned out differently, and I'd agree that's a hard style for Ward but he's so much tougher upstairs. Bute for all we know was fairly content being fed mid level guys in his backyard until the Froch beatdown, you don't think Ward would've taken that fight instead? He's in a bad spot because guys he beats are still worth a lot more money than he is, it's hardly a knock on his resume surely.

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Agreed. Ward-Dirrell was scheduled before Dirrell pulled out of the Super 6, iirc that was when Green stepped in as Dirrell's replacement. Since then he's become an irrelevance because of a lack of activity. There wasn't really a window for Ward to fight Bute either as Bute fought Froch a few months after Froch-Ward. It can't be a knock on Ward that those 2 fights didn't happen.

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Not a knock on Ward, but it doesn't change the fact that Froch has wins over Bute and Dirrell, and Ward doesn't.

The main question we've been asking for the last year is where does Ward go from here? Dirrell is out of the mix at 168 due to inactivity. Ward already beat Bika and Froch, the other titleholders. The only other fight at 168 that Ward could take would be Anthony Dirrell, assuming he is actually fighting these days, unless, of course, Groves beats Froch. After that, unfortunately, he doesn't have much choice but to jump to 175.