Top 10? Top 15? Top 20?
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Top 10? Top 15? Top 20?
Too early to rank, his career ain't over yet.
He isn't number one.Quote:
Originally Posted by beenKOed
He is 100% number one or two based on defence, but it's hard to rank him number one of all time due to his attack, he does just enough sometimes.
Ali for instance in his youth was a nightmare with his movement and defence, plus he had the attack.
As for countering, Floyd is up there but I'd rank Willie Pep ahead of him because of his huge number of rounds and his decent knockout ratio of 27% in 241 fights.
Which is more knockouts than Floyd has fights. So you gotta imagine that doing that kind of boxing that amount of times makes you the best and it definitely does in this case.
I'd say he will fall somewhere in the top ten.
Quote:
Originally Posted by VendettosHe isn't number one.Quote:
Originally Posted by beenKOed
He is 100% number one or two based on defence, but it's hard to rank him number one of all time due to his attack, he does just enough sometimes.
Ali for instance in his youth was a nightmare with his movement and defence, plus he had the attack.
As for countering, Floyd is up there but I'd rank Willie Pep ahead of him because of his huge number of rounds and his decent knockout ratio of 27% in 241 fights.
Which is more knockouts than Floyd has fights. So you gotta imagine that doing that kind of boxing that amount of times makes you the best and it definitely does in this case.
I'd say he will fall somewhere in the top ten.
LOL I actually Christian Bale's voice when I read your post, made the post way cooler LOL
Take a chance my fellow boxing fan, where is he going to wind up. I think top 15 now and if he keeps the ZERO, top 10.Quote:
Originally Posted by bradlee180
You won't be able to properly rank him until he's been long retired. When all the bullshit is forgotten and people can look at him objectively.
Personally, I think he's the greatest in-ring talent of all time and probably one of the last true greats we're going to see, judging by the diminished popularity of boxing and the rise of other combat sports like MMA.
There's too much ill-will towards him to really judge him properly. There are still a lot of people who believe he spent his whole career ducking and dodging the best fighters (something that is simply not true and easily dispelled if anyone was to do any bit of research). Personally, I think he's a douche bag, but to find the combination of skill, boxing IQ, discipline, physical gifts, heart, determination, ect, you have to go all the way back to Sugar Ray Robinson.
There's Ray Robinson and Floyd, and then there's everyone else. Putting all the nonsense about who ducked who, whatever aside, those are the two greatest fighters to ever get in the ring.
I dont think keeping the 0 moves him up. No doubt he is the best boxer of our generation but he has been handpicking his opponents late in his career to ensure he keeps his 0. I mean take for example Sugar Ray. Finished his career with 20 losses or so but I dont think that makes much of a difference to his legacy. The majority of these losses were well after he past his best and just needed the money. Floyd aint gonna have to do that.Quote:
Originally Posted by beenKOedTake a chance my fellow boxing fan, where is he going to wind up. I think top 15 now and if he keeps the ZERO, top 10.Quote:
Originally Posted by bradlee180
Fighters Id have ahead of him are the 2 sugar rays, Duran and Hagler. Theres probably more but havent seen much footage of all the old guys so dont want to comment. I also think that Rigo could be better then him too and if he can move up in weight and beat some of the best at featherweight there is certainly an argument. Did Floyd ever fight anyone as dangerous as Donaire? Corrales maybe?
He is certainly in the top 10. In this new age, with stronger, faster and better training regimens, to do what he has done, he has to be a top 10.
Where in the top 10 is up for debate. But, the top 10 is a who's who....
My top 10 list, in no order, has to have:
JCC Sr.
Ali
Joe Louis
Sugar Ray Robinson
Carmen Bassilio
Willie Pep
El Finito Lopez
Mike Tyson
Jack Johnson
Mayweather...
Hagler/Leonard/Sanchez/Marciano/Lewis/Hopkins have honorable mention.
Willie pep fought alot of fights but should we also be thinking about the quality of opponents each fighter has faced?!
This era is so different now because so much money is involved!
I hate the fact the top fighters only fight twice a year compared to the amount of fights the old era had.
Ditto. Its a lot easier to lose against a below average fighter when you are fighting every month.Quote:
Originally Posted by imp
Listen, Yank, your country is not the whole world.Quote:
,judging by the diminished popularity of boxing and the rise of other combat sports like MMA.
There's 195 other countries in the world, and 79 countries sent Boxing teams to the Olympics. Womens Boxing is in the Olympics now.
In the USA, Boxing may not be as big as it once was, and MMA is mainstream in the USA, but worldwide, Boxing is massive, and MMA is basically non-existent.
Boxing puts on 20 thousand pro fights each year, the main org, UFC, puts on only about 220 pro fights per year. And the paydays at the top of the respective sports are beyond comparison.
No. Someone'll come along.Quote:
probably one of the last true greats we're going to see,
Someone ALWAYS does.
Floyd doesn't train any different than fighters from over 50 years ago...Quote:
In this new age, with stronger, faster and better training regimens, to do what he has done,
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradlee180
First off limey, I'm not a "yank".
Secondly, where is the next p4p great going to come from. England? Don't make me laugh.
There'll always be good boxing talents in the sport, but if you're talking upper-echelon skill, guys like Mayweather, SRR, ect, they're going to be fewer and far between.
You say boxing's always going to be around strong because it's been around for 100 years. So what? The horse and buggy was around for hundreds of years, and how many of them do you see coming down your streets? Times change. Boxing has never had another fight sport compete with it seriously before until the last few years with MMA.
Like it or not, boxing has lost the battle of public perception. The best boxers are no longer the baddest men on the planet: it's now the UFC champs. Tens of thousands of young kids - potential boxing champs - are going to their local MMA gym instead. And with the rise in popularity of black athletes in the UFC - champions like Jon Jones and Demetrius Johnson - they're going to take a lot of black athletes from boxing. This is going to have serious ramifications down the road.
And you know why boxing is going down the fucking toilet? Because boxing's greatest get no fucking respect. Floyd is AT LEAST a top 3 in-ring talent of all time, and very few people seem to appreciate it. Boxing geniuses like Rigondeux and SOG get shunned by the networks and general public. The Sweet Science doesn't sell. People would rather see hard-headed C-level fighters give each other brain damage (Gatti/Ward).
Are you a Canadian?! A citizen of the colonial power known as Canada because that burg ain't even a real country.Quote:
First off limey, I'm not a "yank".
Secondly, where is the next p4p great going to come from. England? Don't make me laugh.
I'm not from Great Britain.
I am from the us and i have to disagree with you Beanflicker the ppv have been going down. UFC is peaking read sherdog or other sites the sport not going to take over. Also Boxing still has the money i mean Klistcho's make more money then Silva, Jones and Gsp put together. Its not big anywere else but usa its died out in other countries mma is never going take over because its rules make lay and pray a way to win. Its not like a streat fight anymore it has alot of fucking rules and Cain ain't the baddest man around i mean he avenged his lose but he was iced by a guy with ok boxing ability i think you are going way overboard dude. The atheletes in mma arent even A class really maybe a few but thats about it. I mean if mma doesn't go world wide which i pretty sure it wont then how can it take over.
Top 10 obviously. And probably number 1 or 2. Only prime May vs prime Manny could have determined that one but sadly we will never know who the greatest boxer was :(
I'm not willing to say the ZERO doesn't mean that much or can be dismissed that easily. Even though Floyd has shopped around for some easy fights, the 0 would be impressive in any era, after 45 fights.Quote:
Originally Posted by SilkeyjoeI dont think keeping the 0 moves him up. No doubt he is the best boxer of our generation but he has been handpicking his opponents late in his career to ensure he keeps his 0. I mean take for example Sugar Ray. Finished his career with 20 losses or so but I dont think that makes much of a difference to his legacy. The majority of these losses were well after he past his best and just needed the money. Floyd aint gonna have to do that.Quote:
Originally Posted by beenKOedTake a chance my fellow boxing fan, where is he going to wind up. I think top 15 now and if he keeps the ZERO, top 10.Quote:
Originally Posted by bradlee180
Fighters Id have ahead of him are the 2 sugar rays, Duran and Hagler. Theres probably more but havent seen much footage of all the old guys so dont want to comment. I also think that Rigo could be better then him too and if he can move up in weight and beat some of the best at featherweight there is certainly an argument. Did Floyd ever fight anyone as dangerous as Donaire? Corrales maybe?
If anyone thinks boxers don't take easy fights throughout their careers, they are fooling themselves. Top boxers aren't fighting as much because they make more money and don't have to.
Given how the amateurs are going id expect the next P4P king to come from Kazackhstan but there's plenty of other opportunities. Rigo and Loma have huge potential to dominate. Miley Garcia looks different class to most out there. People putting Floyd on this
Given how the amateurs are going id expect the next P4P king to come from Kazackhstan but there's plenty of other opportunities. Rigo and Loma have huge potential to dominate. Miley Garcia looks different class to most out there. People putting Floyd on this pedestal seems a bit ridiculous. There will be other all time greats after Floyd goes and no doubt well debate who was better
Vendetto has finally lost it and become a vigilante.Quote:
Originally Posted by OnixQuote:
Originally Posted by VendettosHe isn't number one.Quote:
Originally Posted by beenKOed
He is 100% number one or two based on defence, but it's hard to rank him number one of all time due to his attack, he does just enough sometimes.
Ali for instance in his youth was a nightmare with his movement and defence, plus he had the attack.
As for countering, Floyd is up there but I'd rank Willie Pep ahead of him because of his huge number of rounds and his decent knockout ratio of 27% in 241 fights.
Which is more knockouts than Floyd has fights. So you gotta imagine that doing that kind of boxing that amount of times makes you the best and it definitely does in this case.
I'd say he will fall somewhere in the top ten.
LOL I actually Christian Bale's voice when I read your post, made the post way cooler LOL
Top 20 - 30 :p
Obviously there will emerge a boxer who is better than Floyd. But as of today it's hard to go past Floyd.Quote:
Originally Posted by Silkeyjoe
One thing i would like to point out about Mayweathers comp is what did the fighters he beat go on to do thats was great after he beat them. There are only a few on that list Castillo and Corrales and thats about it he caught alot of his big wins near end of there careers. The new breed wins well not sure the ghost proably won't do any thing Ortiz is shot and done so the Ginger kid is the only one left really to see if he is still going to be a winner. Leonard big wins execpt Hagler went on to do alot shit after there loss Benitez, Duran and Hearns went on to great wins after. Leonard i have ranked 10th and i don't see how Mayweather can pass Leonard because all the top guys he beat went on doing great because they were better fighters and were not just flash in the pan kinda guys.