VINTAGE: Toney vs. McClellan sparring- circa 1990.

Looks like Toney got the better of McClellan here. But G-Man showed something in the early rounds, not round one. Looks like he had Toney figured out- and he did. But he let Toney back into this.

One thing that has followed Toney throughout his career was the fact that hardly anyone remembered he had a left-jab. H ever used it much, but every now and the he would pop it out there and equalize the fight by closing distance and keeping his opponent squared up to land some follow-up combinations.

G-Man was BETTER at fighting on the outside. Don't know why he just didn't do that through this session- he clearly had Toney figured out with it. But he never stuck to that- got tired and flustered after Toney worked behind that jab. But, if he had decided to eat the jab, and still work on the outside, Toney would have had to work harder to follow up his jab with the combinations and he weaved inside.

Good little session.

This was a great session and I always love watching this on YouTube. James was the better fighter, especially on the inside. G-Man could punch and was a very violent man who went for the ko over just winning.

Toney, when in shape, was the type of fighter who gradually took a fight over because he was so clever and slick that the other guy would become hesitant to throw for fear of eating big counters or becoming exhausted. James also had a couple of weaknesses though: 1) he had slow feet and could be frustrated with lots of movement and pitty pat punches similar to how Roy and Montell outpointed him. 2) James had a tendency to be lazy, both during training and during a fight and could therefore be out hustled by less skilled fighters like Drake Thadzi, Dave Tiberi and Montell.

James was at his best against an aggressive power puncher as evidenced in his fights vs Evander, Barkely, Jirov and Prince Charles Williams to name a few. For those reasons I think that G-Man would always do well initially against James and inevitably end up losing in the end. Both were great fighters and two of my favorites from that era though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rds2-iNML00

James will go down as one of the most underrated guys in the sport. When he was in his prime, when he was in shape, his ability was off the charts. He could do everything in the ring, fight from any distance, he was an incredible tactician. And he wasn't even world champ at this point, and look how he moves.

Cool look back in history at two world class boxers, both under a year away from exploding on the scene and winning world titles.

Toney had skills beyond his early years, he had the skills like a veteran Archie Moore when he was in his early 20's.

Toney learned what many fighters today just simply don't: Body Mechanics.

Sure, Floyd has superior technical skills- but Floyd's body mechanics pale in comparison to James Toney.

Ali had fantastic body mechanics.

Pernell Whitaker had excellent body mechanics.

Manny has "ok" body mechanics- Manny just has freakish speed and movement.

But Toney, mixed in with his punching power and technical skills- enhanced by his body mechanics- was a beauty to watch. Natural body mechanics.

What is body mechanics?

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Originally Posted by Master

What is body mechanics?

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The ability to coordinate your entire body into your athletic endeavours. It's called body mechanics.... Mike Tyson touched on it early in his career when people kept asking him about his punching power. Mike said it was his body mechanics that helped him to deliver the punch from the ball of his back-foot and then through his body to his fist.

Body mechanics.

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Originally Posted by ykdadamaja

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Originally Posted by Master

What is body mechanics?

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The ability to coordinate your entire body into your athletic endeavours. It's called body mechanics.... Mike Tyson touched on it early in his career when people kept asking him about his punching power. Mike said it was his body mechanics that helped him to deliver the punch from the ball of his back-foot and then through his body to his fist.

Body mechanics.

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I'm sorry but you don't think Floyd has great body mechanics?

I'll have to disagree with your assessment of the spar too, I think Toney was having his way with McClellan.

McClellan was maybe in the top 5 nastiest punchers P4P of all time, but Toney was the far superior fighter.

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Originally Posted by Beanflicker

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Originally Posted by ykdadamaja

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Originally Posted by Master

What is body mechanics?

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The ability to coordinate your entire body into your athletic endeavours. It's called body mechanics.... Mike Tyson touched on it early in his career when people kept asking him about his punching power. Mike said it was his body mechanics that helped him to deliver the punch from the ball of his back-foot and then through his body to his fist.

Body mechanics.

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I'm sorry but you don't think Floyd has great body mechanics?

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That got me me to ask that question.

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Originally Posted by Beanflicker

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Originally Posted by ykdadamaja

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Originally Posted by Master

What is body mechanics?

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The ability to coordinate your entire body into your athletic endeavours. It's called body mechanics.... Mike Tyson touched on it early in his career when people kept asking him about his punching power. Mike said it was his body mechanics that helped him to deliver the punch from the ball of his back-foot and then through his body to his fist.

Body mechanics.

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I'm sorry but you don't think Floyd has great body mechanics?

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I think Floyd had great body mechanics. One of the better in the business. But Floyd has exceptional fighting skills- this overshadows his body mechanics.

Floyd is good all around, when you look at it- but his superior talent is his skills and ring awareness. His speed is decent, his power is decent, his reflexes are decent, his stamina is decent, his chin is decent, his heart is fairly decent, his body mechanics are great BUT his "skills and technical skills" are EXTRAORDINARY!!!

There is my take!

Floyd Mayweather is boxing-fundamentals on over-drive. Doing the mundane and routine extremely well.

U don't think Floyd has extraordinary stamina?!? I can't remember ever seeing him tired or winded in a fight. I would rate Floyd's stamina as extraordinary, but maybe I'm missing something...

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Originally Posted by mikeeod

U don't think Floyd has extraordinary stamina?!? I can't remember ever seeing him tired or winded in a fight. I would rate Floyd's stamina as extraordinary, but maybe I'm missing something...

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Along with speed and reflexes.

There really isn't anything just "decent" with Floyd, he's gone 18 years undefeated for a reason...

I agree for the most part. The one portion of Floyd's game that I would classify as "only good" (not great) is his power/punch. Tommy Hearns, Lennox Lewis, Tyson, Robinson...etc., had great power, where I feel that Floyd has a good, solid punch that has to be respected, but not feared like the rest of those guys. EVERY other aspect of Floyd's game, in my opinion, is great. The guy is a phenom, for sure.

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Originally Posted by mikeeod

I agree for the most part. The one portion of Floyd's game that I would classify as "only good" (not great) is his power/punch. Tommy Hearns, Lennox Lewis, Tyson, Robinson...etc., had great power, where I feel that Floyd has a good, solid punch that has to be respected, but not feared like the rest of those guys. EVERY other aspect of Floyd's game, in my opinion, is great. The guy is a phenom, for sure.

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Yeah Floyd's power isn't on the level of those guys mentioned, but to be fair to Floyd he was a pretty good boxer/puncher at the lighter weights and before his hand problems (his 130lb record is like 27-0 with 21 KO's or something to that effect), and also Floyd doesn't cut weight and ends up fighting guys with 10-20lb weight advantages or more. Floyd was putting guys away pretty effectively from 130-140.

But yeah, Floyd's punching power at 147-154 leaves a lot to be desired.

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Originally Posted by mikeeod

U don't think Floyd has extraordinary stamina?!? I can't remember ever seeing him tired or winded in a fight. I would rate Floyd's stamina as extraordinary, but maybe I'm missing something...

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Oscar De LaHoya had decent stamina. I think his was better than Floyd's and so too was Mosely. I have seen Floyd gassed on a few occasions, but yet again it was his superior skills and mental edge is hat kept him going.

I'm saying all of this based on Floyd's economical nature- anytime he was pushed to extra, he gasses BUT his skills and ring awareness keeps him going.

Floyd gassed against Emmanuel Burton, Castillo in both fights, ran for the latter rounds vs Judah, and gassed vs Maidana before he caught second win and fought a decent tail end of the figh.

With all of those fighters Mayweather was pressured- De La Hoya was pressured in all of hi fights and always fought to the end except for when he got stopped by Manny and Hopkins- very reasonable stoppages. And vs. Hopkins he wasn't gassed, he got a liver shot.

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Originally Posted by ykdadamaja

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Originally Posted by mikeeod

U don't think Floyd has extraordinary stamina?!? I can't remember ever seeing him tired or winded in a fight. I would rate Floyd's stamina as extraordinary, but maybe I'm missing something...

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Oscar De LaHoya had decent stamina. I think his was better than Floyd's and so too was Mosely. I have seen Floyd gassed on a few occasions, but yet again it was his superior skills and mental edge is hat kept him going.

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Now I'm really confused. U r saying that Oscar, despite fading in his fights vs Whitaker, Mosely, Floyd, Sturm and Tito had better stamina than Floyd?!?

In what fights did u see Floyd tired in?!? He surged in the late rounds vs Zab, Hatton, Oscar, Maidana and Mosely to name a few. The only fight I thought he looked tired in was the first Castillo fight. Ur observations have thrown me off.

We must be seeing different fights, I've never seen Floyd gas out.

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Originally Posted by ykdadamaja

I'm saying all of this based on Floyd's economical nature- anytime he was pushed to extra, he gasses BUT his skills and ring awareness keeps him going.

Floyd gassed against Emmanuel Burton, Castillo in both fights, ran for the latter rounds vs Judah, and gassed vs Maidana before he caught second win and fought a decent tail end of the figh.

With all of those fighters Mayweather was pressured- De La Hoya was pressured in all of hi fights and always fought to the end except for when he got stopped by Manny and Hopkins- very reasonable stoppages. And vs. Hopkins he wasn't gassed, he got a liver shot.

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Did u watch Oscars fights vs Whitaker, Quartey, Sturm, Mosely and Tito?!? I must be deteriorating faster than I thought, because I remember Oscar fading big time in each of those fights. As for the Hop fight, Oscar did ok as long as Hop kept it at a sparring pace, but when Hop cranked the pressure up Oscar wilted almost immediately. Who knows though, from what u r saying happened we may be talking about two different things. I can honestly day I've never seen or heard the point of view that u have from anyone else.

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Originally Posted by ykdadamaja

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Originally Posted by mikeeod

U don't think Floyd has extraordinary stamina?!? I can't remember ever seeing him tired or winded in a fight. I would rate Floyd's stamina as extraordinary, but maybe I'm missing something...

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Oscar De LaHoya had decent stamina. I think his was better than Floyd's and so too was Mosely. I have seen Floyd gassed on a few occasions, but yet again it was his superior skills and mental edge is hat kept him going.

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Congrats on making the most wrong post in message board history. Oscar was always known to gas. It's, like you picked Oscar on purpose to intentionally make the post so wrong.

Pure sex appeal and raw talents. Heavenly.

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Originally Posted by ykdadamaja

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rds2-iNML00

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First time watching, thanks!!