Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
Sound ludicrous, but hear me out.
As much as we all poke fun at Deontay Wilder’s bloated record, it’s highly probably that he could very well be the one to revive interest in the heavyweight division. Arguments over whether “interest” should necessarily include the United States, or whether the rest of the world does just fine without U.S. interest, are older than the hills. But it can hardly be disputed that having U.S. interest in the heavyweight division is better, from a global standpoint, than not having it. So while Wladimir Klitschko continues his “chloroforming” reign over what is sadly a crappy division nowadays, the U.S. yawns… even if the rest of the world fawns over the highly-educated, always-in-shape, albeit boring Ukrainian fighter. We can argue that Wlad doesn’t need the U.S. fans, but it’s an empty argument. Again, more fans is always better than less fans. Besides, it can also be argued that most of the world’s boxers aspire to fight in the well-known “Mecca’s” of boxing, places like Las Vegas, Madison Square Garden, etc.
Enter Wilder. Yes, he has a bloated record. Yes, he is being brought along even slower than Julio Cesar Chavez Jr., early in his career… and that’s saying a lot. Yes, he’s raw, unpolished, with an as of yet untested chin. But he’s an American heavyweight (U.S. heavyweight is more correct, as American encompasses a whole continent). In addition, he’s a fearsome slugger, with one-punch KO power, the type the majority of the boxing fan masses love.
Somehow, Wilder has crept up the rankings, and is now one of three U.S. heavyweights in The Ring top 10 rankings (Jennings and Arreola being the others). Let’s discuss those others. Arreola is a retread, having been around the block more than a few times, and never actually achieved that stardom that some thought he would have. He can be exciting… but he’s always going to be second fiddle to the Klitschkos. Jennings? Yeah, he’s undefeated, but he also poses no danger to Wlad. He’s simply “one of the bunch”. No big deal. His latest fight was anything but memorable, not the kind of stuff people line up to watch.
So that leaves us Wilder. Earned or not, he’s at the top of the rankings (WBC, anyway). Now the ball is in his court. Well, him and his managers, I should say. Pre-season’s over. It’s time to start taking those leaps and bounds forward and start facing the best out there. Maybe, just maybe… Wilder can get enough true tests under his belt to challenge Wlad before Wlad gets too old and retires.
It would be a dream matchup, the type we haven’t had in quite a long time, to have a more polished Deontay (with some at least a couple of credible scalps on his record)… against the longtime champion. But whether we ever get to see this or not, I believe having a champion like Deontay would do a lot toward restoring more of a global interest in the heavyweight division.
Re: Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
Calm?
Comatose is a more apt description to my state of mind regarding the HW's these days.
;)
Re: Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
No doubt he's exciting to watch, and he's beaten some aging guys who once fought for a title, but he needs to be getting better opposition before we even mention a fight between him and the big guy.
I'd actually be quite interested seeing him fight Lucas Browne, they've got a bundle of KOs between them, and both hit very hard. Quick, exciting, and there will definitely by a chin test in there, unless its a KO with the first flurry. Povetkin or Charr could also be potential opponents to see if he can mix around the top-ish level.
Re: Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
I don't think he's The Truth...
He can fight well enough to earn a Top 10 ranking out of a talent pool of over a thousand licensed professional Heavyweight boxers, so that's an accomplishment in itself.
However, I don't think he's the guy to take the Mantle at all to become a dominant Heavyweight Champion though. He's not gonna deliver at that elite level despite all the hype.
Guys with the Goods are eager to get in there and start busting heads.
They want the fame, the recognition as the Big Dog, that they are The Man.
They're not content to lay back wasting their primes fighting pushovers for six f*<king years!
That Zelenoff stunt is Wilder's biggest claim-to-fame yet, and 28 year old Wilder hasn't fought a single guy with a pulse yet in 32 fights over 6 years!
Dead men all.
He'll be exposed worse than Michael Grant.
Good enough for Top 10, not elite Top 3.
Way she goes...
Re: Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bradlee180
That Zelenoff stunt is Wilder's biggest claim-to-fame yet, and 28 year old Wilder hasn't fought a single guy with a pulse yet in 32 fights over 6 years!
Dead men all.
Bit harsh, I think Charlie Z showed more elusiveness than Audley Harrison did to be fair with him. I still think he'd put up a better challenge to Wlad than Shannon Briggs would at this stage.
Re: Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
If Wilder happens to beat Stiverne, odds are he ducks Jennings, Pulev, and is forced to fight Fury and begrudgingly gives a shot to Arreola only through ducking the other top names or just not being able to sell the other bums in the division.
Re: Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
Wilder is the most explosive heavyweight we have ever had that no one is excited about in the history of the division.
What does that say about him?
Re: Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
I think his handlers get 100% of the blame. He'll never get the chance to polish his skills if his handlers don't start putting him in there with real contenders. But that's where the rankings might help nudge the process along. I would like think that even in a sport as corrupt and bewildering as boxing, a top ranking would force you to meet other top contenders. Then again, I'd like to think I'll win the Lottery next week, also.
Re: Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TitoFan
I think his handlers get 100% of the blame. He'll never get the chance to polish his skills if his handlers don't start putting him in there with real contenders. But that's where the rankings might help nudge the process along. I would like think that even in a sport as corrupt and bewildering as boxing, a top ranking would force you to meet other top contenders. Then again, I'd like to think I'll win the Lottery next week, also.
It's our fault as fans because we trash the division so much. But, Wilder had already stepped in with Kelvin Price and Malik Scott- he trashed them. He also stepped in with a Liakovich, and old Liakovich, but he stepped in with him anyways.
He has stepped up his class of fighters. Just a bit. But what you want to do is see him in with a live guy you consider to be dangerous. Well, if you look at the division, there aren't many of them around. So, how long must he wait if title fights are there and no one wants them or has the marketability to seize them?
Everyone knows Wlad is the champ. If Wilder beats Stiverne the only thing he would do to himself is put a target on his back for a trinket that is meaningless in the eyes of Wlad.
But, I would like to see Wilder in with: Fury, Arreola, JENNINGS, Chisora or Wach. Just to see how he responds.
Re: Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ykdadamaja
If Wilder happens to beat Stiverne, odds are he ducks Jennings, Pulev, and is forced to fight Fury and begrudgingly gives a shot to Arreola only through ducking the other top names or just not being able to sell the other bums in the division.
Although I wouldn't call it "ducking", that order would make some sense. First off, a victory over Stiverne (and I don't see any decision wins in Wilder's immediate future) would be a significant achievement. Boxing would at least raise an eyebrow. He's still a bit raw to face someone like Jennings, but Fury or Arreola would be logical next steps. Assuming he gets past those (I see no problem with visualizing a win over Fury), then Jennings and/or Pulev. I don't Wilder himself will be "ducking" anybody, as he certainly doesn't seem to lack for confidence. It's all in what his bumbling handlers cook up for him.
Re: Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ykdadamaja
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TitoFan
I think his handlers get 100% of the blame. He'll never get the chance to polish his skills if his handlers don't start putting him in there with real contenders. But that's where the rankings might help nudge the process along. I would like think that even in a sport as corrupt and bewildering as boxing, a top ranking would force you to meet other top contenders. Then again, I'd like to think I'll win the Lottery next week, also.
It's our fault as fans because we trash the division so much. But, Wilder had already stepped in with Kelvin Price and Malik Scott- he trashed them. He also stepped in with a Liakovich, and old Liakovich, but he stepped in with him anyways.
He has stepped up his class of fighters. Just a bit. But what you want to do is see him in with a live guy you consider to be dangerous. Well, if you look at the division, there aren't many of them around. So, how long must he wait if title fights are there and no one wants them or has the marketability to seize them?
Everyone knows Wlad is the champ. If Wilder beats Stiverne the only thing he would do to himself is put a target on his back for a trinket that is meaningless in the eyes of Wlad.
But, I would like to see Wilder in with: Fury, Arreola, JENNINGS, Chisora or Wach. Just to see how he responds.
It still pisses me off to think about the Malik Scott fight. Here was a chance for Wilder to show that he's trying to move up in opponent quality.... and Scott turns in that pitiful effort. To this day I don't think anyone can say for certain whether that was a legitimate KO, or whether Scott just decided to call it a day.
Regardless, I still think if only Wlad would hang around for 2-3 more years, we could still have a hell of a heavyweight event, the likes of which we haven't seen in years. That's assuming, of course, that Wilder doesn't fall on his face between here and there.
Still... it doesn't hurt to hope!
Re: Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
Quote:
Originally Posted by
beenKOed
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Wilder is the most explosive heavyweight we have ever had that no one is excited about in the history of the division.
What does that say about him?
It says, he makes it look too easy. When we see guys being taken out with single punches on a regular basis, it makes us think 'bum', 'cherry pick', or 'fix'.
So, I think it says more about us than about him, we've been 'sucked in' too many times and have become..skeptics.
If he keeps making it look too easy, I don't think he'll ever get the respect he could/might deserve. What I mean is his success would be attributed to the sorry state of the heavyweight division.
Interesting point. Agreed on the point of us boxing fans becoming skeptical.
It makes for some interesting speculations on how different scenarios would be received from a potential Wilder-Stiverne fight.... IF.... and when.... it ever happens.
(Scenario 1: Wilder KO's Stiverne early)
(Scenario 2: Wilder gets caught, loses to Stiverne by KO/TKO)
(Scenario 3: Fight somehow goes 12 rounds, ends in controversial decision (what else is new?))
(Scenario 4: For some reason, fight ends early (accidental headbutt, one of them is unable to continue, etc)
How would Scenario 1 be received? Would we then be convinced that Wilder is the future of HW boxing? Or would we dismiss Stiverne as just another bum?
How about Scenario 2? Would we dismiss Wilder as an overhyped bum who was finally exposed? Or would we merely say he just learned his first lesson in Boxing 101, and will rise again to challenge for a championship?
Scenario 3 would mostly likely never happen. I just don't see Wilder having enough gas to last through a 12-round fight. Hell... no one's ever taken him into the 5th round.
The skepticism in me feels Scenario 4 would be more than a 50/50 likelihood. Something always manages to go wrong, just when we're most anticipating a finally defining moment.
Re: Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
Did everyone miss Wilders last fight ??? Honestly the division doesn't need heavyweights with more questions than answers or some American riding in on a white Pony to save it, what it needs are young talent willing to fight one another and earn credentials. Gavern got UP, as have many of Wilders lighter opponents when hit with his massively overstated "one punch power". Gavern was mocking him and yelling instructions FFS :-\ Sometimes it never even lands. Come on? How can a guy like Jennings be so easily dismissed while taking risks, fighting and beating contenders, having questions asked but prevailing...and Wilder being hailed as a sensation or some beast while fighting absolutely no one, hardly if at all being pressed or caught clean in adversity and having sparring partners and stunt men served on a platter. HOW is that exciting? Its just all backwards for me. Jennings has shown me more in his last 4,5 fights than Wilder has over 10 or 15, seriously.
You have to step up to rise above, and Wilder has been an exercise in mediocrity and manufacturing if I'm honest. You gotta demand more man and look beyond the packaging and plastic keys being waved in out faces.
Re: Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
Well... it hardly matters. I'm hearing rumblings of Wlad retiring soon, and the whole point was having a challenger that could actually pose a danger to Wlad. That's not gonna come from Jennings, no matter how much we would like it to. Wilder at least represents that homerun possibility, and like typical homerun sluggers, he either knocks it out of the park, or strikes out swinging.
You can dismiss Wilder's record as nothing but a collection of bums, but I don't see how you can dismiss the power of someone who's yet to see the 5th round of any fight.
If Jennings is the next "big thing", then why aren't we making a fight with Wlad already?
Re: Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TitoFan
Well... it hardly matters. I'm hearing rumblings of Wlad retiring soon, and the whole point was having a challenger that could actually pose a danger to Wlad. That's not gonna come from Jennings, no matter how much we would like it to. Wilder at least represents that homerun possibility, and like typical homerun sluggers, he either knocks it out of the park, or strikes out swinging.
You can dismiss Wilder's record as nothing but a collection of bums, but I don't see how you can dismiss the power of someone who's yet to see the 5th round of any fight.
If Jennings is the next "big thing", then why aren't we making a fight with Wlad already?
Sorry bud just color me not convinced at all. I'm not ready to call him a home run slugger either. When he is flattening top 10..top 15 heavyweights I'll bite. I look at going the distance as a plus really. Numbers can be run up and misleading as we've all seen far too many times. That same bomb he is hoping for..counting on.. can be just as disastrous to himself when he has yet to slip a counter combination and have someone in front who refuses to feint over and puts him on his heels.
Maybe we should be making it??? By all accounts Jennings won his title eliminator by beating a top 5 heavyweight by the sanctioning body. Wilder won his eliminator by beating a guy coming off a KO loss..and rated what, 25, 26 th? and with a questionable ending and effort. Its little wonder Scott wore a brown paper bag over his head at the weigh in. I mean really :bag: . Who in the world thought that was a good idea ??? Wilder is where he is because fans love glossy shiny things and have had it pushed down our throats, with all respect. More so because he knows and is packaged by a squirrely man by the name of Al Haymon who frankly is jerking his chain around with delays etc. Is his shot actually signed yet? That's one we deserve and I'm itching for it just like you, but beyond relying on a bomb..I honestly don't think Wilder has the full game to climb his way out of a hole when he faces an actual threat.
Re: Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Spicoli
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TitoFan
Well... it hardly matters. I'm hearing rumblings of Wlad retiring soon, and the whole point was having a challenger that could actually pose a danger to Wlad. That's not gonna come from Jennings, no matter how much we would like it to. Wilder at least represents that homerun possibility, and like typical homerun sluggers, he either knocks it out of the park, or strikes out swinging.
You can dismiss Wilder's record as nothing but a collection of bums, but I don't see how you can dismiss the power of someone who's yet to see the 5th round of any fight.
If Jennings is the next "big thing", then why aren't we making a fight with Wlad already?
Sorry bud just color me not convinced at all. I'm not ready to call him a home run slugger either. When he is flattening top 10..top 15 heavyweights I'll bite. I look at going the distance as a plus really. Numbers can be run up and misleading as we've all seen far too many times. That same bomb he is hoping for..counting on.. can be just as disastrous to himself when he has yet to slip a counter combination and have someone in front who refuses to feint over and puts him on his heels.
Maybe we should be making it??? By all accounts Jennings won his title eliminator by beating a top 5 heavyweight by the sanctioning body. Wilder won his eliminator by beating a guy coming off a KO loss..and rated what, 25, 26 th? and with a questionable ending and effort. Its little wonder Scott wore a brown paper bag over his head at the weigh in. I mean really :bag: . Who in the world thought that was a good idea ??? Wilder is where he is because fans love glossy shiny things and have had it pushed down our throats, with all respect. More so because he knows and is packaged by a squirrely man by the name of Al Haymon who frankly is jerking his chain around with delays etc. Is his shot actually signed yet? That's one we deserve and I'm itching for it just like you, but beyond relying on a bomb..I honestly don't think Wilder has the full game to climb his way out of a hole when he faces an actual threat.
Well... call it a sign of the times. If Wilder had been around when the HW's were actually worth something, no one would be giving him a second look. He'd be considered a circus act, sort of like a big, tall Butterbean, only darker and taller. But the HW division is in the shits... and would-be fans are staying away (or leaving) in droves. It's long been established that it's the HW division that has the power to attract the casual fan, and maybe turn him into a real fan. The division is what... Wlad a bunch of forgettable contenders. They spend more time talking shit and canceling fights than they do actually fighting. The fights themselves are hideously boring. No one separates himself from the pack, because.... well... they just don't. Meanwhile, we've had I forget how many years of Wlad's reign, providing us with epics like Povetkin, Ibragimov, and Haye. My point is most of these guys have had their shot, either at Wlad or his brother. When Wlad finally does retire, it'll be because of sheer boredom.
Re: Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TitoFan
Well... it hardly matters. I'm hearing rumblings of Wlad retiring soon, and the whole point was having a challenger that could actually pose a danger to Wlad. That's not gonna come from Jennings, no matter how much we would like it to. Wilder at least represents that homerun possibility, and like typical homerun sluggers, he either knocks it out of the park, or strikes out swinging.
You can dismiss Wilder's record as nothing but a collection of bums, but I don't see how you can dismiss the power of someone who's yet to see the 5th round of any fight.
If Jennings is the next "big thing", then why aren't we making a fight with Wlad already?
I think its a sad testimony that the moment Vitali retired that scam of a title was not immediately given up for Wlad to fight for. Its a bloody crime given all the horse shit that goes on. Its almost beyond description on the bullshit meter and I dont even like Wlad. If Vitali was not his brother, we would have had an undisputed champion for a change a long time ago.
Re: Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
1. How do you rate Wilders Chances against Klitschko
2. Has Wilder been past the fourth round.
Re: Deontay Wilder could be what the HW division needs
1. Right now, slim to none.
2. No.
Let's see how he does against Stiverne before we finish burying him.
