Rewatching that Ali vs. Holmes fight!

You DO realize that Holmes was holding back a LOT in that fight, right?

Now, the Holmes we know is thee most accurate heavyweight champion we have seen in quite some time. In fact, no other HW comes close to his accuracy, especially with a lame duck in front of him.

But, notice how many times in the early rounds Holmes "misses" shots and glances off of Ali's gloves and head.

The only shots that were telling were the body shots. But the body shots straight on for a man that had scarred abdominal muscles like Ali are nothing. Even the punches to the liver and kidney landed on the hip portion and not his true areas.

While we criticize Holmes for beating Ali up that night, fact of the matter was Holmes held back a great deal and could have REALLY hurt an ailing Ali.

I think in one of the interviews before the fight Holmes said that he knew Ali was ill. I bet a clause in Ali's contract stated that he had to go a certain amount of rounds for him to get his full purse.

Thanks, Dick King!

Very True

Mr. Larry Holmes fought very non-aggressive, and let Mr. Ali stay upright.

You could see that Larry took it easy on the former Champion.

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Originally Posted by Bill Paxtom

Very True

Mr. Larry Holmes fought very non-aggressive, and let Mr. Ali stay upright.

You could see that Larry took it easy on the former Champion.

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Angelo Dundee: "I'm the Chief 2nd! I'm the Chief 2nd! I stop the fight!" The Mouth would have been sparked out in the next round if it had continued.

Larry Holmes: "Hey, sucka! I'm GOD! I'm GOD!"

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Originally Posted by Bill Paxtom

Very True

Mr. Larry Holmes fought very non-aggressive, and let Mr. Ali stay upright.

You could see that Larry took it easy on the former Champion.

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For one time I agree with your Ali assessment. Watch the last Hurrah, even Holmes admitted that Ali was a lot slower and spoke more slowly than he normally does. He knew he was going in there with a lame duck. And, knowing Ali, like how he did with Frazier, talked to Holmes one on one to let him know that this fight is a sham and I won't be able to make it.

Thanks to Don King.

Turn to minute 36:00 and listen to what Holmes had to say about Ali's present state and condition. Even Holmes was sad after the fight because he didn't want to go in there to do it, but most likely Ali was forced to do it and he had to up the pressure after a few rounds to try an end a boring fight.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IuBhmBjycrE

Why would you want to watch that mismatch only a sadist like bill Paxton would get enjoyment from it.

For the record Holmes tried to knock out Ali.

Any Ali post-suspension gets spanked by Larry Holmes. One of the true greats.

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Originally Posted by Beanflicker

Any Ali post-suspension gets spanked by Larry Holmes. One of the true greats.

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Let's not push it. Ali against foreman could handle Holmes.

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Originally Posted by ykdadamaja

You DO realize that Holmes was holding back a LOT in that fight, right?

Now, the Holmes we know is thee most accurate heavyweight champion we have seen in quite some time. In fact, no other HW comes close to his accuracy, especially with a lame duck in front of him.

But, notice how many times in the early rounds Holmes "misses" shots and glances off of Ali's gloves and head.

The only shots that were telling were the body shots. But the body shots straight on for a man that had scarred abdominal muscles like Ali are nothing. Even the punches to the liver and kidney landed on the hip portion and not his true areas.

While we criticize Holmes for beating Ali up that night, fact of the matter was Holmes held back a great deal and could have REALLY hurt an ailing Ali.

I think in one of the interviews before the fight Holmes said that he knew Ali was ill. I bet a clause in Ali's contract stated that he had to go a certain amount of rounds for him to get his full purse.

Thanks, Dick King!

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So this means Holmes held back against a man that shouldn't have been allowed to fight.

Its a weird one because Ali went on to fight Berbwick after Holmes and looked half decent in comparison.

People speak of the Holmes fight as Alis last......

It wasn't ;)

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Originally Posted by smashup

Its a weird one because Ali went on to fight Berbwick after Holmes and looked half decent in comparison.

People speak of the Holmes fight as Alis last......

It wasn't ;)

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He went the distance with a near dead Ali. And Holmes fought a half dead Ali. Holmes went to 10 and Berbick couldn't finish it, but when Holmes fought Berbick he went the distance- another one of Don King's mismatches for the HW division for Larry Holmes.

We complain about Wlad and his "suspect" list of challengers, but Holmes was equally suspect and even more so. At least Wlad's excuse was that no one else was out there, and the same can be said about Holmes too. But Holmes struggled to win some of the tougher fights when Wlad, at this time, is totally obliterating opposition he is SUPPOSED to beat.

Wlad kills Berbick, Evangelista, half dead Ali, Spinks, Frazier, Bey and a host of others.

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Originally Posted by Master

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Originally Posted by Beanflicker

Any Ali post-suspension gets spanked by Larry Holmes. One of the true greats.

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Let's not push it. Ali against foreman could handle Holmes.

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That's a weird example to bring up haha.

Larry was too good, only prime Ali could compete against prime Larry.

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Originally Posted by Beanflicker

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Originally Posted by Master

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Originally Posted by Beanflicker

Any Ali post-suspension gets spanked by Larry Holmes. One of the true greats.

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Let's not push it. Ali against foreman could handle Holmes.

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That's a weird example to bring up haha.

Larry was too good, only prime Ali could compete against prime Larry.

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I am only saying that because Larry was his sparring partner at the time. :)

I think Larry only went to '74 with Ali, from his amateur days until about a year into his pro career. By the time they fought 6 years later Larry was a champ and battle-proven vet, so it was two different Holmes'. I just don't think Ali had the juice post-suspension to beat a prime Holmes. He couldn't win that jab battle and I don't think he could outfight Larry.

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Originally Posted by Beanflicker

I think Larry only went to '74 with Ali, from his amateur days until about a year into his pro career. By the time they fought 6 years later Larry was a champ and battle-proven vet, so it was two different Holmes'. I just don't think Ali had the juice post-suspension to beat a prime Holmes. He couldn't win that jab battle and I don't think he could outfight Larry.

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Ali would find a way.

Man vs. Boy

Larry could have ended it 'anytime' that he wanted to.

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Originally Posted by Bill Paxtom

Man vs. Boy

Larry could have ended it 'anytime' that he wanted to.

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That is what they said when Ali was going to fight Foreman, Frazier and Liston.

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Originally Posted by Master

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Originally Posted by Beanflicker

I think Larry only went to '74 with Ali, from his amateur days until about a year into his pro career. By the time they fought 6 years later Larry was a champ and battle-proven vet, so it was two different Holmes'. I just don't think Ali had the juice post-suspension to beat a prime Holmes. He couldn't win that jab battle and I don't think he could outfight Larry.

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Ali would find a way.

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It's possible.

Those that felt Ali, before the even slightest onset of Parkinsons, would have lost to Holmes in Holmes's prime must think that the Holmes/Spinks fight was the GREATEST robbery of all times.

Ali had 10 times the boxing skill and movement as did Spinks.