How does he do against another pure boxer?
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How does he do against another pure boxer?
What/who do you consider to be a pure boxer?
I never really quite know what this means either. People often say pure boxer to describe a guy with a good jab who can't fight inside, as if there is somehow less skill involved there or something. How would Floyd do against a guy as skilled and well rounded as himself, with the same ability to adapt? Well, who would that have been in his career exactly?
Theoretically, how would he do with the James Toney that fought at 168? Billy Graham was a 'pure' boxer at 47; how would that play out? Del Flanagan?Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
I mean, it's not like Floyd has only fought sluggers.
Canelo and Cotto were both boxer-punchers.
Well then, with that definition, Floyd isn't a pure boxer, because he can definitely fight inside.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
I don't think there are many, if any, people in or around Floyd's weight class who are as well-rounded and adaptable as he is.
I've heard people say this, and I think it fits: "Floyd is playing chess, while everyone else is playing checkers".
Would you classify JMM and Genaro Hernandez as boxers? If so he handled himself quite well against them and Canelo.
I already said this, but I would consider Canelo a boxer-puncher.Quote:
Originally Posted by jon09
JMM was/is more of a counterpuncher than boxer. Hernandez is a great example of a pure boxer though. Floyd beat Genaro very badly to win his first title, but to be fair that was Genaro's last fight and by his own admission he was done and not fully interested.Quote:
Originally Posted by jon09
Canelo isn't really much of a boxer either, in my opinion. I feel like pure boxers are guys who box behind a jab, and boxer punchers are guys who do that but add the threat of one punch power (Tommy Hearns). Canelo is a very good counterpuncher, but I wouldn't consider him a boxer. My examples of fighters/styles are:
Boxer: Pernell Whitaker, Larry Holmes, Muhammed Ali, Paul Spadafora, Stevie Johnston
Boxer/Puncher: Tommy Hearns, Oscar de la Hoya, Lennox Lewis, Junior Jones, Kennedy McKinney, (prime) Tito Trinidad
Pressure Fighter: Julio Ceasar Chavez, Miguel Cotto, Ricky Hatton, Kostya Tszyu, Jose Luis Castillo, Wayne Mcollough, (prime) Antonio Margarito, Paul Williams
Counter puncher: Canelo Alvarez, JMM, Austin Trout, Lara, Quintana
Athletic Phenom: Roy Jones jr., Manny Paquaiou
Puncher: Tyson, Foreman, Julian Jackson, Randall Bailey, Nigel Benn
All around/multi-dimensional: BHOP, Floyd, Hagler, Duran, Leonard, Evander, James Toney
There are plenty of other fighters who fit into each category, with varying degrees of success due to athleticism, mental toughness, luck, dedication...etc. Back to the original question though, Floyd does well against any style, and it will take a truly great effort or a horrific night (for Floyd) to beat Floyd. Against pure boxers Floyd will use speed, angles, counterpunching, feints...etc. to make the opponent fight his fight. Floyd is extremely versatile and would be hard for anyone in history to beat.
Thomas Hearns or Paul Williams could try and be pure boxers to try and beat Floyd. It would be great to see Floyd adapt and try to beat these guys.
It would be like Bruce Lee trying to work out and beat Kareem Abdul-Jabbar.
As effective as a past his prime Oscar was vs Floyd using the jab, I just can't see Floyd doing anything with a prime Tommy Hearns. Hearns was able to outclass Ray Leonard behind that jab, and that is saying something. As good as Floyd is, at 147 he doesn't have the strength and power Ray did to come from behind . Floyd's best weight was 130-140, and the guys I would've loved to see him fight at those weights are:Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
1. Sweet Pea Whitaker
2. Julio Ceasar Chavez
3. Roberto Duran
4. Aaron Pryor
5. Prime Oscar
I'm a huge fan of Floyd, but I don't see him as the definite winner or even favorite over any of those guys. Not saying he doesn't win, just saying there is a really good chance he loses.
Hearns could be pretty wild in his attacks Floyd would make him pay IMO also most people who have been in with Floyd all say he's got decent enough power to make you think twice about attacking and missing. Floyd just does enough to win I bet his ko% would be a lot higher if he had took a lose early in his careerQuote:
Originally Posted by mikeeodAs effective as a past his prime Oscar was vs Floyd using the jab, I just can't see Floyd doing anything with a prime Tommy Hearns. Hearns was able to outclass Ray Leonard behind that jab, and that is saying something. As good as Floyd is, at 147 he doesn't have the strength and power Ray did to come from behind . Floyd's best weight was 130-140, and the guys I would've loved to see him fight at those weights are:Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
1. Sweet Pea Whitaker
2. Julio Ceasar Chavez
3. Roberto Duran
4. Aaron Pryor
5. Prime Oscar
I'm a huge fan of Floyd, but I don't see him as the definite winner or even favorite over any of those guys. Not saying he doesn't win, just saying there is a really good chance he loses.
I don't remember Tommy being wild at all. His jab was especially accurate, from all the fights I can remember seeing. if you look at Tommys performance against Leonard, who was just as good and fast but bigger and stronger than Floyd, it's hard to see Tommy getting discouraged by a guy who just isn't much of a puncher at welter. Styles make fights and this is one where Floyd looks bad.Quote:
Originally Posted by g3org3Hearns could be pretty wild in his attacks Floyd would make him pay IMO also most people who have been in with Floyd all say he's got decent enough power to make you think twice about attacking and missing. Floyd just does enough to win I bet his ko% would be a lot higher if he had took a lose early in his careerQuote:
Originally Posted by mikeeodAs effective as a past his prime Oscar was vs Floyd using the jab, I just can't see Floyd doing anything with a prime Tommy Hearns. Hearns was able to outclass Ray Leonard behind that jab, and that is saying something. As good as Floyd is, at 147 he doesn't have the strength and power Ray did to come from behind . Floyd's best weight was 130-140, and the guys I would've loved to see him fight at those weights are:Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
1. Sweet Pea Whitaker
2. Julio Ceasar Chavez
3. Roberto Duran
4. Aaron Pryor
5. Prime Oscar
I'm a huge fan of Floyd, but I don't see him as the definite winner or even favorite over any of those guys. Not saying he doesn't win, just saying there is a really good chance he loses.
Huge fan of Floyd here, as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeeodAs effective as a past his prime Oscar was vs Floyd using the jab, I just can't see Floyd doing anything with a prime Tommy Hearns. Hearns was able to outclass Ray Leonard behind that jab, and that is saying something. As good as Floyd is, at 147 he doesn't have the strength and power Ray did to come from behind . Floyd's best weight was 130-140, and the guys I would've loved to see him fight at those weights are:Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
1. Sweet Pea Whitaker
2. Julio Ceasar Chavez
3. Roberto Duran
4. Aaron Pryor
5. Prime Oscar
I'm a huge fan of Floyd, but I don't see him as the definite winner or even favorite over any of those guys. Not saying he doesn't win, just saying there is a really good chance he loses.
How do you think he fairs against Mosley at LW?
That's one that stands out as a very realistic, possible Floyd loss because Shane was nothing short of devastating at that weight.
I'm well aware of the lack of Mosleys world class opponents at that weight, so let's just call it the GGG syndrome for now.
Floyd has no power at welterweight and he would not be able to hurt Hearns.
Super Sugar Shane may beat Floyd at lightweight.
On PEDS?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Or injection in hands. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by impOn PEDS?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
What particularly fast fighters did Floyd not fight, other than Pacquiao and Khan?
Casamajor was a southpaw boxer.Quote:
Originally Posted by VG_Addict
Floyd would avoid Hearns at all costs. Not that he couldn't find a way to beat him. Everyone has a weakness, but Hearns was a tall, hard punching welter that knew how to use his reach and and straight punches and didn't just throw it away to fight a short mans fight (like corrales or paul williams). Hearns was mean and in order to go in and out work hearns, floyd would have to go into the lions den. I just dont see him risking it.