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... Depending on whether or not Joshua beats Parker, which he will, in this order:
1. Povetkin
2. Ruiz Jr.
3. Jarrell Miller
4. Dillian Whyte
5. Dominic Breazeale
6. David Haye
IF they get through any of those, they may be considered an ATG. GOAT!
Then the Lucas Browne's, Fres Oquendo's, Amir Mansour's and so forth may be in the offing until new talent springs up.
I do not think AJ v Wilder will happen this year so these other fights are a long way off.
AJ Wilder next summer at earliest.
That’s the big one that they will build up. Fury Joshua will be bigger if fat boy can get back in shape.....
Why is David Haye on the list?
If he beats Bellew it’s a big money British pay day - and he’ll be dangerous for Joshua for all of 4 minutes after which his toe, knee, bicep, cock or right earlobe will fail on him and he’ll have to throw the towel in
Until Haye retires he is the ONLY other cash cow aside from AJ. I think Haye can probably make more money than Wilder as Champ. I hate to say it, but people want to see Haye and willing to pay money to see Haye.
With that said: You guys know it only is March/April, right? The Wilder/Joshua fight can happen by mid fall- August to mid-October. Which ain't a bad time for travel either.
So on one hand , you put these names down and said if he AJ/Wilder gets through any of them they’re ATG/GOAT, and then you say Haye is on the list because he’s a cash cow?Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
Surely to be considered “up there” it’s anout what you do in the ring, no?
Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
The bar on ATG/GOAT must have been set at an all-time low.
Can't think of a time where it has been worse. AJ should clean up and dominate for many years.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
The bar on ATG/GOAT must have been set at an all-time low.
Haye is a joke and irrelevant if he can not get past a fat big mouth scouse.
You guys said the same about the 90's, which happened to be the GOLDEN ERA of boxing outside of the platinum era of Ali/Frazier/Foreman/Lyle.
Remember folks were saying the 90's era of Holyfield, Bowe, Lewis, McCall, Morrison, Mercer, Moorer, Briggs and the other contenders, were all shiite?
I highly rate Pedvetkin, Ruiz Jr. and Whyte to at least COMPETE in the 90's and mid-70's era. Pedvetkin and Whyte may even win a title in the 90's era.
Let us not be so sour on today's guys.
And as for Haye, I didn't mean to equate him with being a cash cow in terms of him being someone you need to beat to be an ATG. But money still counts for something in boxing. Money shows where the fans respect their fighters. Haye is a wildcard and people pay money for him.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
I don't know, yk.
Holyfield, Lewis: Don't recall anyone ever saying they were "shiite."
Bowe: Underachieving as all hell, and not someone I ever liked... but a motivated, in shape Bowe would've swept the floor with any of your highly rated guys from this era.
Mercer, Moorer: As sturdy and durable as they come. Definitely not "shiite."
McCall: Head case, but dangerous. Shouldn't count, but there's definitely enough 90's guys already that he's not needed on the list.
Morrison: Great white hope. Not much else to say.
Briggs: Ok... "shiite."
Your argument is still paper-thin, claiming that whoever won between Wilder and AJ, all they had to do was beat one of those nondescript guys and he'd be an ATG... maybe even GOAT.
Too science fiction for me.
Povetkin is a very good Boxer, and maybe he would compete in the 90’s and maybe win a title. After all he did in this era. But he’s fucked up his whole legacy and tainted everything he’s ever going to go on to do.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
But Whyte! That’s another story. He’s done fuck all. His best performance was a LOSS.his next best performance was when he went life and death with a guy who has NEVER beat a good Boxer! Not one.
He wouldn’t win a title then, and if he wins one now, that’ll show how bad this era is.
Would you favor Parker over current Haye?Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterCan't think of a time where it has been worse. AJ should clean up and dominate for many years.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
The bar on ATG/GOAT must have been set at an all-time low.
Haye is a joke and irrelevant if he can not get past a fat big mouth scouse.
Povetkin is a definite must fight, I'd add Pulev if the guy is still a fighter and Tyson if he gets on a decent roll. The Browne/ Whyte winner. Ruiz, Hughie and Breazeale.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
It all really depends on the results of other unmade matchups at this time. If Haye beats Bellew does anyone think a Tyson fight can finally be salvaged?
Ruiz and Hughie were set to fight awhile back, maybe they can get it on in the near future. Parker could still be involved in matches against any of these guys, especially against Browne, Ruiz and Hughie.
I'd really like to see Breazeale/ Miller.
These guys need to make some of these fights to build momentum for the winners.
I'd really like to see WBSS type tournaments between guys rated 11-20 in each division to try and establish decent top contenders.
@Freedom is needed here, as I think the toughest fights for these two are fighters who are just starting out, hrgovic and so on... Freedom watches these fellows closer than anyone I think.
I think povetkin was a really good fighter but now he has slowed down quite a lot in his last two fights, I don't think he is close to being a big a threat as he was, despite his size he has had good success v tall guys, bashing wach(cut stoppage though) and a full KO on a certainly decent duhaupass. Still one of the best heavyweights out there but at 38 he is on the slide in my opinion so they could skip him and I don't think it would matter much.
I actually really like big baby Miller and think he has some skill and toughness and could beat wilder or Joshua on the right night, I think he needs to lose a bit of weight and be a bit more explosive rather than his slow draining style, very possible he can't improve beyond his current level though(sad face).
Joshua already blasted Whyte and brezeale so they are not must fights. Andy ruiz could be interesting but the git actually gained weight for his comeback fight... :S
Fred oquendo and James Toney are the two these clowns need to stop dodging!
And if fury comes back then due to him being unbeaten and the guy to halt my dear wladimir he is the biggest(haha) must fight.
I think several heavyweights would have a very good chance of beating Wilder, such as Romanov who knocked him out in the amateurs, as well as Parker, Whyte, Miller, and Breazeale. Wilder has been carefully matched for a reason.Quote:
Originally Posted by palmerq
However, I think the only possible threat to Joshua during the next four or five years would be Hrgovic, and even he would need to improve to have a chance.
Of course, a fit and fully focused Tyson Fury would have a good chance of beating either Wilder or Joshua, but I don't think he'll be the same now, after the long layoff and all his personal problems.
Is James Toney still fighting? Also why is Fres Oquendo still fighting?Quote:
Originally Posted by palmerq
I would put a giant "why" before the 1st question also. ;) ;)
Oquendo has got himself a great deal with the wba, somehow he gets to fight their lesser champ and when he loses/ fails a drugs test he gets a rematch :S..... Good work if you can get it.... He might beat charr though :SQuote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
I can't see Oquendo beating Charr after all this time out. I wouldn't be surprised tho.Quote:
Originally Posted by palmerqOquendo has got himself a great deal with the wba, somehow he gets to fight their lesser champ and when he loses/ fails a drugs test he gets a rematch :S..... Good work if you can get it.... He might beat charr though :SQuote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
Current crop of big lumps are very good (not the list yghjgjvvxbmh made) , plenty of competition for Joshua and wilder (several beat wilder).
History tells us Joshua isn't far away from an upset loss. Tyson was unbeatable in the worst era in history (so all the experts said) then buster happened.
There's always the next guy hidden in plain sight