Boris Burka Row - To BAN or not to BAN? Islamophobia?

Now I don't give a monkies about Boris but i'm sure you all know this is front page news, Boris should be sacked for racism/islamaphobia for calling women who wear the burka "postboxes," however, he wasn't for banning it in full and criticised Denmark in becoming the 10-12th(?) Euro gaff to do so.

I know what the majority of vocal voices here think of muslims/islam in general, so obviously expect most will be in favour of banning it, however, almost all the strong voices on muslim/islam here are freedom of speech advocates, right? Isn't freedom to dress however the funk you want the same as freedom of speech as long as you don't incite violence?

Personally I believe the burka is utterly pathetic, medieval misogynistic nonsense, I feel sympathy for women who live in countries where they constantly fight against this nonsense only to see western countries populated with women "choosing" to. However, I also believe women should be allowed to wear whatever the fuck they want - mini skirt, bin bag or burka? It's their CHOICE!!!

Is this position hypocritical?

I do not think your position is hypocritical because you recognise it is their choice but that you do not like it.

You do not want to ban it do you?

Boris is just an opportunist who wants to stay relevant now that he is a back bencher.

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Originally Posted by Fenster

Now I don't give a monkies about Boris but i'm sure you all know this is front page news, Boris should be sacked for racism/islamaphobia for calling women who wear the burka "postboxes," however, he wasn't for banning it in full and criticised Denmark in becoming the 10-12th(?) Euro gaff to do so.

I know what the majority of vocal voices here think of muslims/islam in general, so obviously expect most will be in favour of banning it, however, almost all the strong voices on muslim/islam here are freedom of speech advocates, right? Isn't freedom to dress however the funk you want the same as freedom of speech as long as you don't incite violence?

Personally I believe the burka is utterly pathetic, medieval misogynistic nonsense, I feel sympathy for women who live in countries where they constantly fight against this nonsense only to see western countries populated with women "choosing" to. However, I also believe women should be allowed to wear whatever the fuck they want - mini skirt, bin bag or burka? It's their CHOICE!!!

Is this position hypocritical?

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Not at all makes perfect sense. Boris and Bannon, Rees-Mogg etc have an agenda and so it is hard to divorce what Boris says from that and his Prime Ministerial ambitions. It is an appeal to the worst kind of Populism. Of course people should be able to discuss the burqka which is not even prescribed by Islam but that does not change the right of people to choose to wear it.


For me it is lie a virtue signaling of actual false modesty it makes men seem as though they are all predators if they cannot look at a face without feeling about sexual attraction, but like you say what are you going to ban next people wearing gorilla suits, mankinis, nuns wearing habits, kids dressed as actual pillar boxes next to their postman pat brother?

It does not really matter what you write people will just make up what they think you think anyway. I can't find it anymore but one of the first threads I started on here was about the failure of multi-culturalism. Then I recommended a book form 2004 by Michael Collins (not the IRA guy ;D) called

"The Likes of Us - A Biography of the White Working Class"

then a couple months later...

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Originally Posted by Beanz

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gandalf

The facts speak for themselves. Stop making excuses for what they have done with silly personal attacks. Many of the white working classes are trapped there and are being assaulted from all angles with nobody to defend them and the 'lucky' ones like me have to alienate themselves and avoid it entirely. But if we criticise it we are a caricature or racist or any insult that you like.

Read this very interesting article, look at the society that remains and tell me that I am a caricature. I am no caricature, I am angry and seething, and it is genuine. Every white English working class person should feel the same rage as we have been truly done over.

The English white working-class and the British elite – From the salt of the earth to the scum of the earth | England calling

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It is a well written blog, something that maybe your own efforts would do well to be directed towards. About 10 years ago Michael Collins wrote a book on this subject

"The Likes of Us - A Biography of the White Working Class"

The point that he made most successfully for me was to point out the hypocrisy of the middle and upper classes who have always been quick to label working class whites as racist. This like many things is completely untrue and an inversion of reality. Working Class white communities have always worked alongside non white immigrants from the English market traders to the Cardiff Dockers to the Glaswegian shipbuilders. For hundreds of years. Somalis,Italians, Jews,West Indians, etc have come to this country and worked alongside us, not the middle and upper classes, and you are right there is justifiable anger, but we should be careful to direct it at those who abuse power and not those disenfranchised alongside us, just because they are not white.

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My view on this is also quite conflicted.

For some reason I look at every single woman no matter the age and find something sexually attractive about her. I have been like that since I was about 13 or 14 years old. I find a lot of my Arabic friends and Indian friends are the same. they look at anything that moves as the expression goes. Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche was famous for saying that the only time a man can be truly just friends with a woman is when there is a severe physical antipathy involved. So for me the Burka is a very good thing.... It stops me from looking at attractive woman who are married which is even worse and also because I am married and it is not a good thing for me either.

I know some people will vehement Lee disagree as it has been stated above that it makes all men look like predators. but it doesn't have to go as Extreme as being a predator because it is bad enough just to Ogle over a beautiful woman for more than a couple of seconds. I mean you need at least a few seconds for her beautiful face and then you need more than just a few seconds for her beautiful body. That doesn't make a man a predator it just makes some men real suckers for feminine beauty and feminine sexuality.

I am one of those suckers and so therefore I support the burqa and I support the hijab

Not sure why I am being quoted in this thread but I don't care about covering up faces and I have certainly been proven right about the angry working classes. Brexit and Robinson is working class rage bubbling as predicted.

BAN IT , it isnt part of western culture so if the muslims want to live here then lets abide by western rules.

]Okay I agree with dark lord Al. Let all those hot young Muslim women take that thing off so I can check them out

I'm won over. Ban it.

Yeah man I seen some Somali girls over here who decided to take it off and all I can say is

******WOW*******

❤❤❤💗💗❤💗❤💗❤💗❤

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Originally Posted by Dark Lord Al

BAN IT , it isnt part of western culture so if the muslims want to live here then lets abide by western rules.

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Western culture is about freedom of religion, speech and expression. So it must be allowed.

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Originally Posted by Master

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Originally Posted by Dark Lord Al

BAN IT , it isnt part of western culture so if the muslims want to live here then lets abide by western rules.

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Western culture is about freedom of religion, speech and expression. So it must be allowed.

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Knockout. ;D

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Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust

My view on this is also quite conflicted.

For some reason I look at every single woman no matter the age and find something sexually attractive about her. I have been like that since I was about 13 or 14 years old. I find a lot of my Arabic friends and Indian friends are the same. they look at anything that moves as the expression goes. Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche was famous for saying that the only time a man can be truly just friends with a woman is when there is a severe physical antipathy involved. So for me the Burka is a very good thing.... It stops me from looking at attractive woman who are married which is even worse and also because I am married and it is not a good thing for me either.

I know some people will vehement Lee disagree as it has been stated above that it makes all men look like predators. but it doesn't have to go as Extreme as being a predator because it is bad enough just to Ogle over a beautiful woman for more than a couple of seconds. I mean you need at least a few seconds for her beautiful face and then you need more than just a few seconds for her beautiful body. That doesn't make a man a predator it just makes some men real suckers for feminine beauty and feminine sexuality.

I am one of those suckers and so therefore I support the burqa and I support the hijab

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Is Vehment Lee related to Christopher Lee ?

https://cdn3.whatculture.com/images/...6/lSfhE3P4.jpg

As long as it’s not mandatory I have no issue with it. I don’t think a women should have to cover her figure to keep men from lusting but since we are pigs it does work

Nah.. I am sure some people will just fetishize Burqkas. Or Letterboxes.


I mean some people think lamposts are sexy which is why Miles is not single and Walrus can't wait to cock his leg.

Head covering is ok as long as that is what the individual CHOOSES of their own free will to do


face covering :nono: ...even if you WANT to cover your face for religious purposes I'm sorry. Masks and face coverings are for bitter cold weather and Halloween and that is all...unless there's a job like cleaning up asbestos or welding or you play goalie in hockey then a mask is ok, but just as your everyday attire??? Nah we're not doing that shit.

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Originally Posted by Beanz

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Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust

My view on this is also quite conflicted.

For some reason I look at every single woman no matter the age and find something sexually attractive about her. I have been like that since I was about 13 or 14 years old. I find a lot of my Arabic friends and Indian friends are the same. they look at anything that moves as the expression goes. Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche was famous for saying that the only time a man can be truly just friends with a woman is when there is a severe physical antipathy involved. So for me the Burka is a very good thing.... It stops me from looking at attractive woman who are married which is even worse and also because I am married and it is not a good thing for me either.

I know some people will vehement Lee disagree as it has been stated above that it makes all men look like predators. but it doesn't have to go as Extreme as being a predator because it is bad enough just to Ogle over a beautiful woman for more than a couple of seconds. I mean you need at least a few seconds for her beautiful face and then you need more than just a few seconds for her beautiful body. That doesn't make a man a predator it just makes some men real suckers for feminine beauty and feminine sexuality.

I am one of those suckers and so therefore I support the burqa and I support the hijab

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Is Vehment Lee related to Christopher Lee ?

https://cdn3.whatculture.com/images/...6/lSfhE3P4.jpg

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You cunt 😀

Yes ban it .

Rich is a pervert. There's the proof right there

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DkFYc4lUYAImvRX.jpg

:vd: .....the absolute state of it

Kay Burley asks MP if he's offended by war veteran Simon Weston's burned face
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/w...p-hes-15002924
Television presenter Kay Burley has been criticised for bringing Welsh war veteran Simon Weston into the burqa row during a live interview.

The Sky News presenter compared the Falklands War hero with a woman who obscures her face with a veil, asking Tory MP Andrew Bridgen whether he would be "offended" if he could not read Mr Weston's facial expression.


Mr Weston suffered horrific burns to his face and body during the 1982 Falklands conflict but has gone on to channel his energies into supporting and helping others.


W.....T.....F :shakehead:

Got into this conversation at work today, not so much about "ban the burka" but more about what should become of Boris.

It infuriates me that because I said that he "could" apologize for the way he made his point (letterboxes, and bank robbers) but he shouldn't be made to apologize for the actual point, I was basically branded a racist by my boss (who is Asian, I have no idea what religion she is, she certainly doesn't practice it all that much anyway)

That is his opinion and he has just as much right to express it as those who disagree with it, he shouldn't be forced to put out a hollow apology just to appease the masses of the moralistic and easily offended.

People can challenge him on his wording and they can challenge him on his opinion but to demand an apology is outright wrong on my opinion.

Conversation and learning is key, not outrage and disgust.

We used to have enforced essential burkas and hijabs depending on what you did for recreation in the States. They were called "bathing suits" ;D. Special coppers in charge of enforcing morality laws as not to show too much yummy sinful ankle ffs :lickish:. Good thing we evolved to the thong. Until those were banned in places also.


I don't mind hijabs at all and see quite a few down here. Also hear the snickers and whispers from people around them. We're pretty screwed up when it comes to what individuals are allowed to wear now. Last time I flew to SD they made me check my Sombrero. You don't take a mans Sombrero son :furious2:.

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Originally Posted by Batman

Got into this conversation at work today, not so much about "ban the burka" but more about what should become of Boris.

It infuriates me that because I said that he "could" apologize for the way he made his point (letterboxes, and bank robbers) but he shouldn't be made to apologize for the actual point, I was basically branded a racist by my boss (who is Asian, I have no idea what religion she is, she certainly doesn't practice it all that much anyway)

That is his opinion and he has just as much right to express it as those who disagree with it, he shouldn't be forced to put out a hollow apology just to appease the masses of the moralistic and easily offended.

People can challenge him on his wording and they can challenge him on his opinion but to demand an apology is outright wrong on my opinion.

Conversation and learning is key, not outrage and disgust.

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It was how he said it which was demeaning. His actual point was in support for burka.

I don't see anything wrong with his comments surely he is allowed to voice his views we don't live in a religious dictatorship yet do you .

The burka should be banned in public places in the U.K. As is happening in various European countries

Not only ban the burqa and the hit jab but Force those girls to wear mini-skirts and small bikini like tops or sports bras

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Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust

Not only ban the burqa and the hit jab but Force those girls to wear mini-skirts and small bikini like tops or sports bras

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but you said " I support the burqa and I support the hijab"


um?.....;D

What people are in Europe and Britain are suggesting when they say the burqka should be banned is agreeing with the Extremist Islamic leaders in countries that demand women must wear Burqkas. You are both telling women what they should or should not wear. Even if you think they look stupid people have the right to look stupid. People pay thousands to wear things straight off the catwalk and look stupid. Going to ban them?

Interesting u have laws in Europe that allow you to ban the burqa. We might be able to do it here in certain places for security reasons but even that would prove difficult due to religious freedoms

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Originally Posted by Beanz

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Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust

Not only ban the burqa and the hit jab but Force those girls to wear mini-skirts and small bikini like tops or sports bras

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but you said " I support the burqa and I support the hijab"


um?.....;D

What people are in Europe and Britain are suggesting when they say the burqka should be banned is agreeing with the Extremist Islamic leaders in countries that demand women must wear Burqkas. You are both telling women what they should or should not wear. Even if you think they look stupid people have the right to look stupid. People pay thousands to wear things straight off the catwalk and look stupid. Going to ban them?

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:vd:



Do those "straight off the catwalk" clothes completely cover the faces of the people wearing them? If "Yes" then "Yes, those too would be banned"...I don't give a fuck what religion you are or how you practice but face coverings are either for protection or not being identified and well if a crime is committed (and hell every single human has the ability to commit a crime) how would you describe the culprit if they are dressed like Cousin It and grouped in with a bunch more Cousin Its? Hmmm?


How would a person drive a car wearing that?


How would a person SAFELY walk down the street wearing that?


It's a danger to the person wearing it, it's a danger to people not wearing it, it's oppressive, and it IMMEDIATELY makes me suspicious of you...if I can't see eyes or facial expression then yeah I'm going to be extremely skeptical of that person.

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Originally Posted by Beanz

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Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust

Not only ban the burqa and the hit jab but Force those girls to wear mini-skirts and small bikini like tops or sports bras

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but you said " I support the burqa and I support the hijab"


um?.....;D

What people are in Europe and Britain are suggesting when they say the burqka should be banned is agreeing with the Extremist Islamic leaders in countries that demand women must wear Burqkas. You are both telling women what they should or should not wear. Even if you think they look stupid people have the right to look stupid. People pay thousands to wear things straight off the catwalk and look stupid. Going to ban them?

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Um....😁 it has nothing to do with how they look I don't care how stupid they look or not ... I just said I have a conflicted position but I guess you missed it. My conflict is that I don't like to look at naked women or semi-naked women or even partially naked women or hot women in tight clothes because I am a married man and I feel like that is cheating. On the other hand if they strip all that stuff off they are very hot women I have seen some Iraqi's and some Yemenis and some Somalis that should have been Miss Universes, and that is sure some nice sweet eye candy mmmmmmmm 😍😍😍😍😍

Well at least you are admitting you don't believe in Freedom or Liberty Lyle. You want to tell people what they can and cannot wear, in a country that you don't even live in. What a busybody.

Beanz I'm conflicted on it

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Originally Posted by Beanz

Well at least you are admitting you don't believe in Freedom or Liberty Lyle. You want to tell people what they can and cannot wear, in a country that you don't even live in. What a busybody.

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What I'm saying is....

https://media.istockphoto.com/vector...QSXnrHs9e8P3E=

Burqa :nono:
Niqab :nono:
Chador :thumb:
Hijab :thumb:


But you're free to take that however you want to Beanz I know you will regardless

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Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust

Beanz I'm conflicted on it

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A great honest answer. I agree as you will see in my first reply to Fenster. That is the crux of nearly all my disagreements with posters here. The insistence on maintaining the illusion that answers are so simplistic. This polarity, extreme left and and right, is stupid and seems to be in part imported from American culture. I can see why in such a diverse country as yours an illusion like this would help people feel more safe and certain.

Don't get me wrong it has always been here in the UK but its crazy now. Us and them. The have and have nots. That is why religious extremists get away unchallenged because people focus on groups and lose sight of individuals.

People don't want to imagine they might have anything in common with someone who on the surface seems so different and so they make people out to be cardboard cutouts, groups, ciphers.

That is what bigoted Muslims do when they treat non muslims as infidels and what bigoted British do when they refuse to even recognise British born Muslims who join the army and are willing to die for this country.

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Originally Posted by Beanz

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Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust

Beanz I'm conflicted on it

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A great honest answer. I agree as you will see in my first reply to Fenster. That is the crux of nearly all my disagreements with posters here. The insistence on maintaining the illusion that answers are so simplistic. This polarity, extreme left and and right, is stupid and seems to be in part imported from American culture. I can see why in such a diverse country as yours an illusion like this would help people feel more safe and certain.

Don't get me wrong it has always been here in the UK but its crazy now. Us and them. The have and have nots. That is why religious extremists get away unchallenged because people focus on groups and lose sight of individuals.

People don't want to imagine they might have anything in common with someone who on the surface seems so different and so they make people out to be cardboard cutouts, groups, ciphers.

That is what bigoted Muslims do when they treat non muslims as infidels and what bigoted British do when they refuse to even recognise British born Muslims who join the army and are willing to die for this country.

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Unless it's bitterly cold out, or Halloween, why would you need a complete or even partial facial covering?


Oh it's a religious thing???? Like I'm going to trust ANYONE who can't keep their dick in their pants because he saw a bit of female skin.....NO. No sir. I'm not going to trust the men and I'm not going to trust the women.

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

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Originally Posted by Beanz

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Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust

Beanz I'm conflicted on it

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A great honest answer. I agree as you will see in my first reply to Fenster. That is the crux of nearly all my disagreements with posters here. The insistence on maintaining the illusion that answers are so simplistic. This polarity, extreme left and and right, is stupid and seems to be in part imported from American culture. I can see why in such a diverse country as yours an illusion like this would help people feel more safe and certain.

Don't get me wrong it has always been here in the UK but its crazy now. Us and them. The have and have nots. That is why religious extremists get away unchallenged because people focus on groups and lose sight of individuals.

People don't want to imagine they might have anything in common with someone who on the surface seems so different and so they make people out to be cardboard cutouts, groups, ciphers.

That is what bigoted Muslims do when they treat non muslims as infidels and what bigoted British do when they refuse to even recognise British born Muslims who join the army and are willing to die for this country.

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Unless it's bitterly cold out, or Halloween, why would you need a complete or even partial facial covering?


Oh it's a religious thing???? Like I'm going to trust ANYONE who can't keep their dick in their pants because he saw a bit of female skin.....NO. No sir. I'm not going to trust the men and I'm not going to trust the women.

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And yet you have no problem with people wearing Nazi Uniforms and Saluting Hitler on American Soil? You were very eager to defend their right to wear anything.

How about this fetching number?

https://images.vice.com/vice/images/...1423479917.jpg



or this one

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011...40_634x437.jpg

or this

https://www.iambirmingham.co.uk/wp-c...rmingham-1.png

or in white

http://mylondondiary.co.uk/2014/02/01/20140201-d955.jpg

‘You don’t know what’s under a burka’ insists EDL member wandering around in a balaclava

http://2w6kxc22rrr9mabqt1mglgait6.wp...-EDL-small.jpg


An EDL member has stated that the burka is dangerous because you can’t see who is under it, despite attending every EDL rally in a balaclava.
John Bullington, known to his friends as Big John, posted a rant on Facebook yesterday about how burkas are a clearly a cover for evilness.
He wrote, “You just don’t know what’s under a burka. It could be a bomb, a jihadi army, a tank, you just don’t know.
“You have to take a balaclava off if you want to go into a bank, but not a bloody burka. I’ve not been able to rob any banks in ages.
“Once again it’s one rule for the immigrants and another rule for nice white people like me. I don’t see what’s so difficult to understand about this. Anything covering your face is an affront to the British way of life – except when I do it.”
Despite a comment underneath his post pointing out that the burka isn’t seen as an aggressive piece of clothing and is also part of a religion, Bullington replied, “That’s complete crap and you know it!
“A balaclava can be part of a religion if you want it to be. And as for it being aggressive, when has anyone wearing a balaclava ever done anything bad? And don’t link to anything in the mainstream media, they’re all fake news these days.
“If they want to stay here, Muslim women need to stop wearing inappropriate stuff like headscarves and dress like proper westerners.
“Like nuns or something.”


http://newsthump.com/2017/04/24/you-...n-a-balaclava/

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Originally Posted by Beanz

And yet you have no problem with people wearing Nazi Uniforms and Saluting Hitler on American Soil? You were very eager to defend their right to wear anything.

How about this fetching number?

https://images.vice.com/vice/images/...1423479917.jpg



or this one

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011...40_634x437.jpg

or this

https://www.iambirmingham.co.uk/wp-c...rmingham-1.png

or in white

http://mylondondiary.co.uk/2014/02/01/20140201-d955.jpg

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A Nazi uniform doesn't come with a mask. Saluting Hitler doesn't come with a mask. They can say whatever they like, they can dress how they like, so long as they don't have masks.


All of those masks are unacceptable....feel like a tit now?

Why should Beanz feel a tit? What about the true tit John Bullington that Beanz just quoted?

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Originally Posted by Master

Why should Beanz feel a tit? What about the true tit John Bullington that Beanz just quoted?

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The two aren't mutually exclusive Master

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Beanz

And yet you have no problem with people wearing Nazi Uniforms and Saluting Hitler on American Soil? You were very eager to defend their right to wear anything.

How about this fetching number?

https://images.vice.com/vice/images/...1423479917.jpg



or this one

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011...40_634x437.jpg

or this

https://www.iambirmingham.co.uk/wp-c...rmingham-1.png

or in white

http://mylondondiary.co.uk/2014/02/01/20140201-d955.jpg

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A Nazi uniform doesn't come with a mask. Saluting Hitler doesn't come with a mask. They can say whatever they like, they can dress how they like, so long as they don't have masks.


All of those masks are unacceptable....feel like a tit now?

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No ;D Fucking hell Lyle. Must try harder. You can wear a balaclava in the UK. When you ride a motorbike you often put one on under your helmet. When it is snowing you might wear one. Despite the IRA and bank robbers also wearing them. You can be asked to remove them at garages and banks etc just like people can ask people to remove their Burqka head covering for a good reason. You can't ban them though. Just like you can't ban clown masks or Halloween masks or tell cosplayers take off the Batman mask and costume because I don't trust you.

You sound like an extremist mate.