And no Anthony Joshua, who has accomplished far more in a shorter period of time and is a more complete, well-rounded fighter.
This list makes it obvious that some of the people who vote don't know much about boxing.
ESPN Top 10 P4P list
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And no Anthony Joshua, who has accomplished far more in a shorter period of time and is a more complete, well-rounded fighter.
This list makes it obvious that some of the people who vote don't know much about boxing.
ESPN Top 10 P4P list
Now that's crazy ;D
Proving my point that after the first 2 or 3, p4p is a meaningless crock of shit. I wouldn’t have Wilder, AJ, Golovkin or even Canelo in my top 10. There, I said it!
They have had Wilder there for a while. No HW is even close to a top 10 guy IMO. Wilder is maybe in the top 30.
ESPN usually have pretty bad rankings. They have always loved Canelo though. Canelo at 3 is as much of a joke as Wilder being #10.
I still have GGG there but he is bottom of the list.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo Carnera
Agree with all this, and of course wilder being there is a joke. However, you can easily say that no HW ever has been close to a top ten P4P guy, unless you go back to the days when guys fought there but Weren’t close to naturally big enough and came up from much lighter weights. It’s impossible for a guy who is 6’6 200+ pounds to do the same things as a lightweight. You take any great from middleweight or below in any era and imagine they were that big but could fight the same way, nobody could have ever lived with them. The term was only invented to describe the best fighter who wasn’t a hw, and now seems to be more of a most accomplished list. Way I see it at least.Quote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncher
ESPN has you all on a string. They deliberately say outlandish things to spark debate. It’s a troll network
Yeh keep in mind half of the ESPN updates I see on a random social media feed are wrestling news ;D. Honestly..p4p really boils down to a marketing tag.
I wouldn't argue with anyone that rated Jacobs ahead of the 2 middleweights you listed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo Carnera
There's no right or wrong to P4P, it's always been nonsense, just these days fans take everything way to serious. The very notion of including heavyweights defeats the original purpose.
The reason Wilder is on the ESPN list is purely because they've canvassed a bunch of Americans and he's a famous American boxer. I guarantee if you took a poll on here some people would include Wilder, as like those "experts," most fans are only interested in the famous names.
How many on here know - Shiro, Nietes, Nery, Tanaka, Moonsri, Prograis, Taylor? So all lists are about the most popular fighters.
Canelo nor Golovkin in the top 10?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo Carnera
Your list is clueless without seeing it (:D)
This is a modern thing... Either people today are so thick they can't grasp that Wilder and Joshua would literally murder their Floyd's and Loma's and Crawford's or it's because being the heavyweight champion no longer means most famous.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pkingAgree with all this, and of course wilder being there is a joke. However, you can easily say that no HW ever has been close to a top ten P4P guy, unless you go back to the days when guys fought there but Weren’t close to naturally big enough and came up from much lighter weights. It’s impossible for a guy who is 6’6 200+ pounds to do the same things as a lightweight. You take any great from middleweight or below in any era and imagine they were that big but could fight the same way, nobody could have ever lived with them. The term was only invented to describe the best fighter who wasn’t a hw, and now seems to be more of a most accomplished list. Way I see it at least.Quote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncher
I don’t have Deontay in my top 10, BUT... he does get in the ring consistently with fighters who are over 40 pounds heavier and wins (or draws). I wonder if we aren’t holding him to an unfair standard because he’s a heavyweight? What other fighter gets in with other guys who outweigh him/them by that much??
What have they done in the last 2 or 3 years apart from fight each other with a bit of Khan/Brook bullying thrown in for good measure?Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterCanelo nor Golovkin in the top 10?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo Carnera
Your list is clueless without seeing it (:D)
For all we know , there could be 3 or 4 guys in the MW & SMW that could beat them. But if you wanna pick it on past glories and celebrity, crack on .
They’d have to fight other top MWs for that to happen. In other words don’t count on it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraWhat have they done in the last 2 or 3 years apart from fight each other with a bit of Khan/Brook bullying thrown in for good measure?Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterCanelo nor Golovkin in the top 10?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo Carnera
Your list is clueless without seeing it (:D)
For all we know , there could be 3 or 4 guys in the MW & SMW that could beat them. But if you wanna pick it on past glories and celebrity, crack on .
So there's no middle/supermiddle in your p4p top 10, right? If you don't rate the no.1 and no.2 you clearly can't rate anyone else. Canelo and Golovkin don't need past glories to trump Smith? Jacobs? Charlo? No other middle/supermiddle can hold a candle to either on current form.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraWhat have they done in the last 2 or 3 years apart from fight each other with a bit of Khan/Brook bullying thrown in for good measure?Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterCanelo nor Golovkin in the top 10?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo Carnera
Your list is clueless without seeing it (:D)
For all we know , there could be 3 or 4 guys in the MW & SMW that could beat them. But if you wanna pick it on past glories and celebrity, crack on .
You can justify a top ten without Canelo or Golovkin if using potential or styles or your personal favourites, that's fair enough, but there's a reason Golovkin is the best middleweight in the world even if he's past his pomp and a reason Canelo gave him such a great fight.
were is Rocky Fielding in the list ?
Clearly, because from now on the list exists to describe the best fighter who isn’t Rocky Fielding.
There's no MW's on my list, But why would there be no SMW's ? has Canelo suddenly become the best in the Division has he? We don't know if Canelo or an aged GGG are the best MW's around because there is nothing in the last 2 or 3 years to gauge against.Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterSo there's no middle/supermiddle in your p4p top 10, right? If you don't rate the no.1 and no.2 you clearly can't rate anyone else. Canelo and Golovkin don't need past glories to trump Smith? Jacobs? Charlo? No other middle/supermiddle can hold a candle to either on current form.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraWhat have they done in the last 2 or 3 years apart from fight each other with a bit of Khan/Brook bullying thrown in for good measure?Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterCanelo nor Golovkin in the top 10?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo Carnera
Your list is clueless without seeing it (:D)
For all we know , there could be 3 or 4 guys in the MW & SMW that could beat them. But if you wanna pick it on past glories and celebrity, crack on .
You can justify a top ten without Canelo or Golovkin if using potential or styles or your personal favourites, that's fair enough, but there's a reason Golovkin is the best middleweight in the world even if he's past his pomp and a reason Canelo gave him such a great fight.
Nowadays, they MIGHT be #3 & #4 in the division, we just don't know.
Canelo , to be fair to him , at the moment would scrape into my top 10 , because he beat GGG , whether people like that or not.
please don't ask me to name my top 10 p4p, because I can't be fucked to spend time on something I see as a complete waste of time. But off the top of my head, the likes of Crawford, Loma, Usyk ,Inoue , Prograis and the Thai guy in the lower weights with the long name are all above imo. maybe even guys like Santa Cruz and Russell Jr. are all above GGG for definite and Canelo Probably .
As I said, we can pick favourites or styles we prefer but there's no way you can justify 10 over Canelo or Golovkin based on resume without offering up flimsy, hypocritical reasoning, proved by the names you've offered. "The Thai guy" (:D) says it all. You can't honestly pretend to know anything about his opposition if you can't even remember his name. Prograis? Russel Jr? Come on. Even Crawford and Inoue arguably have weaker resumes than both.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraThere's no MW's on my list, But why would there be no SMW's ? has Canelo suddenly become the best in the Division has he? We don't know if Canelo or an aged GGG are the best MW's around because there is nothing in the last 2 or 3 years to gauge against.Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterSo there's no middle/supermiddle in your p4p top 10, right? If you don't rate the no.1 and no.2 you clearly can't rate anyone else. Canelo and Golovkin don't need past glories to trump Smith? Jacobs? Charlo? No other middle/supermiddle can hold a candle to either on current form.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraWhat have they done in the last 2 or 3 years apart from fight each other with a bit of Khan/Brook bullying thrown in for good measure?Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterCanelo nor Golovkin in the top 10?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo Carnera
Your list is clueless without seeing it (:D)
For all we know , there could be 3 or 4 guys in the MW & SMW that could beat them. But if you wanna pick it on past glories and celebrity, crack on .
You can justify a top ten without Canelo or Golovkin if using potential or styles or your personal favourites, that's fair enough, but there's a reason Golovkin is the best middleweight in the world even if he's past his pomp and a reason Canelo gave him such a great fight.
Nowadays, they MIGHT be #3 & #4 in the division, we just don't know.
Canelo , to be fair to him , at the moment would scrape into my top 10 , because he beat GGG , whether people like that or not.
please don't ask me to name my top 10 p4p, because I can't be fucked to spend time on something I see as a complete waste of time. But off the top of my head, the likes of Crawford, Loma, Usyk ,Inoue , Prograis and the Thai guy in the lower weights with the long name are all above imo. maybe even guys like Santa Cruz and Russell Jr. are all above GGG for definite and Canelo Probably .
And by the way mate i'm not saying your list will be wrong just all lists can be picked apart. It is after all nonsense for boxing nerds hence so-called "experts" pick Wilder and the like.
ESPN has a shitty list. lolololol.....Quote:
Originally Posted by Freedom
Disrespect for Crawford is first. Should be #1.
PacMan has NOT died or retired.
Usyk should be #3 or #4.
Garcia, Spence or Wilder should NOT be on the list.
Fury and Joshua should be.
I agree with you . it can be picked apart, all lists can. this is why I fucking hate this P4P nonsense. the only use it has is to pick the best boxer in the World regardless of weight , and maybe 2nd or 3rd. but beyond that , it's fucking ridiculous .Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterAs I said, we can pick favourites or styles we prefer but there's no way you can justify 10 over Canelo or Golovkin based on resume without offering up flimsy, hypocritical reasoning, proved by the names you've offered. "The Thai guy" (:D) says it all. You can't honestly pretend to know anything about his opposition if you can't even remember his name. Prograis? Russel Jr? Come on. Even Crawford and Inoue arguably have weaker resumes than both.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraThere's no MW's on my list, But why would there be no SMW's ? has Canelo suddenly become the best in the Division has he? We don't know if Canelo or an aged GGG are the best MW's around because there is nothing in the last 2 or 3 years to gauge against.Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterSo there's no middle/supermiddle in your p4p top 10, right? If you don't rate the no.1 and no.2 you clearly can't rate anyone else. Canelo and Golovkin don't need past glories to trump Smith? Jacobs? Charlo? No other middle/supermiddle can hold a candle to either on current form.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraWhat have they done in the last 2 or 3 years apart from fight each other with a bit of Khan/Brook bullying thrown in for good measure?Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterCanelo nor Golovkin in the top 10?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo Carnera
Your list is clueless without seeing it (:D)
For all we know , there could be 3 or 4 guys in the MW & SMW that could beat them. But if you wanna pick it on past glories and celebrity, crack on .
You can justify a top ten without Canelo or Golovkin if using potential or styles or your personal favourites, that's fair enough, but there's a reason Golovkin is the best middleweight in the world even if he's past his pomp and a reason Canelo gave him such a great fight.
Nowadays, they MIGHT be #3 & #4 in the division, we just don't know.
Canelo , to be fair to him , at the moment would scrape into my top 10 , because he beat GGG , whether people like that or not.
please don't ask me to name my top 10 p4p, because I can't be fucked to spend time on something I see as a complete waste of time. But off the top of my head, the likes of Crawford, Loma, Usyk ,Inoue , Prograis and the Thai guy in the lower weights with the long name are all above imo. maybe even guys like Santa Cruz and Russell Jr. are all above GGG for definite and Canelo Probably .
And by the way mate i'm not saying your list will be wrong just all lists can be picked apart. It is after all nonsense for boxing nerds hence so-called "experts" pick Wilder and the like.