Julio Cesar Chavez

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07-19-2007, 09:37 PM
ElTerribleMorales

Julio Cesar Chavez

Was just checking out JCC snr's record, since so many people are criticizing Jr. and well he's actually developing i'd say at the same rate as dad, only difference is that his dad didn't get a draw (which should have been a loss) until he fought Whitaker, but he does have a controversial win (which was originally a loss, but was then switched to a win), he didn't fight for a world title until he was 43-0, and that was his first significant fight and about 90% of his fights at that time were in Mexico, so come on guys and give Jr. a break, who knows if they'll do exactly the same thing that they did with dad, which was once he starts fighting the big names and if he can keep up with them, he'll continue doing so, i mean his third title defense of his WBC featherweight title was against Roger Mayweather, and also Chavez was fighting every three months, so come on guys you can't expect his kid to be a clone of dad, and we shouldn't judge him or belittle him if he isn't as good as his dad, cause in some ways i'd say that he's better than his dad, in every fight he's using his reach and height to his advantage, using the jab a lot more now, and he has a pretty good one, he tried to fight exactly like dad at first and realized that he doesn't have the same structure as his dad to fight in that type of style, so he fights the best way suited to his build, he gets better greatly in every fight, he has the patience of a veteran and is always calm in the ring, he's a very soft spoken kid, yet is a pretty damn good finisher, so i say lets just wait and see what happens and hope that we have another star in boxing ;D
07-19-2007, 09:43 PM
Trainer Monkey

Re: Julio Cesar Chavez

Hey theyre doing a better job of managing his career,then was done with Camacho Jr
Seemed like his entire career was managed to ensure he never outshined daddy
07-20-2007, 02:39 AM
CutMeMick

Re: Julio Cesar Chavez

Oh! boy... Here we go again.... This whole BoxRec thing again. ::** and going over there to determine the opponents of a fighter were any good. :(
07-20-2007, 02:45 AM
TitoFan

Re: Julio Cesar Chavez

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

Was just checking out JCC snr's record, since so many people are criticizing Jr. and well he's actually developing i'd say at the same rate as dad, only difference is that his dad didn't get a draw (which should have been a loss) until he fought Whitaker, but he does have a controversial win (which was originally a loss, but was then switched to a win), he didn't fight for a world title until he was 43-0, and that was his first significant fight and about 90% of his fights at that time were in Mexico, so come on guys and give Jr. a break, who knows if they'll do exactly the same thing that they did with dad, which was once he starts fighting the big names and if he can keep up with them, he'll continue doing so, i mean his third title defense of his WBC featherweight title was against Roger Mayweather, and also Chavez was fighting every three months, so come on guys you can't expect his kid to be a clone of dad, and we shouldn't judge him or belittle him if he isn't as good as his dad, cause in some ways i'd say that he's better than his dad, in every fight he's using his reach and height to his advantage, using the jab a lot more now, and he has a pretty good one, he tried to fight exactly like dad at first and realized that he doesn't have the same structure as his dad to fight in that type of style, so he fights the best way suited to his build, he gets better greatly in every fight, he has the patience of a veteran and is always calm in the ring, he's a very soft spoken kid, yet is a pretty damn good finisher, so i say lets just wait and see what happens and hope that we have another star in boxing ;D

I once posted an extensive piece on this topic, El Terrible. Kept seeing people elevate JCC Sr. to near god-like status, and I just had to check his record. As I posted back then, JCC Sr. first fought for a title when he was 43-0, like you said. Problem is, his first 43 opponents had a combined record of 180 W, 203 L, 20 D, for a measly winning percentage of apx 45%. Truth is, he fought a parade of "tomato cans" to build up his record to 43-0 before fighting a warm body. Compare that with some of his counterparts or some champions from THIS era, and you'll find a HUGE difference. Obviously, they want it to be "like father, like son."
07-20-2007, 05:55 AM
bond007

Re: Julio Cesar Chavez

Now lets remember that Jr. has no amature background, He is developing has a Pro.
07-20-2007, 06:12 AM
silent assassin

Re: Julio Cesar Chavez

Quote:

Originally Posted by CutMeMick

Oh! boy... Here we go again.... This whole BoxRec thing again. ::** and going over there to determine the opponents of a fighter were any good. :(

:lolololol:

Ur damned if u do, & damned if u don't.
If a guy has 18 fights & gets a shot that he loses some will say--"He shouldn't have been in there yet! It was too soon!"

A guy has 35 fights but hasn't faced the elite guys & U will hear--"He's not fighting anybody!"

This is why in this biz u have to beleive in ur mgmt. If u don't, u need to move on to the people that u think are better for u. There's no magic # of fights that someone should or shouldn't have before they step it up.

To tell u the truth, IMO this is smart in development (building experience, fighting often) But it's also actually a dangerous thing to. Even if the guys that ur fighting are not top 10 . All it takes is 1 mistake. A fraction of a second & 1 punch--Next thing u know, sheep counting. :boxingmatch:
07-20-2007, 06:31 AM
LeftHookToTheBody

Re: Julio Cesar Chavez

You forgot to mention the gift stoppage daddy got against Taylor with 0:02 left in a fight he was going to lose.
07-20-2007, 06:49 AM
the wiz

Re: Julio Cesar Chavez

I don't know if I'd call that a gift stoppage, Taylor was pretty out of it. Nonetheless, I think Top Rank is doing a great job with Jr's career. TrainerMonkey makes a great point, Chavez Jr has pretty much no amature background. I think he could be something special
07-20-2007, 06:53 AM
silent assassin

Re: Julio Cesar Chavez

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeftHookToTheBody

You forgot to mention the gift stoppage daddy got against Taylor with 0:02 left in a fight he was going to lose.

It wasn't JCC's fault that Meldrick couldn't answer Steele's question. Taylor fought a great fight but it's over & in the books. JCC won. And if u call it a gift, then I say that JCC had a part in givin himself that gift. Somebody made Taylor's face look like it got hit by a truck.
07-20-2007, 07:15 AM
ghoster

Re: Julio Cesar Chavez

Funny how when Chavez senior is discussed Richard Steele's stoppage is constantly brought up, It was towards the end of spectular career that included great fights at lightweight and Jr. lightweight too.

It's like how some people discuss how good Duran was, and they keep focusing on no mas.
07-20-2007, 07:28 AM
Kel

Re: Julio Cesar Chavez

Quote:

Originally Posted by bond007

Now lets remember that Jr. has no amature background, He is developing has a Pro.

That's what I was going to say.
07-20-2007, 07:28 AM
CutMeMick

Re: Julio Cesar Chavez

Quote:

Originally Posted by TitoFan

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

Was just checking out JCC snr's record, since so many people are criticizing Jr. and well he's actually developing i'd say at the same rate as dad, only difference is that his dad didn't get a draw (which should have been a loss) until he fought Whitaker, but he does have a controversial win (which was originally a loss, but was then switched to a win), he didn't fight for a world title until he was 43-0, and that was his first significant fight and about 90% of his fights at that time were in Mexico, so come on guys and give Jr. a break, who knows if they'll do exactly the same thing that they did with dad, which was once he starts fighting the big names and if he can keep up with them, he'll continue doing so, i mean his third title defense of his WBC featherweight title was against Roger Mayweather, and also Chavez was fighting every three months, so come on guys you can't expect his kid to be a clone of dad, and we shouldn't judge him or belittle him if he isn't as good as his dad, cause in some ways i'd say that he's better than his dad, in every fight he's using his reach and height to his advantage, using the jab a lot more now, and he has a pretty good one, he tried to fight exactly like dad at first and realized that he doesn't have the same structure as his dad to fight in that type of style, so he fights the best way suited to his build, he gets better greatly in every fight, he has the patience of a veteran and is always calm in the ring, he's a very soft spoken kid, yet is a pretty damn good finisher, so i say lets just wait and see what happens and hope that we have another star in boxing ;D

I once posted an extensive piece on this topic, El Terrible. Kept seeing people elevate JCC Sr. to near god-like status, and I just had to check his record. As I posted back then, JCC Sr. first fought for a title when he was 43-0, like you said. Problem is, his first 43 opponents had a combined record of 180 W, 203 L, 20 D, for a measly winning percentage of apx 45%. Truth is, he fought a parade of "tomato cans" to build up his record to 43-0 before fighting a warm body. Compare that with some of his counterparts or some champions from THIS era, and you'll find a HUGE difference. Obviously, they want it to be "like father, like son."

Do you remember my reply to that?