Bernard is historically greater than Manny or Floyd

[OumaFan]

Agree or disagree?

Granted its too early to make a final call on Manny or Floyd, but IMO you should agree.

[Kev]

Not sure.

I was thinking tonight that he may have now eclipsed Roy Jones acomplishments, because he's shown he's the better master of boxing. When Jones physical skills declined he was shot. B Hop is such a good technician that even at 46 he can outbox prime guys.

I would rate Manny above him right now though, he's been on a tear up through 10 weight classes.

Floyd, I really think his legacy will be hurt if he doesn't fight Manny, much than Manny's will be.

[OumaFan]

Manny is the tougher call IMO (and full disclosure I'm a big fan of Manny and Bernard, Floyd not so much).

But I'm leaning towards Hopkins over both. Definitely over Floyd. The weight jump is the big advantage for Manny.

I do think Bernard has passed Roy.

[Kev]

Manny is the tougher call IMO (and full disclosure I'm a big fan of Manny and Bernard, Floyd not so much).

But I'm leaning towards Hopkins over both. Definitely over Floyd. The weight jump is the big advantage for Manny.

I do think Bernard has passed Roy.

Yeah Floyds career has really gone out like a wet match lately, unless he fights Manny his ending will leave a sour taste I think.

Hopkins definitely has done something amazing for an old guy, but in absolute sense I'm not sure beating Pascal by razor thin decision is equal to just literally battering and dominating guys like Cotto, Margarito and Mosley that Manny has done lately.

B Hop is winning some and losing some against very good opposition, Manny is beating the snot out of his, and way above his natural fighting weight. That to me is more impressive as no other fighter in history has done that.

[Snakey]

He is a master boxer for sure. I dont know where his legacy stands but the man needs to be recognised as one of the best technical boxers ever. Alot of guys fight on because they believe they have the speed and power to compete, IMO Bhop has lost both but he continues to win because he is so tactical and his technique is great. Good onya BHOP !!!

[Gandalf]

Manny is the tougher call IMO (and full disclosure I'm a big fan of Manny and Bernard, Floyd not so much).

But I'm leaning towards Hopkins over both. Definitely over Floyd. The weight jump is the big advantage for Manny.

I do think Bernard has passed Roy.

Yeah Floyds career has really gone out like a wet match lately, unless he fights Manny his ending will leave a sour taste I think.

Hopkins definitely has done something amazing for an old guy, but in absolute sense I'm not sure beating Pascal by razor thin decision is equal to just literally battering and dominating guys like Cotto, Margarito and Mosley that Manny has done lately.

B Hop is winning some and losing some against very good opposition, Manny is beating the snot out of his, and way above his natural fighting weight. That to me is more impressive as no other fighter in history has done that.

The important thing to remember is that Hopkins is 46. I bet Manny isn't doing what Hopkins is doing at 46. And I hate this talk of Manny fighting outside of his weight class. The guy weighs in above 140, the guy IS a WW. Forget all this "if he boiled down he could make 135 easy" talk, we simply don't know that, but what we do know is that Manny weighs in at WW and fights other WW's.

As for the greatness thing, they are all pretty great. I don't know which is greater, but Floyd's recent lack of anything does leave a sour taste.

[JonesJrMayweather]

Well now given that he's the oldest to win the title and his MW reign. Yeah he's definitely above floyd as it stands. Floyd is possibly going to be the greatest disappointment in terms of wasting away his prime. Right now I think Manny is maybe equal with Bernard.

For me, floyd would have to beat Manny, then beat a serious 154 or 160 champ to pass BHOP

[global]

This is the real problem of arguing legacy across eras and weight classes, same as p4p discussions, in close situations there is no clear answer. Hopkins career doesn't have too many weight classes but there is a significant jump from middle to light heavy and I think he was Ring champ in both. His 20 defenses or whatever it was at middle weight is an amazing accomplishment as well. Manny rise through the weight classes is stunning but completely different. I have a hard time distinguishing one fighter over the other in legacy for Hopkins and Manny, but both are far ahead of Floyd. I believe Mayweather to have the potential to be ahead of both but he has sat back too much in his prime, unless he turns out to have the longevity of Hopkins, I doubt he will do anything/enough in the future to surpass the two other legacies as they are today.

[dcR-Reckless]

He had a great performance tonight. This is most exciting fight I've seen from him by far, type of fight I and the mast majority like to see. I say if Bernard had this warrior/fire in him, he would have ko'ed the cowboy but who knows. And I wouldn't say he is historically greater than Manny or Floyd right now , that's retarded.

[mafiajoey]

Pac and Floyd need to get there crap figured out. Compromise on these issues or whatever.

Pac will always have the "drug test" lingering over him shall he keep avoiding it. Pac fans are the only ones who are blind to this.

Floyd will always have the "ducking" lingering over him and most don't care either way. Floyd can't be seriously spoke about in any forum or discussion because Pactards will be the first to jump on him. It's what they specialize in. Anything to get the heat off the test Pac won't take.

Pac and Floyd are behind BHop It takes more then a resume of weight drained has beens. And it takes more then an undefeated record. See there Pactards I see it from both view.



BHop as of now is higher I believe. He never dodged anyone. He never cherry picked like Roy.

[OumaFan]

I think there's a distinction between "greater" and "better", in the historical sense. I would argue that both Bernard and Manny are "greater" than Floyd legacy wise but I think Floyd is the most talented fighter of my lifetime. A bit of a waste of talent to this point though.

[JonesJrMayweather]

Pac and Floyd need to get there crap figured out. Compromise on these issues or whatever.

Pac will always have the "drug test" lingering over him shall he keep avoiding it. Pac fans are the only ones who are blind to this.

Floyd will always have the "ducking" lingering over him and most don't care either way. Floyd can't be seriously spoke about in any forum or discussion because Pactards will be the first to jump on him. It's what they specialize in. Anything to get the heat off the test Pac won't take.

Pac and Floyd are behind BHop It takes more then a resume of weight drained has beens. And it takes more then an undefeated record. See there Pactards I see it from both view.



BHop as of now is higher I believe. He never dodged anyone. He never cherry picked like Roy.

Must be why he fought those blown up WWs....

[generalbulldog]

Pac and Floyd need to get there crap figured out. Compromise on these issues or whatever.

Pac will always have the "drug test" lingering over him shall he keep avoiding it. Pac fans are the only ones who are blind to this.

Floyd will always have the "ducking" lingering over him and most don't care either way. Floyd can't be seriously spoke about in any forum or discussion because Pactards will be the first to jump on him. It's what they specialize in. Anything to get the heat off the test Pac won't take.

Pac and Floyd are behind BHop It takes more then a resume of weight drained has beens. And it takes more then an undefeated record. See there Pactards I see it from both view.



BHop as of now is higher I believe. He never dodged anyone. He never cherry picked like Roy.

Must be why he fought those blown up WWs....

Ouch.

[marbleheadmaui]

Right now? I have BHOP over Floyd and behind Manny.

But things aren't over,

[marbleheadmaui]

Pac and Floyd need to get there crap figured out. Compromise on these issues or whatever.

Pac will always have the "drug test" lingering over him shall he keep avoiding it. Pac fans are the only ones who are blind to this.

Floyd will always have the "ducking" lingering over him and most don't care either way. Floyd can't be seriously spoke about in any forum or discussion because Pactards will be the first to jump on him. It's what they specialize in. Anything to get the heat off the test Pac won't take.

Pac and Floyd are behind BHop It takes more then a resume of weight drained has beens. And it takes more then an undefeated record. See there Pactards I see it from both view.



BHop as of now is higher I believe. He never dodged anyone. He never cherry picked like Roy.

Must be why he fought those blown up WWs....

Yeah but that's not fair. He fought welters after he'd whacked out the entire 160 division. By 2001 what middle was he supposed to fight instead of Tito for instance?