With all this talk of ATG's

**Irish Rover** · 12-12-2007 08:05 PM

With all this talk about ATG's it got me thinking about the question of who do I think was the greatest boxer of all time and I always come back to three: Louis, Sugar Ray & Ali. Could any other fighters really claim to be at that level?

The usual suspects wheeled out are Dempsey, Marciano, even Tyson but they are simply not on the level of the above three imo.

I think a good case could be made for any of those three being the greatest(but a debate is futile and Im sure its been done a million times) but I just dont think any other boxer out there could compare with those three. Do people agree or do others have a completely different take on it?

ICB · 12-12-2007 08:08 PM

Originally Posted by Irish Rover

With all this talk about ATG's it got me thinking about the question of who do I think was the greatest boxer of all time and I always come back to three: Louis, Sugar Ray & Ali. Could any other fighters really claim to be at that level?

The usual suspects wheeled out are Dempsey, Marciano, even Tyson but they are simply not on the level of the above three imo.

I think a good case could be made for any of those three being the greatest(but a debate is futile and Im sure its been done a million times) but I just dont think any other boxer out there could compare with those three. Do people agree or do others have a completely different take on it?

What about Pep, Armstrong ??

**Taeth** · 12-12-2007 08:10 PM

Just the fact they've all had very difficult fights, makes them not leaps and bounds better than the other ATG's.

**Irish Rover** · 12-12-2007 08:12 PM

Originally Posted by Pernell "Sweet Pea" Whitaker

What about Pep, Armstrong ??

Nah that loss on his record always put him out of the running for me

Seriously though could be a good shout. Havent seen enough of his fights to comment and he usually slips my mind for that reason but with what he achieved you could definately make a case.

**CutMeMick** · 12-12-2007 08:23 PM

I think 'Homicide Hank' & 'Galveston Giant' are the closest thing to having an arguement.

But it also depends on your own views for example to me the most superb boxers ever to step foot in a ring are Alexis & 'Finito' so to me those 2 guys are at the top of my lists as far as great boxers go.

**Tins06** · 12-12-2007 11:14 PM

Gotta say i think Willie Pep is the best that ever lived.

Just something about what he does in the ring, the way he dodges punches and counters. And how he survived that plane crash and still went on to win fight after fight.I know he lost so many times to Sandy Saddler.But Robinson lost the title 5 times,How many people consider he was the best.

But really Ray Robinson is "generally" considered the best there ever was i guess.

**Punching Princess** · 12-12-2007 11:37 PM

Some people will make a strong case for Hank Armstrong over Robinson, an argument I have gotten into several times with my Dad. When you weigh them both out it is almost impossible to decide.

Willie Pep is among the best of all time, there are a slew of Black fighters from the early 1900's to about 1925 that have strong cases. The problem is we do not hear about them as often because of the color barrier from the time and many of their best outings were ignored. A classic example is Sam Langford, Jack Dempsey himself admitted avoiding him like the plague coming through the ranks. Not due to color but actual fear of his ability.

**ianwigley** · 12-13-2007 12:55 AM

Originally Posted by Tins06

Gotta say i think Willie Pep is the best that ever lived.

Just something about what he does in the ring, the way he dodges punches and counters. And how he survived that plane crash and still went on to win fight after fight.I know he lost so many times to Sandy Saddler.But Robinson lost the title 5 times,How many people consider he was the best.

But really Ray Robinson is "generally" considered the best there ever was i guess.

Watched Robinson - Turpin II today, Robinson sure made hard work of disposing of Turpin when he had him wobbled in the 11th.

Best ever? Great question? Not Ali, Willie Pep? Possibly. In ten fights time, if he lasts that long, will we be uttering the name Floyd Mayweather? From what I've seen of Mayweather, he has the potential...but he's probably not got time on his side now...but he'll be up there.

ICB · 12-13-2007 01:17 PM

Originally Posted by Punching Princess

Some people will make a strong case for Hank Armstrong over Robinson, an argument I have gotten into several times with my Dad. When you weigh them both out it is almost impossible to decide.

Willie Pep is among the best of all time, there are a slew of Black fighters from the early 1900's to about 1925 that have strong cases. The problem is we do not hear about them as often because of the color barrier from the time and many of their best outings were ignored. A classic example is Sam Langford, Jack Dempsey himself admitted avoiding him like the plague coming through the ranks. Not due to color but actual fear of his ability.

Robinson actually beat Armstrong, when Armstrong was at the end of his career. The rumor has it that it went the distance and Robinson carried him.