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Thread: Haye Klitschko is falling apart- Talks Suspended

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    Default Haye Klitschko is falling apart- Talks Suspended

    By Dan Rafael of ESPN.COM

    W. Klitschko-Haye not as close as you might think - ESPN


    W. Klitschko-Haye not as close as you might think



    For months, there's been talk of a proposed June 20 fight between heavyweight champion Wladimir Klitschko and David Haye, the former cruiserweight champ who moved up to heavyweight late last year. Although the deal might ultimately be finalized -- and there is still plenty of time to get it done -- it's a lot further from being set than some might lead you to believe, namely the British press.

    The media speculation I've been reading makes me laugh because the breathless prose from the Brits, who have anointed Haye as the savior of the heavyweight division, make it sound as if the fight is done.

    It's not, even though Emanuel Steward, Klitschko's trainer, was quoted throughout the British press in recent days as saying he thought a deal was imminent because Wladimir had called him to ask him what the size of the ring should be so it could be specified in the contract. The British media and Steward jumped to the conclusion that the question meant the deal must be about done if they were down to such nitty-gritty terms. Steward had also mentioned the bout would be at the 02 Arena in London.

    However, the fight is not close to being made and if it gets done, it won't be at the 02.

    The plan called for the bout to be at Stamford Bridge, a soccer stadium in suburban London that could accommodate more than 40,000 for a fight.

    After seeing the comments from Steward and continually reading about the imminent deal, I got in touch with Bernd Boente, the one man who could truly explain what was going on because he has handled Klitschko's business dealing for years, managing him and older brother and fellow heavyweight titleholder Vitali Klitschko.

    Boente cleared things up quickly, telling me of the deal, "We are pretty far away from each other and the fight definitely won't be at the 02 Arena. It is occupied that night."

    Haye has been talking trash in the British press in an attempt to land a heavyweight title fight, first directing it toward Vitali, whom he thought he would originally face, and then against Wladimir, to whom his verbiage turned once Vitali elected to make his mandatory defense against Juan Carlos Gomez on March 21 rather than risk being stripped of his belt by facing Haye. Once it was settled with which brother Haye and his manager/trainer Adam Booth, who also runs Haye's Hayemaker Promotions, should negotiate, the sides started working on a deal for the June 20 fight at Stamford Bridge, the arena that Haye brought to the table.

    Klitschko, being the true champion that he is, never had an issue about fighting in Haye's home country.

    Even though Klitschko would have preferred to fight earlier than June 20, that was the date they targeted because of Haye. With the soccer season going on, the stadium wouldn't be available until then. Also, the date worked for the three major television networks that would be involved in the fight -- HBO in the United States; the United Kingdom's Setanta, which has a contract with Haye; and German network RTL, which has a contract with Klitschko.

    The stadium, and all of the potential revenue it could bring, was a major reason Klitschko settled on Haye as his first choice. Lord knows it wasn't because Haye had done anything to warrant a heavyweight title shot -- unless he deserved it based on less than six rounds in the division, a first-round knockout of obscure Tomasz Bonin in a 2007 heavyweight trial run followed by a shaky fifth-round knockout win in November against Monte Barrett (a man, by the way, who Klitschko crushed in seven rounds in 2000 in England on a Lennox Lewis undercard).

    Anyway, while the Brits were reporting a virtual done deal for a fight in the wrong building, Boente told me that Booth had told him that they were pulling out of the stadium deal because of concerns over the deepening worldwide economic crisis.

    "They backed out of the stadium because of the economy and now we have to negotiate everything new," Boente said. "That [stadium] was a huge portion of the deal. Otherwise, Haye is not bringing much to the table."

    Even without the stadium, Haye is still asking for a significant slice of the revenue.

    "We are absolutely willing to do the fight, but we have to start all over again to bring them down from their high horse. Adam is very inexperienced. He may be a good coach, but he's definitely not a good manager. If he's not taking this chance, do you know how long it will be before Haye is in a mandatory position? It will take a long time. This is a unique chance for Haye and they are being so greedy. If Haye had a name like Lennox Lewis or Evander Holyfield in their best days, we would have additional money from international sales. But that is not the case."

    Boente said he and Shelly Finkel, the American adviser for the Klitschkos, had always been a little wary about the stadium and Haye's ability to draw a big crowd. Ricky Hatton and Joe Calzaghe, he ain't.

    Boente saw it up close when he was ringside with Vitali for Haye's fight at the 02 Arena against Barrett.

    "I heard they maybe sold 3,000 tickets and there weren't more than 7,000 or 8,000 people there," he said. "They had to hang curtains to close off the upper part of the arena. So we were always a little wary of the stadium, but they were our co-promoters. But now we will have to see about the fight. I would personally still love to do it at [Stamford Bridge], but now we have to look for something brand new and see what is interesting. And also the deal with Haye has to be new because we gave him way more than even a mandatory challenger would get. A mandatory challenger would get 25 or 30 percent [of the money], but he was getting a lot more than that. But that was before, because he brought the stadium to the table. They said they cannot be so sure of the stadium with the economic climate."

    Boente said Booth told him Hayemaker Promotions was willing to cede the entire promotion to Klitschko's company, K2. Of course, that means Hayemaker would not be at any financial risk.

    "They said they would just keep all of the English television rights," Boente said. "Why would we do that? If you think you'll keep all the money from English TV, what are you bringing to the table to get so much more than a mandatory challenger? They think they are bringing a superstar to the fight when he's fought [six] rounds in the heavyweight division.

    "Before, it was an interesting deal, but now he would just be a regular challenger. And we were honoring [the contract Haye has] with Setanta when for any other fight we would have negotiated with Sky TV or ITV or maybe put it on pay-per-view [in the U.K.]."

    Boente said if they can't re-work the deal with Haye, American contender Cris Arreola was an option, even though Arreola's next move is supposed to be an April 11 fight on HBO on the undercard of Paul Williams-Winky Wright.

    "We always told Shelly to make sure that [Arreola promoter] Dan Goossen knows that whatever contract they sign that there should be an exit [clause] for a title fight," Boente said.

    He made it clear that Haye remained Klitschko's first choice, but only if it makes economic sense.

    "It does not make sense to fight him if he doesn't bring more to the table than a regular challenger like Hasim Rahman or Tony Thompson," Boente said. "Why pay him more than a mandatory challenger? And he was complaining about options. Let him go fight Ruslan Chagaev or Nikolai Valuev and see how many options their promoters ask for."
    Last edited by Lance Uppercut; 02-17-2009 at 04:56 PM.

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    Default Re: Why Haye Klitschko is falling apart

    They should just fight in the US

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    Default Re: Why Haye Klitschko is falling apart

    Its waay too soon for Haye to fight Wladimer. He should fight on a few Wladimer undercards and talk himself up more and actually make the fight be big
    Life is still worth while If You Just Smile - MJ

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    Default Re: Why Haye Klitschko is falling apart

    Quote Originally Posted by Lance Uppercut View Post
    By Dan Rafael of ESPN.COM

    W. Klitschko-Haye not as close as you might think - ESPN


    W. Klitschko-Haye not as close as you might think



    For months, there's been talk of a proposed June 20 fight between heavyweight champion Wladimir Klitschko and David Haye, the former cruiserweight champ who moved up to heavyweight late last year. Although the deal might ultimately be finalized -- and there is still plenty of time to get it done -- it's a lot further from being set than some might lead you to believe, namely the British press.

    The media speculation I've been reading makes me laugh because the breathless prose from the Brits, who have anointed Haye as the savior of the heavyweight division, make it sound as if the fight is done.

    It's not, even though Emanuel Steward, Klitschko's trainer, was quoted throughout the British press in recent days as saying he thought a deal was imminent because Wladimir had called him to ask him what the size of the ring should be so it could be specified in the contract. The British media and Steward jumped to the conclusion that the question meant the deal must be about done if they were down to such nitty-gritty terms. Steward had also mentioned the bout would be at the 02 Arena in London.

    However, the fight is not close to being made and if it gets done, it won't be at the 02.

    The plan called for the bout to be at Stamford Bridge, a soccer stadium in suburban London that could accommodate more than 40,000 for a fight.

    After seeing the comments from Steward and continually reading about the imminent deal, I got in touch with Bernd Boente, the one man who could truly explain what was going on because he has handled Klitschko's business dealing for years, managing him and older brother and fellow heavyweight titleholder Vitali Klitschko.

    Boente cleared things up quickly, telling me of the deal, "We are pretty far away from each other and the fight definitely won't be at the 02 Arena. It is occupied that night."

    Haye has been talking trash in the British press in an attempt to land a heavyweight title fight, first directing it toward Vitali, whom he thought he would originally face, and then against Wladimir, to whom his verbiage turned once Vitali elected to make his mandatory defense against Juan Carlos Gomez on March 21 rather than risk being stripped of his belt by facing Haye. Once it was settled with which brother Haye and his manager/trainer Adam Booth, who also runs Haye's Hayemaker Promotions, should negotiate, the sides started working on a deal for the June 20 fight at Stamford Bridge, the arena that Haye brought to the table.

    Klitschko, being the true champion that he is, never had an issue about fighting in Haye's home country.

    Even though Klitschko would have preferred to fight earlier than June 20, that was the date they targeted because of Haye. With the soccer season going on, the stadium wouldn't be available until then. Also, the date worked for the three major television networks that would be involved in the fight -- HBO in the United States; the United Kingdom's Setanta, which has a contract with Haye; and German network RTL, which has a contract with Klitschko.

    The stadium, and all of the potential revenue it could bring, was a major reason Klitschko settled on Haye as his first choice. Lord knows it wasn't because Haye had done anything to warrant a heavyweight title shot -- unless he deserved it based on less than six rounds in the division, a first-round knockout of obscure Tomasz Bonin in a 2007 heavyweight trial run followed by a shaky fifth-round knockout win in November against Monte Barrett (a man, by the way, who Klitschko crushed in seven rounds in 2000 in England on a Lennox Lewis undercard).

    Anyway, while the Brits were reporting a virtual done deal for a fight in the wrong building, Boente told me that Booth had told him that they were pulling out of the stadium deal because of concerns over the deepening worldwide economic crisis.

    "They backed out of the stadium because of the economy and now we have to negotiate everything new," Boente said. "That [stadium] was a huge portion of the deal. Otherwise, Haye is not bringing much to the table."

    Even without the stadium, Haye is still asking for a significant slice of the revenue.

    "We are absolutely willing to do the fight, but we have to start all over again to bring them down from their high horse. Adam is very inexperienced. He may be a good coach, but he's definitely not a good manager. If he's not taking this chance, do you know how long it will be before Haye is in a mandatory position? It will take a long time. This is a unique chance for Haye and they are being so greedy. If Haye had a name like Lennox Lewis or Evander Holyfield in their best days, we would have additional money from international sales. But that is not the case."

    Boente said he and Shelly Finkel, the American adviser for the Klitschkos, had always been a little wary about the stadium and Haye's ability to draw a big crowd. Ricky Hatton and Joe Calzaghe, he ain't.

    Boente saw it up close when he was ringside with Vitali for Haye's fight at the 02 Arena against Barrett.

    "I heard they maybe sold 3,000 tickets and there weren't more than 7,000 or 8,000 people there," he said. "They had to hang curtains to close off the upper part of the arena. So we were always a little wary of the stadium, but they were our co-promoters. But now we will have to see about the fight. I would personally still love to do it at [Stamford Bridge], but now we have to look for something brand new and see what is interesting. And also the deal with Haye has to be new because we gave him way more than even a mandatory challenger would get. A mandatory challenger would get 25 or 30 percent [of the money], but he was getting a lot more than that. But that was before, because he brought the stadium to the table. They said they cannot be so sure of the stadium with the economic climate."

    Boente said Booth told him Hayemaker Promotions was willing to cede the entire promotion to Klitschko's company, K2. Of course, that means Hayemaker would not be at any financial risk.

    "They said they would just keep all of the English television rights," Boente said. "Why would we do that? If you think you'll keep all the money from English TV, what are you bringing to the table to get so much more than a mandatory challenger? They think they are bringing a superstar to the fight when he's fought [six] rounds in the heavyweight division.

    "Before, it was an interesting deal, but now he would just be a regular challenger. And we were honoring [the contract Haye has] with Setanta when for any other fight we would have negotiated with Sky TV or ITV or maybe put it on pay-per-view [in the U.K.]."

    Boente said if they can't re-work the deal with Haye, American contender Cris Arreola was an option, even though Arreola's next move is supposed to be an April 11 fight on HBO on the undercard of Paul Williams-Winky Wright.

    "We always told Shelly to make sure that [Arreola promoter] Dan Goossen knows that whatever contract they sign that there should be an exit [clause] for a title fight," Boente said.

    He made it clear that Haye remained Klitschko's first choice, but only if it makes economic sense.

    "It does not make sense to fight him if he doesn't bring more to the table than a regular challenger like Hasim Rahman or Tony Thompson," Boente said. "Why pay him more than a mandatory challenger? And he was complaining about options. Let him go fight Ruslan Chagaev or Nikolai Valuev and see how many options their promoters ask for."
    That article is a bit of hatchet job, that 1st part I've emboldened just pissed me off because the fact is Wlad is looking at this fight over others because it will actually get him decent media attention.

    The 2nd part is something only UK fans would be aware of, and that is that Setanta IS the place for boxing over here. ITV would simply not be able to afford it, plus their coverage & buildup to fights is notoriously poor. Sky would not fork out for it unless they were going to put it on PPV, & the fact is very few fans will spend £14.95 for 1 night of David Haye, when with Setanta you get a month of boxing for £10. Even if it did bring in good numbers it would not generate anywhere the amount that the Klitschkos are looking at. Sky prefer to put all the money in a few baskets, particularly Hatton (who does bring in the numbers) & Khan & other Frank Warren fighters (who don't quite as convincingly). Setanta put up the money but also have good access not only to the boxing audience who would watch the fight anyway, they also have good audience figures from the casual sports fans who get the channel for other sports. This guy must know this seeing as the Klitschko bros have had their last 3 fights on the channel. Setanta also are very good at building up towards a fight even if its not one that will be that big in the UK like Vic-Arce. In contrast the last fight Sky screened not involving a Brit fighter was Mosley-Mayorga. So on that particular point that he makes a big issue of, he is chatting shit.

    I won't deny Wlad deserves more, but the fact is it is David Haye who will sell this fight on the basis of his personality/obnoxiousness (cross out which is not applicable), so he deserves IMO at least a percentage of about 35%-40%. Its true though Booth probably doesn't know that well what he's doing, surely they could try & get GBP involved as Hayemaker are a subsidiary of them.

    P.S. Sorry for the media coverage rant but that point just pissed me off & showed me the guy was bullshittin!

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    Default Re: Why Haye Klitschko is falling apart

    Like I said before, Haye just wants to get paid for his loss. He knows in his heart he's not going to win. So he wants the most money he can get. Boente is right. Haye ain't done shiit to deserve a title shot. He's in privilege position. But his geedy. underseving ass is looking to blow it.

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    Default Re: Why Haye Klitschko is falling apart

    Quote Originally Posted by Violent Demise View Post
    Like I said before, Haye just wants to get paid for his loss. He knows in his heart he's not going to win. So he wants the most money he can get. Boente is right. Haye ain't done shiit to deserve a title shot. He's in privilege position. But his geedy. underseving ass is looking to blow it.
    Maybe your almost correct about that but this fights lost all it's fucking momentum now. I can never get exited about a fight once it's been put off like this. It could have been a fight to shake up the division and kick-start it back into life.

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    Default Re: Why Haye Klitschko is falling apart

    Big fat Dan is at it again, firstly he calls Hayes win over Barrett shaky lmfao!!! A total domination from the first bell with numerous knockdowns yes i think that was one shaky fight could of gone either way.


    Haye might not have done much in the division but its not as if he is by passing half a dozen futrue hall of famers, the division is fucking shit, what would big Dan rather see some more snooze fests?

    Maybe we could put Wlad in with Valuev im sure that we would see a decline in demand for sleeping pills come fight night on that one.

    This fight is what we fans want to see Haye is the most exciting heavyweight out there he wants to fight the best lest see it happen.

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    Default Re: Why Haye Klitschko is falling apart

    Quote Originally Posted by skel1983 View Post
    Big fat Dan is at it again, firstly he calls Hayes win over Barrett shaky lmfao!!! A total domination from the first bell with numerous knockdowns yes i think that was one shaky fight could of gone either way.


    Haye might not have done much in the division but its not as if he is by passing half a dozen futrue hall of famers, the division is fucking shit, what would big Dan rather see some more snooze fests?

    Maybe we could put Wlad in with Valuev im sure that we would see a decline in demand for sleeping pills come fight night on that one.

    This fight is what we fans want to see Haye is the most exciting heavyweight out there he wants to fight the best lest see it happen.
    or at least that's what he says, his actions and demands for more undeserved money say otherwise

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    Default Re: Why Haye Klitschko is falling apart

    All this could backfire on Haye, it could be a bluff going wrong.
    Pain lasts a only a minute, but the memory will last forever....

    boxingbournemouth - Cornelius Carrs private boxing tuition and personal fitness training

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    Default Re: Why Haye Klitschko is falling apart

    Haye fans are delusional........

    Everytime a fight falls apart they say Wlad is scared when in fact it is Haye and his inexperienced promoters/managers screwing everything up.....

    Haye and his promoters like to talk like Haye is some huge super star and will save the heavyweight division...but when it comes to putting the money down they fold up like little girls...

    As we get closer to fight time Haye is getting scared, he is probably praying the economic crisis stays around for a couple years so he can use as an excuse not to fight Wlad......Haye is pathetic....

    Haye is making himself look like a moron after talking all of that $hite, if Haye is so confident why is he worried so much about that financial split?? and I am glad to see ESPN is on to him.....
    Last edited by Hunter; 02-15-2009 at 01:02 PM.

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    Default Re: Why Haye Klitschko is falling apart

    Quote Originally Posted by Hunter View Post
    Haye fans are delusional........

    Everytime a fight falls apart they say Wlad is scared when in fact it is Haye and his inexperienced promoters/managers screwing everything up.....

    Haye and his promoters like to talk like Haye is some huge super star and will save the heavyweight division...but when it comes to putting the money down they fold up like little girls...

    As we get closer to fight time Haye is getting scared, he is probably praying the economic crisis stays around for a couple years so he can use as an excuse not to fight Wlad......Haye is pathetic....










    Trust me David is anything but scared and he's already been in the face of both brothers and i know for fact that he's a fearless fucka and Crazy with it

    Looks like this is falling apart after all and that Wlad may face Arreola instead.
    I think HAye wants a Big share if he faces Wlad and maybe he's trying to walk before he can run in the Division.
    And for the record...Golden Boy are the Money men behind Hayemaker

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    Default Re: Why Haye Klitschko is falling apart

    Check this out...If true (i suspect it may be) then Booth is royally fucking things up

    David Haye's world title fight with Wladimir Klitschko under threat over 'greed' - Telegraph

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    Default Re: Why Haye Klitschko is falling apart

    Trust me David is anything but scared and he's already been in the face of both brothers and i know for fact that he's a fearless fucka and Crazy with it

    What does this mean He gets in Wlad and Vitali's face in a crowded airport or hall before a fight and this is suppose to make him look tough?hahhahaha.....I could get in their faces and talk all the crap I want in front of a crowd....they are not going to do anything.......

    If Haye wants to prove he's a man he should break into Wlad's house and take a dump on his pillow while he is sleeping.....If he does that I will give him credit for having some stones......

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    Default Re: Why Haye Klitschko is falling apart

    Quote Originally Posted by smashup View Post
    Check this out...If true (i suspect it may be) then Booth is royally fucking things up

    David Haye's world title fight with Wladimir Klitschko under threat over 'greed' - Telegraph
    You might wanna read the original post because everything that it says in there is taken from Rafael's article

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    Default Re: Why Haye Klitschko is falling apart

    Quote Originally Posted by Hunter View Post
    Trust me David is anything but scared and he's already been in the face of both brothers and i know for fact that he's a fearless fucka and Crazy with it

    What does this mean He gets in Wlad and Vitali's face in a crowded airport or hall before a fight and this is suppose to make him look tough?hahhahaha.....I could get in their faces and talk all the crap I want in front of a crowd....they are not going to do anything.......

    If Haye wants to prove he's a man he should break into Wlad's house and take a dump on his pillow while he is sleeping.....If he does that I will give him credit for having some stones......














    Yeah Hunter i'm sure thats on his agenda anytime soon infact shall i ring him and see?

    Facts are that NO-ONE knows what is going on with these negaotiations so all we can do is speculate and discuss.
    Or try to

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