Were all Marciano's fights on the level

[YIDDLE]

Ok did Weill take advantage of his connections to the grey gentleman to smooth Rocky's path in his career before he got to title level

[brocktonblockbust]

Ok did Weill take advantage of his connections to the grey gentleman to smooth Rocky's path in his career before he got to title level

well ıf you mean '47 to '48 yes maybe. But guys he fought '48 onwards were legit. Vingo was no joke, he was 6 ft 4 and had all knockouts, undefeated. Rex Layne was an animal. etc...

Fight I always wonder about wsa the Cockell fight. Marciano kept clubbıng away and there was littie to no damage done. How could that be---was he pulling hıs punches?

[greynotsoold]

Never, ever, at any point in his career or after has anybody come forward with any proof that Marciano benefitted from that sort of activity. I don't think it was ever alleged, other than on internet forums.
That said, every fighter has fights that he is going to win. That's part of being 'brought along' and it has nothing to do with shady connections. That's just how boxing works. Not every fighter is in there to win, even if he is not 'trying' to lose.

[YIDDLE]

Perhaps say the first Lowry fight

After all we see strange decisions today and we see plenty of decisions when the promoters next big thing gets the decision over the named opponent . That's not a modern trait is it , so it's very possible that any close fight involving rocky that some extra insurance could of been in place . A white american heavyweight today would be worth a mountain of money and it would of been just as important back then in a period race seemed more important than it does now . How long had it been since a white heavyweight title holder

[Beanflicker]

Who knows with fights back then. Fight fixing has always been around in boxing and will always be around, but back then when the mob was controlling it and forcing guys to throw fights, it really was the wild west.

[brocktonblockbust]

Perhaps say the first Lowry fight

After all we see strange decisions today and we see plenty of decisions when the promoters next big thing gets the decision over the named opponent . That's not a modern trait is it , so it's very possible that any close fight involving rocky that some extra insurance could of been in place . A white american heavyweight today would be worth a mountain of money and it would of been just as important back then in a period race seemed more important than it does now . How long had it been since a white heavyweight title holder

What is the Lowry fight?

[beenKOed]

Who knows with fights back then. Fight fixing has always been around in boxing and will always be around, but back then when the mob was controlling it and forcing guys to throw fights, it really was the wild west.

I don't know if I can agree with that, entirely.
It seems like Rocky's ZERO would have been an irresistible opportunity for the mob to score a monster payday. Maybe you think Rocky was connected/protected? If that was true, wouldn't they have expected him to go along with the plan, for considerable compensation? Just wondering like everyone else.
What do you think?

[Bill Paxtom]

There were a few set ups in the early part of the career.

* Bob Jefferson
* Johnny Pretzie
* Don Mogard

[Beanflicker]

I don't know if I can agree with that, entirely.
It seems like Rocky's ZERO would have been an irresistible opportunity for the mob to score a monster payday. Maybe you think Rocky was connected/protected? If that was true, wouldn't they have expected him to go along with the plan, for considerable compensation? Just wondering like everyone else.
What do you think?

I just don't know. Who knows what went on behind closed doors, especially 70 years ago.

Hypothetically, if Rocky was property of the mob and a guaranteed cash cow, there'd be that incentive to fix fights and protect Rocky. If they were taking a slice of Rocky's purse and were taking a slice of the ticket sales and proceeds (or taking all of it, who knows), making Rocky take a dive for one big pay day would probably have been small change compared to what they would make off of him in the long run. Also, bookies would often get wind of a fix when big or unusual bets started coming in and close down the betting, so if large quantites of cash were suddenly put on Don Cockell to upset Marciano, there's no guarantee they'd take the bet.

That's all conjecture though, and unless there was evidence that was the case I wouldn't want to speak ill of Rocky's amazing career.

[Bill Paxtom]

Funny Business

Monday ~ March 21, 1949

Rhode Island Auditorium ~ Rhode Island

Rocky Marciano ~ 12-0-0 {12 KO's} ~ 182 lbs.
vs.
Johnny Pretzie ~ 9-5-0 {7 KO's} ~ 195 lbs.

Johnny Pretzie, a 29 year-old Boston-based Heavyweight was a 'tough and rugged'
guy who could rumble.

The Fight Bill stated that his record was 16-4-0 {13 KO's}.

Rocky, who had not fought in 3-Months, was reportedly having a rough time in
Training-Sessions.

Rocky had opened as a {4-1} Betting-Favorite.

Johnny Pretzie had only been stopped 'once' in his career, and that was in the 10th
Round of a bout that he was winning by a wide-margin, until he got caught
by a 'Lucky Punch'.

Before 'fight chatter' had Johnny as a 'Live Opponent' who could beat Rocky.

Money was 'dumped' on Johnny, and the Odds dropped down to {2-1} for Rocky.

Suddenly out of nowhere, 2-Days before the Bout, the Odds went from {2-1} for
Rocky Marciano to {7-1}.

The 'street-chatter' was, that Johnny was planning a middle-round dive.

[greynotsoold]

Perhaps say the first Lowry fight

After all we see strange decisions today and we see plenty of decisions when the promoters next big thing gets the decision over the named opponent . That's not a modern trait is it , so it's very possible that any close fight involving rocky that some extra insurance could of been in place . A white american heavyweight today would be worth a mountain of money and it would of been just as important back then in a period race seemed more important than it does now . How long had it been since a white heavyweight title holder

What is the Lowry fight?

Fight many thought Lowry won. He won the first four rounds and many gave him two of the last six. All three judges voted for Marciano.

[Master]

Ok did Weill take advantage of his connections to the grey gentleman to smooth Rocky's path in his career before he got to title level

well ıf you mean '47 to '48 yes maybe. But guys he fought '48 onwards were legit. Vingo was no joke, he was 6 ft 4 and had all knockouts, undefeated. Rex Layne was an animal. etc...

Fight I always wonder about wsa the Cockell fight. Marciano kept clubbıng away and there was littie to no damage done. How could that be---was he pulling hıs punches?

Cockell had a strong chin.

[Bill Paxtom]

Monday ~ October 10, 1949

Rhode Island Auditorium ~ Providence, Rhode Island

Rocky Marciano ~ 20-0-0 {19 KO's} ~ 180 lbs.
vs.
Ted Lowry ~ 62-49-9 {42 KO's} ~ 178 lbs.

'The First Bout'

Ted had the bout won thru 4-Rounds. Then he changed tactics, and fought
passively from Rounds 5 thru 8, and let Rocky take the play away.

Those at the Rhode Island Auditorium thought that 'Tiger Ted' intentionally
went into a stall, and started booing in Rounds 6 and 7.

Ted did rally some in Rounds 9 and 10, and most of the {3696} in attendance
felt that Ted Lowry had won the bout.

[brocktonblockbust]

paxtom has some amazing facts. where did u find all that Bill?

[Bill Paxtom]

'Tiger' Ted Lowry

Age........ 29 years, 11 months
Height.... 5' 9 1/2"
Reach..... 72"
Weight.... 177 3/4 lbs.
Record.... 62-49-9 {42 KO's}
Manager.. Red Watson

'Tiger Ted' was the New England Light-Heavyweight Champion.

Ted was a muscular-built Black Man, and was a slugger who carried
a heavy right-hand, especially with the upper-cut.

But Ted was the recipient of many 'Bad Decisions', and was coming into
the bout by going only 3-15-2 in his previous 20-Bouts dating back to
July 1948 {15-Months}.

On a downer, Ted had lost '7-Straight' coming into this bout.

Manager - Red Watson >

"We have nothing to lose. Ted will slug this kid all over the Ring. He comes in
low, and that will be the perfect recipe for Ted's right-uppercuts."