Ok this is heresy but was Ali actually a total knob?

[Kev]

Ok I'm up late watching a rbr commentary of Frazier Ali 2 in which both Ali and Frazier were in the studio providing the commentary.

Ali is a complete douche! Calling the interviewer a white bigot and saying he lost the fight because of racism, e taunts Frazier relentlessly during the show causing Frazier eventually to stand up and square up to Ali who then jumps up and wrestles him to the floor.

Frazier then leaves in disgust but Ali is still there loving the platform he has and talking absolute shit

I don't think any boxer could get away with the crap he did back then and now I'm watching this willing Frazier to knock him the fuck out!

Anyone else ever seen this doc, or have recollections of Ali actually sometimes being a total Mayweatheresque tool?

[Gandalf]

Im sure he could be a knob when the fancy took him, especially when trying to hype a fight. Calling him Mayweatheresque is a bit much though! I always thought of Ali as quite intelligent.

I disagree with some of Ali's views when it comes down to issues such as race and religion. He seemed quite racist but then you look and see Angelo Dundee in his corner. Ali is awash with contradictions like that. He was very smart, but his actions would oftentimes show him up as a hypocrite. Women should not dress too liberally because it might attract other men, and yet he would cheat on his wife. Hmm.

[rjj tszyu]

Ali could come across somewhat arrogant, but he was nothing like Mayweather and his antics were pretty much for the benefit of selling the fight. He was a genius at this which is why he is the most popular sportsman of all time!

Oh yes and the fact he was the greatest too

[Violent Demise]

Ali could come across somewhat arrogant, but he was nothing like Mayweather and his antics were pretty much for the benefit of selling the fight. He was a genius at this which is why he is the most popular sportsman of all time!

Oh yes and the fact he was the greatest too

Wonder what fight Ali was trying to sell when he called Joe Louis an Uncle Tom?

[Memphis]

Sure he could be a prick. He took Frazers handouts when he was suspended and then mocked Frazer to the point of Joe hating him. Selling a fight or not as far as Frazer was concerned Ali went way too far.

When Ali lit the Olympic flame Frazer said he wanted him to fall in, now thats funny

Ali was either very clever and said all of the things he said tongue firmly in cheek, or he was a complete twat who insulted anyone and everyone when the opportunity presented itself, people just assumed it was the witty commentary of an intelligent man and not the words of a thick racist.

[deadlypete]

its funny because ali in his time at top was not very well liked at all but to really understand the racisim etc u have to place yurself in that period of time when he was coming up and became champion(martin luther kings time malcom x black marches for equality etc)when we look back in time now and c his interviews and comments and antics sure he comes across as a bit of a self centered clown but those were the times back then and too the white heirachy he was a mouthy black who didnt know his place(polishing the white mans superior shoes)and was a great inspirational hero to the black man....especially in that vietnam war era(no viet cong ever called me a nigga haha)he was a symbol of strength intelligence confidence(very cocky)wittyness and articulate for the black people when they needed all that.....long live the self proclaimed greatest
ps he did apologise eventually to fraizer but alwaysaid wat he did was in jest, the reason joe took it so personally was because joe trully liked ali and regarded him as a friend and felt alis antics was not necessary and too over the top

[Howlin Mad Missy]

its funny because ali in his time at top was not very well liked at all but to really understand the racisim etc u have to place yurself in that period of time when he was coming up and became champion(martin luther kings time malcom x black marches for equality etc)when we look back in time now and c his interviews and comments and antics sure he comes across as a bit of a self centered clown but those were the times back then and too the white heirachy he was a mouthy black who didnt know his place(polishing the white mans superior shoes)and was a great inspirational hero to the black man....especially in that vietnam war era(no viet cong ever called me a nigga haha)he was a symbol of strength intelligence confidence(very cocky)wittyness and articulate for the black people when they needed all that.....long live the self proclaimed greatest
ps he did apologise eventually to fraizer but alwaysaid wat he did was in jest, the reason joe took it so personally was because joe trully liked ali and regarded him as a friend and felt alis antics was not necessary and too over the top

So that's ok then. I think he went a bit mental when the X brotha's got hold of him.
Ali paved the way for trash talking.
Was it ok for him to say white folks were snakes? Gee ok not all of them but why would he risk getting bit? That's fine, then we're all ok with stating there are black folks and there are niggas?

[Bomp]

its funny because ali in his time at top was not very well liked at all but to really understand the racisim etc u have to place yurself in that period of time when he was coming up and became champion(martin luther kings time malcom x black marches for equality etc)when we look back in time now and c his interviews and comments and antics sure he comes across as a bit of a self centered clown but those were the times back then and too the white heirachy he was a mouthy black who didnt know his place(polishing the white mans superior shoes)and was a great inspirational hero to the black man....especially in that vietnam war era(no viet cong ever called me a nigga haha)he was a symbol of strength intelligence confidence(very cocky)wittyness and articulate for the black people when they needed all that.....long live the self proclaimed greatest
ps he did apologise eventually to fraizer but alwaysaid wat he did was in jest, the reason joe took it so personally was because joe trully liked ali and regarded him as a friend and felt alis antics was not necessary and too over the top

So that's ok then. I think he went a bit mental when the X brotha's got hold of him.
Ali paved the way for trash talking.
Was it ok for him to say white folks were snakes? Gee ok not all of them but why would he risk getting bit? That's fine, then we're all ok with stating there are black folks and there are niggas?

Ali went way too far with Frazier, and was certainly a hypocrite through his womanising.

However people's ideas and opinions are shaped throughout adulthood as well, and I don't believe he should just be brandished a bad person as things are rarely black and white. Deadlypete makes a great point about how blacks were still treated like shit at the time he joined the controversial nation of islam, so I think he has some justification for that action, especially as he has since recognised the errors in Elijah Muhammads treachings.

Like he said in his best quote 'A man who views the world the same at fifty as he did at twenty has wasted thirty years of his life.'

[BIG H]

its funny because ali in his time at top was not very well liked at all but to really understand the racisim etc u have to place yurself in that period of time when he was coming up and became champion(martin luther kings time malcom x black marches for equality etc)when we look back in time now and c his interviews and comments and antics sure he comes across as a bit of a self centered clown but those were the times back then and too the white heirachy he was a mouthy black who didnt know his place(polishing the white mans superior shoes)and was a great inspirational hero to the black man....especially in that vietnam war era(no viet cong ever called me a nigga haha)he was a symbol of strength intelligence confidence(very cocky)wittyness and articulate for the black people when they needed all that.....long live the self proclaimed greatest
ps he did apologise eventually to fraizer but alwaysaid wat he did was in jest, the reason joe took it so personally was because joe trully liked ali and regarded him as a friend and felt alis antics was not necessary and too over the top

Did he? I understood that he sent his son into Frazier's dressing room to say sorry, but never did it in person. May be wrong

[smashup]

Yeah true..infact Frazier is still bitter to this day.
Anyone see the recent Thrilla in Manilla documentary?
Brilliant stuff and i think it was on More4 of one of the channel 4 sister channels.
It still upsets him being called an "Uncle Tom" etc.

[Howlin Mad Missy]

its funny because ali in his time at top was not very well liked at all but to really understand the racisim etc u have to place yurself in that period of time when he was coming up and became champion(martin luther kings time malcom x black marches for equality etc)when we look back in time now and c his interviews and comments and antics sure he comes across as a bit of a self centered clown but those were the times back then and too the white heirachy he was a mouthy black who didnt know his place(polishing the white mans superior shoes)and was a great inspirational hero to the black man....especially in that vietnam war era(no viet cong ever called me a nigga haha)he was a symbol of strength intelligence confidence(very cocky)wittyness and articulate for the black people when they needed all that.....long live the self proclaimed greatest
ps he did apologise eventually to fraizer but alwaysaid wat he did was in jest, the reason joe took it so personally was because joe trully liked ali and regarded him as a friend and felt alis antics was not necessary and too over the top

Did he? I understood that he sent his son into Frazier's dressing room to say sorry, but never did it in person. May be wrong

Yep H & Smash. Same documentary that I saw. Very good.

[ElTerribleMorales]

Sure he could be a prick. He took Frazers handouts when he was suspended and then mocked Frazer to the point of Joe hating him. Selling a fight or not as far as Frazer was concerned Ali went way too far.

When Ali lit the Olympic flame Frazer said he wanted him to fall in, now thats funny

Ali was either very clever and said all of the things he said tongue firmly in cheek, or he was a complete twat who insulted anyone and everyone when the opportunity presented itself, people just assumed it was the witty commentary of an intelligent man and not the words of a thick racist.

people also need to keep in mind what time period this was all happening in, a time when you could get hosed down, had attack dogs set loose on you, and beaten down just cause you were black

[Taeth]

Both Ali and Robinson were arrogant pricks when they wanted to be. People criticize Mayweather and Roy Jones for being cocky, but Robinson and Ali were just as bad, and in Robinson's case he regularly beat his wife, and cheated on her which is something Ali obviously did as well.

[The Fightfan]

Ali was a complete racist piece of s**t in my mind. Yeah I've seen this documentary as many of other Ali documentaries which play repeatedly.

[MGG]

Sure Ali was a arrogant prick, after what they did to him during the Vietnam war was a shame. Still he had no right playing the race card with the interviewer or claiming robbery from the Frazier fight.