Philly shell vs other stances

[cambay411]

I was wondering what everyones opinion about the philly shell stance is. I mess around with it sometimes and i find that i cant protect myself as good with especially on the inside but on the other hand i feel like i can strike and especially counter better with it. Thoughts anyone?

[nikola_ganchev]

Hi, what do you understand under Philly shell? The basic stance(sideways with the weight on the back foot) just with the front hand down(which elavetes your scholder automatically evan more). I think its pretty damn good (almost all of the great ones have used it in one way or oder...). It takes alittle bit skill. But when you master it you have much more options. You are very good covert passive when you bring your sholder up. With alittle bit movement from the waist and the feeds you can block all types of streights with your scholder and if you crouch alittle bit the right haymakers from your oponent will fly alay(just watch Tonney vs Jirov). The best part in blocking with the sholder ist the robustness. I am heavyweight and when i take the shots on my sholder i dont feel them... I dont know how it is for you, but taking punches on my gloves from a puncher dont make me feel good If you master the rolling with the sholder and the ducking you are going to be pretty hard to hit. In doing so you have taken all the punches from the oder guy... The side ways stance gives you all oder type of goodies... You are mobile, you can trow all punches with max power, you can duck really easy (safety first!), gives you proper distance , awesome jab and so on and so on... The problem with the stance is that it takes alittle bit skill. Alot of the new coaches out there dont understand some fundamental skills and they want to make you run befor you can walk... They tell you stay squer with hands up and you are ready to go. Of cource the truth is not this.. In doing so you have given up form all the punches except from the left hook, you are mobile like a stone and you have no control over the distance. Evan young Mike Tyson boxes from the back foot when he is on distance... As i like to say, If you have found your head on the street go box from the front foot with the hands up... And to summ all the madness that i have written...

[nikola_ganchev]

Pluses:
1)You are mobile with great balace(from where you became fast and powerful)
2)Passive good covert
3)When you lear to duck and roll you are very hard to hit
4)You can punch with all punches with max power
5)your left hand is much mora versatile from down there
6)Enables you to crauch(For me this is so good that it deserves another thread)
7)The stance is very robust, balanced, mobile and with the rolling ability you can counter really good. You can trow all type of counters and you can easy box a higher oponent because of the mobility...
Minuses:
A trainer who understands something from boxing or time and desire to learn it the hard way.
And if i have forgoten something please excuse me.

[HerbM]

Are there any (significant) differences between the Philly Shell and the "Stonewall defense" promoted by Champ Thomas? (See the downloadable books in the Useful/Important posts subforum.)

If not, my first thought would be to read all of the Thomas material as he is almost completely devoted to this stance.

Also, there is mention of the Philly Shell by name in the Hatmaker book Boxing Mastery (where I went to check my understanding of the Philly Shell before posting this reply.)

I believe Nikola's only negative point was meant to say (something like): It's difficult to find a trainer/coach who is both open to this option and experienced in teaching it.

That is certainly true for me, and has stood in my way from trying this option.

As I am an older boxer who will almost certainly never box competitively nor seriously, much of my boxing training is personally focused on improving my general self-defense skills and both supplementing and integrating my skills from other combat arts under realistic (fully resisting opponent with forceful blows) conditions.

The Philly Shell actually resembles one nearly passive (but very protective) PRE-fight stance: The Jack Benny: One hand horizontal to the opposite elbow with that second arm vertical with the hand AT the chin.

This is a very good PRE-fight stance during the time one is attempting to defuse a situation, avoid a fight, or determine if criminal attack is about to be launched.

My tendency is to believe that the similarities are NOT accidental.

--
HerbM

[nikola_ganchev]

Hi HerbM,
You are absolutely right.There are alot of exact matches, because boxing has evolved from free fight and when you fight without big handgloves you must use robuster parts of your body(forearms and sholders) and you must be much more elusive(not like the new UFC guys eating punches like candys)... I think there is no difference between Stone wall and philly shell too. Only in the stone wall Champ Thomas has forgoten some very important things like rythm...

[Scrap]

The 1st guy I saw using it was Charly Burly. its not new .