FBI suspected that Ali's KO of Liston was fixed

[FinitoElDinamita]

FBI Suspected That Ali's Knockout of Liston Was Fixed - Boxing News

U guys don't believe in this phantom punch bullshit right or that Liston was too afraid to get up?

[powerpuncher]

im really not sure what i believe. i wouldnt be surprised either way though. i dont see liston winning that fight fixed or not.

[Vendettos]

FBI Suspected That Ali's Knockout of Liston Was Fixed - Boxing News

U guys don't believe in this phantom punch bullshit right or that Liston was too afraid to get up?

Isn't this common knowledge?

I dunno, it's hard to say. I've seen people stay down from less than the punch that landed. Hell, Kell Brook stopped someone with a jab

[erics44]

boxing is the most corrupt sport in the world

theres probably a fight every week thats fixed, ali liston is just one of the high profile iconic ones that gets mentioned

some are fixes are completely clear yet people just accept it

why arent fights investigated all the time? the judges and the referees

burns beltram for example, klitchko

[Beanflicker]

I always believed Liston threw the fight. I never thought for a second that Ali had anything to do with it, or that he wouldn't have won again.

I don't believe in this phantom punch nonsense though. The punch DID land, it wasn't the hardest shot ever thrown but it was quick, landed directly on the chin, and Liston walked right into it.

I believe that Liston was legitimately dropped by that punch, but having planned to throw the fight coming in, decided to act more hurt than he was and take the full count.

[IamInuit]

I always believed Liston threw the fight. I never thought for a second that Ali had anything to do with it, or that he wouldn't have won again.

I don't believe in this phantom punch nonsense though. The punch DID land, it wasn't the hardest shot ever thrown but it was quick, landed directly on the chin, and Liston walked right into it.

I believe that Liston was legitimately dropped by that punch, but having planned to throw the fight coming in, decided to act more hurt than he was and take the full count.

First lol at the FBI. Why didn't they do anything about it? Probably half the planet thought it was a fix at the time and it has been part of boxing discussions for over 45 years. I mean really, pre knowledge of racketeering at that level and you do nothing?

I tend to agree that it was a tricky shot and looks can be deceiving.




Evaluate the punch for yourselves. What is it you both see and don't see? Ali was coming forward and over the top and from the angle of the gif appears to nail the sweet spot. Perhaps Liston said screw this and stayed down .

This could just as easily be described as a quit as a fix. Its almost to obvious a fix to be one.

[Beanflicker]

Well I think it discounts the notion that it was a "phantom punch": you can clearly see the shot land on Liston's jaw, and the force knock his head back.

Like I said, I have no doubt that the punch was enough to score a flash knockdown. Liston A) was moving his body into the punch, B) was turning his head into the punch, and C) didn't see the punch coming, and when those three criteria are met, the result is usually a knockdown or a knockout, even when the punch itself isn't a bomb. There is a lot of power added to even a low-powered shot when those criteria are met.

I think even the punch itself is underrated: clearly Ali's not sitting down on it or getting his body into it, but he does get a decent amount of snap from his shoulder into the punch at the end. Wasn't a huge blow, but it wasn't the light tap that most boxing fans make it out to be.

I don't think the punch knocked him out, though. Like I said, I think he was going to throw it going in, got dropped, and decided it would be much easier to just not get it up and embellish the punch. You can see he kinda goes down gingerly, reaching his arms out to break his fall, almost like he tripped on something. He seemed fully conscious until the mid count, then it looked like he suddenly decided he was very rocked.

[Silkeyjoe]

boxing is the most corrupt sport in the world

theres probably a fight every week thats fixed, ali liston is just one of the high profile iconic ones that gets mentioned

some are fixes are completely clear yet people just accept it

why arent fights investigated all the time? the judges and the referees

burns beltram for example, klitchko

Disagree. Tennis and football are far worse. Games fixed on a daily basis.

[Master]

I would normally think that punch by Ali would not knock down Liston. However if you watch the tape, Sonny gets back up and continues to fight. It was only when Natt got involved and told the ref to stop it that Liston stopped fighting. Therefore I think it was a legitimate punch.

[p4pking]

I would normally think that punch by Ali would not knock down Liston. However if you watch the tape, Sonny gets back up and continues to fight. It was only when Natt got involved and told the ref to stop it that Liston stopped fighting. Therefore I think it was a legitimate punch.

You must be thinking of the first fight?

[smashup]

Fuck me do some of you honestly believe that pathetic tap on the chin Ali brushed hum with could floor a seriously tough Heavyweight like Liston?

Wise up ffs!!

[cambay411]

I think its a very good possibility that Liston knew he was about to be a punching bag for 15 rounds and decided to just stay down.


Ali broke him in the first fight and as much as Ali ran his mouth he probably just wanted out of there and it all over with.


Even if Ali didn't punish him that fight it would have just been a frustrating fight for Liston. He was to slow to even come close to catching Ali.


Chuvalo claims he knows for a fact that the fight was fixed.


We will probably never know really.

[erics44]

there seems to be a generalopinion that liston threw the fight

some people are suggesting that he stayed down coz he quit

and the fbi think he made lots of money out of it

[smashup]

Liston was owned by the Mob, if they wanted him to lay down in a certain round so they could bet huge amounts of money on it he would have had to play ball.

Its common knowledge Liston was Mafia owned

http://espn.go.com/classic/biography/s/Liston_Sonny.html

[cambay411]

Liston was owned by the Mob, if they wanted him to lay down in a certain round so they could bet huge amounts of money on it he would have had to play ball.

Its common knowledge Liston was Mafia owned

ESPN Classic - Liston was trouble in and out of ring

I always heard he layed down because he received threats from the Nation of Islam. I think that's what Chuvalo says.