Rooney

[erics44]

all this shit about rooney at the minute I thought id make a thread about it

hes still good enough for England, no doubt

but his England career has been a real disappointment, his first major tournament and those 4 goals in the groups, I was thinking weve found our Pele

But he has done nothing since, that was it, the end of his international success

I still believe to this day that if he hadn't have got injured against Portugal in 2004 wed have gone on to win it

[El Kabong]

I hate the hair plugged douchebag to be quite honest....mostly because he plays for the Scum and also because he has been quite good for a long time.


England has a lot of quality players but they never mesh well together. Gerrard and Lampard couldn't fit on the same pitch together, both were very talented but either due to manager or tactics or whatever, they didn't play well together and that's what I see when I look at England. I see a starting 11 with loads of talent, but they play as individuals, their styles don't compliment each other.

England is at a crossroads, the days of Gerrard, Lampard, Terry, Beckham, Joe Cole, it's all over and done with and what's even better is you're done with Big Sam too! You get the opportunity for a new manager to come in with no ties to anyone, no players should be locked in for a call up to the squad so the new gaffer can build a TEAM on his own and that's what you need to have more success (just my take on it again so obviously not the gospel).

Now if a manager was to come in and say "How do I get the best out of Wayne Rooney?" (which is quite a different question than "How do I get England to be successful?" so it can have quite a different answer) then I'd say you have to figure out what role Rooney is best suited for and what formation that would then force you into playing. Rooney is a striker but his pace isn't what it used to be and his strength was never the best so up front by his lonesome in a 451 doesn't cut it for me...now in a front 3 a true front 3 not with "wingers" but with other forwards like Sturridge and Welbeck he could do alright as those players are all good with the ball at their feet and if they would seamlessly rotate positions they could really confuse defenders. I am not certain why, but Rooney is often dropped deeper which to me is like trying to get a horse to climb a tree, I think the deepest he should get dropped is CF/Second Striker where he's just ahead of attacking midfielders and not forced to be a box-to-box player because that doesn't play to his strengths.

If I was managing England I'd roll out something like this 11
ST: Kane/Vardy
CF: Rooney
LW: Sterling RW: Sturridge/Welbeck
CM: Henderson, Alli/Barkley
LB: Shaw CB: Stones, Smalling RB: Clyne
GK: Hart

But the problem with that is that again most Premier League clubs don't play a 4411/442 so the players aren't the most used to that and it's not as if you could mold that into a 433 that would actually work either unless you put Rooney at Striker in which case I'd bring in Lallana at CF and drop him a little further back to CAM for that 451 and in the past that just hasn't worked. I think Rooney is a great player, he's had a bit of a rough season so far, but for the National team I think he's the square peg and attempting to force him into the side does a disservice to the rest of the team....it's a shame really but that kind of thing happens to players all the time.

[erics44]

the world cup/euros is about fine moments of luck and inches either way

2002 world cup England went out on a cross, and there was no one left in the draw, brazil won the world cup on that cross
2004 an injury to rooney and a golden goal ruled out for nothing
2006 we went out to Portugal in the most one sided game in world cup history where the best team lost, even after the sending off we could have played 4 days solid and Portugal wouldnt have scored, not even have a shot of any meaning

that was the golden generation, lamps, stevey G, owen, becks, Wazza, etc

a slight stroke of luck our way and you never know

Stevey G and Lamps could play together

[erics44]

you could go back further

1998 - shocking sending off decision
1996 - width of the post, twice
1990 - a deflected goal and penalties in a game we dominated
1986 - hand ball
1982 - never lost a game

its inches that haven't fallen our way

[Mark TKO]

you could go back further

1998 - shocking sending off decision
1996 - width of the post, twice
1990 - a deflected goal and penalties in a game we dominated
1986 - hand ball
1982 - never lost a game

its inches that haven't fallen our way

true you need a bit of luck - Italy were shite in the group stages of 82 and got three draws ((I think - can't be arsed googling to check). Then unbelievably they go on to beat one of the greatest Brazilian teams of all time. Italy were again nothing special when they won the trophy again in 2006.

1996 - still can't believe how Gazza's foot didn't connect for that golden goal..........

But we've been awful in the last 3, never ,mind luck, and there's no hiding from that

Rooney's time is not up yet I feel but it soon will be. If someone's better than him then they start instead - simple

[Primo Carnera]

you could go back further

1998 - shocking sending off decision
1996 - width of the post, twice
1990 - a deflected goal and penalties in a game we dominated
1986 - hand ball
1982 - never lost a game

its inches that haven't fallen our way

Fucking hell, when will you ever learn. Why can you not see that England are without doubt the most under achieving country that has ever played the game considering the amount of players and the money in the game over here.
NOBODY gets shit luck all the time, and the more that everyone blames everything but the fact that they ain't good enough , the less chance they ever have of getting it right. Let's look at the sob story shall we?

1998 - shocking sending off decision - yeah cos it's ok to kick out at players isn't it. They were shit leading up to that game, lost to Romania , scraped through the group , that's why the played Argentina in that round.
1996 - width of the post, twice - playing at home, Germany had their chances and were good value. Spain were all over England in the previous match , they were great against a Shit Holland team, lucky against Scotland, shit against Switzerland, so all in all, pretty average I would say.

1990 - a deflected goal and penalties in a game we dominated - I wouldn't say Dominated. Also struggled like fuck against Cameroon, CAMEROON FFS! Lat kick of the game against Belgium , who were the better side btw. Crap in the group stages as well.
1986 - hand ball - yep Handball. Forget about the best goal ever scored in World Cup finals tournaments. England were 2-0 down and a load of shite before they even started playing. More importantly, how the fuck did they even reach that stage? Drew with Morocco and lost to Portugal , played a miracle game against Poland just to get out of the group. Hardly the stuff of champions!

1982 - never lost a game - never scored a goal in 3 hours of Football in the 2nd group stage. Never had a shot in one game, and Keegan missed a sitter with their only chance in the other game. Hardly hard done by.

2002 world cup England went out on a cross, and there was no one left in the draw, brazil won the world cup on that cross - so it's bad luck when a keeper is shit enough to beat from 50 yards? And don't tell me England were better than Brazil that day.

2004 an injury to rooney and a golden goal ruled out for nothing - Injuries happen, and do you think teams win tournaments when ALL their hopes are pinned on one 18 year old boy?

2006 we went out to Portugal in the most one sided game in world cup history where the best team lost, even after the sending off we could have played 4 days solid and Portugal wouldnt have scored, not even have a shot of any meaning -
if you couldn't beat an average Portugal side, you don't deserve to win the World Cup. How did the Group go? Oh yeah, lucky draw against Sweden (who the couldn't beat for over 30 years btw.), lucky own goal against Paraguay and beating "Superpower" Trinidad and Tobago courtesy of a goal by Crouch that should've been disallowed.

that was the golden generation, lamps, stevey G, owen, becks, Wazza, etc - Golden Generation? They won fuck all!
Stevey G and Lamps could play together - shows how good they were. Under achievers! Which World Cup was it that Lampard had 31 shots and not one on target?
You seem to have forgot 2010? Oh yeah, it was pretty forgetful !
The truth is England have only ever won one Tournament......and that was in their own backyard, with a Goal the DIDN'T GO OVER THE LINE!!!! Let's get real please, and less of the

[erics44]

1998 - simeone went through the back of beckham at high speed, should have at least been booked, then becks leg travelled 6 inches, that ref had a history of aweful decisions including sending offs

and even then we scored legitimate golden goal which the same shocking ref ruled out

so yep, shocking sending off and refereeing display as a whole

[El Kabong]

the world cup/euros is about fine moments of luck and inches either way

...and competent reffing, can't tell you how many times the US have been jobbed by the refs



Gerrard and Lamps played together, but they weren't at their best together because they had the same roles for the most part the CM who bombed forward and scored goals/made key assists.

[erics44]

mcclaren was shit and capello was shitter

we have to recover from that period

and sven wasn't great either, he just had some absolute fantastic players

[Beanz]

They need to go back to oranges and hot mugs of tea at half time. Nobody ever won anything by drinking Lucozade or having an undercut sponsored by Timotei. Dry toast as well. Win a game and you get some butter. One more loss ? Kick in the bollocks.

[Dia bando]

You need to support Wales we have about 2 or 3 class players.
But they play as a team not as a bunch of well paid individuals.
England have under performed for years, nobody has a right to win just because you have a bunch of stars.
Rooney is past his best but because he is held in high regard he has been played. Big Sam was a joke uncle Roy was fucking rubbish.
England need a clean out Rooney is not playing well drop him, the same as Man U have dropped him simple.

[El Kabong]

You need to support Wales we have about 2 or 3 class players.
But they play as a team not as a bunch of well paid individuals.
England have under performed for years, nobody has a right to win just because you have bunch of stars.
Rooney is past his best but because he is held in high regard he has been played. Big Sam was a joke uncle Roy was fucking rubbish.
England need a clean out Rooney is not playing well drop him, the same as Man U have dropped him simple.

Who needs to support Wales?


Wee Joe Allen, Gareth 'Monkeyface' Bale, Ashley Williams, Aaron 'Rambo' Ramsey, and Ben Davies...very good players, I'd take all of them on the US team lol.


I'm just hoping Pusilic ends up being the goods

[Dia bando]

England the expectations are high and it's players the results are pretty poor. Talented individuals that can't play as a team managers that could not do anything with talented players pretty poor.
Wales a few good players but they showed some passion and hunger, they had some good results.
Wales supporters don't have high expectations but they done well.
Now this is were it changes all of sudden expectations are high.!
The last result was a draw they got slagged off by supporters, there nothing so fickle as football supporters true.!

[Memphis]

The eternal optimist in me saw me watch an hour of the game last night before turning over to watch a Wheeler Dealer repeat. Once again totally woeful, unable to do the basics, no one wanting to take responsibility. I think my future criteria for watching England is this. Watch full of hope, as soon as I see Gary fucking Cahill striding towards the half way line looking for someone to pass to and every other England shirt doing their best job of running away/hiding, thats when I switch off.

[El Kabong]

I think England needs to focus on team and not individual stars. This same issue came up with USA basketball. For so long we just had so much talent nobody could touch us but there came a time when the players weren't all pulling in the same direction. When that happens you go back to basics and eventually stars humble themselves (in order to get back in the side) and play as a team.

Guys like Milner, Vardy, Barry, your blue collar workhorses those guys make teams successful more often than the superstars.

Look at Portugal, CR7 doesn't do it all by himself. There are unsung heroes on that team. Messi doesn't have that on his Argentina team he's needed it.