Taekwondo is the ULTIMATE art!

[hardrock]

I have done Taekwondo and what I learnt is that it allows all the moves of

a Muay Thai and some extra fancy flying kicks. It also involves some techniques

to twist/bend the opponants hand/arm.

What are your thoughts?

[Von Milash]

No. A whole bunch of nothing practical.

[Heavy D]

I'm assuming this is a joke topic of sorts....you may even be the first on this board, so gratz on that.

If serious, nope. TKD is better than nothing, but many many other things are better than TKD. Granted, the old "teacher > art" axiom obviously applies, but generally TKD tends to be for semi-contact point sparring, as opposed to all out fighting, and point sparring doesn't exactly help in a real fight. I actually fought a TKD practictioner in college (dont remember what belt...he wasn't black, but it was one of the higher ones) and beat him with relative ease. TKD has a few gimmick kicks that, if landed successfully (a VERY big if), could end the fight, but they generally tend to be very easily avoidable. And TKDs hand skills and grappling/submissions skills are EXTREMELY subpar. And hand skills and grappling/submission skills are FAR more useful in a fight than kicking in almost all situations.

[Munkymagic]

Sorry. Can't answer this without really being offending to the orginal poster. My son does TaeKwonDo...he's 4...he does it to get rid of energy. For me it offers nothing practical, in the street or in the octagon. Granted you will develop powerful kicks but other than that. Not much else. The kicking techniques are well telegraphed and to make it work in any shape or form you have to be ridiculously good at it.
When you said you have 'done' taekwondo i am assuming you've had a few lessons, got a couple of grades and think its the mutts nuts. It looks good..but trust me son, don't depend on it in a real go. You'll learn a harsh lesson.

I've sparred with a supposed TKD black belt, style against style and the only other style i found easier to overcome was wing chun.

Like all things though. Opinions vary

[voodoo_dude]

I dont think there is one ultimate art....
Ive watched a few olympic TKD fights and I wasnt really impressed, I cannot see them techniques working on the street.
It looks more like a game/sport than combat to me.

[hardrock]

To Munky & Heavy D,

It is true TKD has fancy kicks. Fancy routines that lead no-where? Maybe?

But I have researched the art, and one who understands the art knows its got te same punches as boxing, the same kicks and knees and elbows as Muay Thai.

The difference is, the style of the fight, a Muay Thai and Kickboxer fight via boxing and low kicks and mid-section kicks.

A Wing Chung fighter is way to fancy for the street. I wouldn't want to take the ricks of feeling the arms of my street fighter to get a sense of their next move.

I would chuck a punch first, a low lick second and wrestling last. The Muppets you both beat are probelly trying an sport TKD for a street fight, which is wrong,
or else they are not skilled.

Lastly, a belt means nothing, it just keeps the uniform in place.

Based on my research sport TKD is about kicking with the hands down.
Traditional TKD is a preety art form. Realistic practical Taekwondo looks like
a kickboxer in some cases.

The Dojangs (Dojo) Masters don't teach enough about real life application and how to combat other arts. I know I went to one for some time.

Hope this post as been helpful. Thanks to: voodoo_dude, Von Milash for posts.

[voodoo_dude]

so are you training in TKD now?
For a while I was interested in some kind of kicking art (muay thai, kickboxing or TKD) but I ruled out TKD because it didnt seem as practical for self defense on the street.

Anyway Im sticking with boxing now for sure.

[hardrock]

so are you training in TKD now?
For a while I was interested in some kind of kicking art (muay thai, kickboxing or TKD) but I ruled out TKD because it didnt seem as practical for self defense on the street.

Anyway Im sticking with boxing now for sure.

I do it at home. I know the stuff they never ever taught the white and yellow belts.
I don't do ariel kicks. I prefer a grounded kicking style (low-mid section) and pure boxing with strikes.

I only use it for fitness though. I goto a boxing gym at the moment. I agree boxing is the real deal. Sparring this monday (2min rds x 3) so hope that goes well.

BTW For self defence you need to know: wrestling, striking, punching (no reverse punching), kicking and dirty tactics (head butts, biting, hair pulling, stoomping foot, twisting ear etc).

No old martial art is complete. Krav Maga is good as I hear.

[Heavy D]

Krav Magra is overrated. From a self defense standpoint, its nothing new (stab the guy in the throat, kick his balls, poke out his eyes, basically just fight dirty and do whatever you have to). From a competitive fighting perspective, its garbage. "Grab the arm when they punch" stuff....none of it ever works if anyone has even the SLIGHTEST idea what theyre doing. A friend of a friend just got done serving like 4 or so years in the Israeli Defense Forces (where Krav Magra originated and is taught). He talked a lot of shit and in the end, he was sprawled on his ass. He said things like "well in a real fight, I'd have my knife and itd be done in two seconds", to which I replied "You're right. Cuz in a real fight, I'd shoot your ass the second I saw that knife"

And to original question, it sounds to me like your talking about boxing with a few TKD kicks and some basic grappling moves. Which isn't TKD at all (from my experiences). There's nothing wrong with that, to supplement your boxing. TKD will teach you to kick better, and with the right teacher, you WOULD be a damned tough fighter. The problem is that, with TKD moreso than any other art besides maybe Kung Fu or Karate, you are going to have one hell of a time finding a legitimate teacher who teaches his students to properly use the art in a manner that is feasible in a real fight. There are so many crap teachers out there who teach solely to make money. They start their "McDojos" in suburban areas and overcharge the hell out of everything. Or maybe they start in an inner city with the hopes of just giving children some structure in their life to keep them off the streets (like many boxing gyms do, and I applaud both for their actions)

[hardrock]

Trust me friend, I researched TKD alot. Net, books, media clips, articles, peoples opinions.

The same punches in boxing can be used in TKD and still called TKD.

As for Krav Maga, I dunno, only went by what I head.

As for McDojo's, London has tons of them. I went to one, which I found out closed maybe 5/8 years ago. Feckers charged me and my bro a ton for TKD.

[Heavy D]

Yes and no....you can use them in TKD, but then you aren't practicing straight TKD. If you have to use your boxing skills in TKD (which punches and stances far differently from everything I know) in TKD, how can it be the ULTIMATE art? Why wouldn't boxing be the ultimate martial art, if you just use TKD kicks? TKD is a good kicking art, but otherwise, it is SEVERELY lacking. Even in kicking, the great majority of the kicks are impractical/desperation (spinning back kick, axe kicks, etc)

[Von Milash]

Hardrock, I don't want to come off as a jerk, but if you think TKD is the ultimate art, you're delusional. I've only ever seen one TKD expert do anything decent in an MMA event...can't rememebr the details, but he distilled his tactics down to simplicity... leg kicks, a few high kicks, etc. But when his opponent got inside he was n trouble. And you're sorely mistaking if you think those high flying kicks are of any use in a real situation. Only against someone who has NO fighting background would it come in handy. But against another skilled fighter, it's almost as useless as kung fu.

A few months back I went in this place for a beer. Sat down next to a guy who happened to be a karate student. About my age, early/mid 30's, we got talking mma...ufc, pride etc. We were talking the varous arts and I almost said, "TKD is total BS." Luckily before I did I asked him what kind of karate he studied, and he said, actually it's TKD. Oops. But he was showing me these strikes and defense moves that were absolute rubbish. Like D said, grab the arm, etc. That shit only works in a dojo with a submissive partner. Don't waste your time. If you want to kick, do kickboxing, then MT. IMO a kickboxer is better than a MT guy. MT elbows andf knees are great, but they're a far cruder calibre of boxer. IMO.

[Von Milash]

hey D, who is that in your avatar pic? just curious.

[Von Milash]

He said things like "well in a real fight, I'd have my knife and itd be done in two seconds",

classic. do you really have to STUDY to shank someone? I'm not a knife fighter but I guarantee I can knife someone just as well as a krav maga dude. Hell, if you want to se skill with a knife just turn on the Food Channel.

I also love to see this shit on espn when they do stick fighting drills and they're judged. "Oh, that was PERFECTLY executed." Right, what a f'ing load. Again, I'm not a trained stick fighter but I guarantee that if I swung it like I did a baseball bat for 25years (and at the college level), it's 100x more effective than that little spinning twirl shit. But mine wasn't pretty, except if you're a baseball player I guess.

[MrB]

Taekwondo is ballet stuff. You cant use those kind of silly kicks in a real fight. I spar with Taekwondo , Karate guys and I am able to drop them with the wackiest low kick I can deliver. Yes, I train in Muay Thai but aint a high level performer