Tyson vs Frazier Tyson vs Marciano

[Samson3000]

tyson could beat them both---but dont fu**** bullhs*** about how easy it would b 2 beat marciano---and then exclude frazier. frazier would get ko the same round as rocky. so dont single out marciano--in a question that involves both

Disagree here. I agree Tyson would KO them both, but he would have a much easier time with Marciano. I think the Marciano fans on this site have seen the movie Rocky III one too many times. A little 185 pound fighter isn't going to stand a chance against a bonified heavyweight. Marciano reigned during not only the weakest era of heavyweights, but also one of the smallest eras. The fighters he beat over 210 lbs are today's equivalent of Tough Man contestants(and yes, Joe Louis was an old man). If you want to hypothetically match him up with today's cruiserweights that's fine, let me tell you, Marciano get's destroyed against every major heavyweight today, and even going back 30 years. Marciano wouldn't have lasted 5 minutes as a heavyweight in the 70s.

[maracho]

Y’all should know by now that fighters were much more durable in Rocky’s day and are getting less durable all of the time. No fighters can endure the exceptionally long rounds fought in the past and in more recent times, if Tyson or even Lennox Lewis took all the punches that say for instance Frazier took from Ali, they would be dead. Science has proven this to some extent with plants and animals. For instance, Most types of fruits and vegetables today have considerably less nutrients than they did just 30 years ago. Fossil teeth and bones of men and animals have become much less dense over time. The reasons for this are due to the laws of entropy and thermodynamics that are causing a measurable weakening of the earth’s magnetic field, spin, internal heat engine, etc…

Marciano specialized in knocking out the toughest of the tough in days much tougher than tyson could ever take. Marciano could also take a much better punch than Tyson. Lewis, Charles & Wolcott were call considered big punchers and blasted Rocky round after round, Charles split Rocky's nose wide open but they still all got their buuts kicked in the end.


Small, past-his-prime Hollyfield took everything Tyson had and still knocked him out. Other relatively light punchers hurt Tyson to in his prime as well. Hollyfield and Douglas never knocked any upper tier heavyweights out except Tyson. Marciano would have done it much easier in my opinion. University of Washington and the U.S Military measured Rocky’s punch at an amazing 1000 foot pounds which if I recall correctly was much greater than Tyson’s punch stats.


Here are some other writers who actually know what they are talking about.

http://www.geocities.com/Colosseum/A...47//Rock3.html

http://www.geocities.com/Colosseum/A...//stamina.html

http://www.eastsideboxing.com/news.php?p=3845&more=1

[benjamindallas554]

I would think Tyson would have had an easy time against both of those guys..Though they all have tremendous power,I think Tysons hand speed and Blazing power combo's would make the difference

watcha guys and gals think?

I actually think quiet the opposite. Evander Holyfield showed that the way to beat Tyson. That was to apply pressure and back him up. With that being said. There were few heavyweights in the history of boxing better at fighting that way then Rocky Marciano and Joe Frazier. Both of these guys just got the right style to beat mike. Tyson had a little bit of a size and weight advantage on Rocky. But I don't think that would of mattered a bit. Rocky was used to that. Rocky was also in far better condition. He never stopped coming no matter what. And he was like a buzz saw that just kept throwing more punches every round. He seemed almost to never tire. And both Rocky and Joe weren't the type to be intimidated by Tyson's prefight antics. So I just don't see Tyson's style being that effective against 2 truly great fighters that have the one style, Tyson has problems with.

[smashcrusher]

Y’all should know by now that fighters were much more durable in Rocky’s day and are getting less durable all of the time. No fighters can endure the exceptionally long rounds fought in the past and in more recent times, if Tyson or even Lennox Lewis took all the punches that say for instance Frazier took from Ali, they would be dead. Science has proven this to some extent with plants and animals. For instance, Most types of fruits and vegetables today have considerably less nutrients than they did just 30 years ago. Fossil teeth and bones of men and animals have become much less dense over time. The reasons for this are due to the laws of entropy and thermodynamics that are causing a measurable weakening of the earth’s magnetic field, spin, internal heat engine, etc…

Marciano specialized in knocking out the toughest of the tough in days much tougher than tyson could ever take. Marciano could also take a much better punch than Tyson. Lewis, Charles & Wolcott were call considered big punchers and blasted Rocky round after round, Charles split Rocky's nose wide open but they still all got their buuts kicked in the end.


Small, past-his-prime Hollyfield took everything Tyson had and still knocked him out. Other relatively light punchers hurt Tyson to in his prime as well. Hollyfield and Douglas never knocked any upper tier heavyweights out except Tyson. Marciano would have done it much easier in my opinion. University of Washington and the U.S Military measured Rocky’s punch at an amazing 1000 foot pounds which if I recall correctly was much greater than Tyson’s punch stats.


Here are some other writers who actually know what they are talking about.

http://www.geocities.com/Colosseum/A...47//Rock3.html

http://www.geocities.com/Colosseum/A...//stamina.html

http://www.eastsideboxing.com/news.php?p=3845&more=1

Small Holyfield? Evander is almost 6'3. That hardly constitutes being small in my book.

[smashcrusher]

I would think Tyson would have had an easy time against both of those guys..Though they all have tremendous power,I think Tysons hand speed and Blazing power combo's would make the difference

watcha guys and gals think?

I actually think quiet the opposite. Evander Holyfield showed that the way to beat Tyson. That was to apply pressure and back him up. With that being said. There were few heavyweights in the history of boxing better at fighting that way then Rocky Marciano and Joe Frazier. Both of these guys just got the right style to beat mike. Tyson had a little bit of a size and weight advantage on Rocky. But I don't think that would of mattered a bit. Rocky was used to that. Rocky was also in far better condition. He never stopped coming no matter what. And he was like a buzz saw that just kept throwing more punches every round. He seemed almost to never tire. And both Rocky and Joe weren't the type to be intimidated by Tyson's prefight antics. So I just don't see Tyson's style being that effective against 2 truly great fighters that have the one style, Tyson has problems with.

Evander beat Tyson because he has more upper body strength than him and was able to push him back all night long. Tyson hits harder, but Evander is stronger. When it comes to strength, Tyson is on another planet than Marciano. And in Tyson's prime, the man was a machine as far as conditioning. Tyson-Marciano would be identical to Tyson-Marvis Frazier.

[maracho]

Do a little research and you will see that Hollyfield was considered a small heavyweight even compared to short tyson. Heck, there are even welterweights over six foot.

On the other hand Marciano fought alot of guys over six foot including Louis, Walcott, and Ezzard Charles.

Scientific punching sensers prove that Marciano was stronger.

[smashcrusher]

Do a little research and you will see that Hollyfiels was considered a small heavywheight even compared to short tyson. Heck, there are even welterweights over six foot.

On the other hand Marciano fought alot of guys over six foot including Louis, Walcott, and Ezzard Charles.

Scientific punching sensers prove that Marciano was stronger.

Maybe you should do alittle research and you'll understand that the only reason Evander is referred to as being 'undersized' is that he was competing during the dawn of the 'superheavyweight' era.

sorry

[benjamindallas554]

Evander beat Tyson because he has more upper body strength than him and was able to push him back all night long. Tyson hits harder, but Evander is stronger. When it comes to strength, Tyson is on another planet than Marciano. And in Tyson's prime, the man was a machine as far as conditioning. Tyson-Marciano would be identical to Tyson-Marvis Frazier.

"And in Tyson's prime, the man was a machine as far as conditioning" That I just really don't believe. Yeah he looked ripped,but his fights rarely went the distance. He was never pressured for 12 straight rounds the way Rocky would of pressured him. Name one fight that Tyson was pressured in, and that lasted more then 10 rounds? That's right the only fights Tyson had like that he lost in! He was in no where near the shape of a Rocky Marciano. Tyson didn't hit that much harder then Rocky either. Rocky Marciano is one of the hardest punchers in the history of heavyweights. He used to break bones when he hit people. I even heard he once knocked out a bull! Don't know if it's true or not.Tyson my have been a bit stronger but not that much stronger no way. Tyson would of definitely had his hands full with a guy that comes straight ahead and hits as hard as he does. And not to mention a guy that is in better condition. Rocky trained for 15 rounds not 12.

[Samson3000]

Do a little research and you will see that Hollyfield was considered a small heavyweight even compared to short tyson. Heck, there are even welterweights over six foot.

On the other hand Marciano fought alot of guys over six foot including Louis, Walcott, and Ezzard Charles.

Scientific punching sensers prove that Marciano was stronger.

Scientific punching sensers prove that Marciano was stronger? I was mistaken. Before I said the Marciano fans on this site saw the movie Rocky III one too many times. Apparently they saw the movie Rocky IV one too many times .

[Samson3000]

Evander beat Tyson because he has more upper body strength than him and was able to push him back all night long. Tyson hits harder, but Evander is stronger. When it comes to strength, Tyson is on another planet than Marciano. And in Tyson's prime, the man was a machine as far as conditioning. Tyson-Marciano would be identical to Tyson-Marvis Frazier.

"And in Tyson's prime, the man was a machine as far as conditioning" That I just really don't believe. Yeah he looked ripped,but his fights rarely went the distance. He was never pressured for 12 straight rounds the way Rocky would of pressured him. Name one fight that Tyson was pressured in, and that lasted more then 10 rounds? That's right the only fights Tyson had like that he lost in! He was in no where near the shape of a Rocky Marciano. Tyson didn't hit that much harder then Rocky either. Rocky Marciano is one of the hardest punchers in the history of heavyweights. He used to break bones when he hit people. I even heard he once knocked out a bull! Don't know if it's true or not.Tyson my have been a bit stronger but not that much stronger no way. Tyson would of definitely had his hands full with a guy that comes straight ahead and hits as hard as he does. And not to mention a guy that is in better condition. Rocky trained for 15 rounds not 12.

What's hysterical about this argument is that the Maciano fans even bring conditioning into this, as if Marciano would make it past the one minute mark .

[maracho]

Experience and knowledge know it is not the size of the dog for instance just look at James Toney and Roy jones, Jack Demsey and many, many others that have beaten much bigger fighters.

speaking of research, go to google and type Evander Hollyfield + small and learn what true experts say and he is 6.2' and not 6.3'

[maracho]

Do a little research and you will see that Hollyfiels was considered a small heavywheight even compared to short tyson. Heck, there are even welterweights over six foot.

On the other hand Marciano fought alot of guys over six foot including Louis, Walcott, and Ezzard Charles.

Scientific punching sensers prove that Marciano was stronger.

Maybe you should do alittle research and you'll understand that the only reason Evander is referred to as being 'undersized' is that he was competing during the dawn of the 'superheavyweight' era.

sorry

No the real reason was that he was a natural Cruiserweight who moved up to heavy.

[benjamindallas554]

What's hysterical about this argument is that the Maciano fans even bring conditioning into this, as if Marciano would make it past the one minute mark .

If you can name one fight in which Tyson was pressured for 10 plus rounds. (And it has to be a fight that he actually won.) If you can name a fight such as this then I will say you are right. But the only problem is Tyson was never in a fight before that he was actually pressured the entire time and then won. It never happened. So how can you even say that he could beat marciano or Frazier? It makes no sense. Both Frazier and Marciano have both been in fights were they were pressured. And they both were able to win such fights unlike Tyson. I honestly think that if Tyson fought in the 1970's then we never would of even heard of him.

[Samson3000]

What's hysterical about this argument is that the Maciano fans even bring conditioning into this, as if Marciano would make it past the one minute mark .

If you can name one fight in which Tyson was pressured for 10 plus rounds. (And it has to be a fight that he actually won.) If you can name a fight such as this then I will say you are right. But the only problem is Tyson was never in a fight before that he was actually pressured the entire time and then won. It never happened. So how can you even say that he could beat marciano or Frazier? It makes no sense. Both Frazier and Marciano have both been in fights were they were pressured. And they both were able to win such fights unlike Tyson. I honestly think that if Tyson fought in the 1970's then we never would of even heard of him.

Do you not see the gaping hole in your argument? This would be like someone saying Ricky Hatton would put pressure on Nigel Benn for an entire fight because he did it to everyone else he fought. Marciano fans need to come back down to earth and realize Tyson-Marciano would be as brutal as Benn-Hatton. Rocky Marciano is not even a heavyweight by today's standards. Putting guys up against guys who have no business being in that weight division is what would get guys seriously injured.

[benjamindallas554]

Do you not see the gaping hole in your argument? This would be like someone saying Ricky Hatton would put pressure on Nigel Benn for an entire fight because he did it to everyone else he fought. Marciano fans need to come back down to earth and realize Tyson-Marciano would be as brutal as Benn-Hatton. Rocky Marciano is not even a heavyweight by today's standards. Putting guys up against guys who have no business being in that weight division is what would get guys seriously injured.

I see your point and you do have a solid argument. I just disagree because I think Marciano had the right style to beat Tyson. I also think that if they would of fought on today's terms that Marciano would of hired a macky shilstone and added about 30lbs or so. But I'm not even going to get into that. We will just have to agree to disagree.