Pacquiao-Mosley done deal

[JonesJrMayweather]

To stop Shane would be an incredible feat and should not be downplayed if Manny Pac does it.

I disagree to an extent. If Pacquiao knocks him out, or has him out on his feet and the referee stops it, then that is an incredible feat. But if Nazim pulls Shane out, for me that is to be expected. Like I said before, you saw what Nazim said to Shane after the 10th in the Mayweather fight. It's like Game said, Pacquiao is a harder puncher than Mayweather, has just as much if not more speed and is also a volume puncher with incredible accuracy. If Mosley was close to being stopped by Floyd after being gassed after 3 rounds, how do you expect him to deal with a guy who throws 90 punches a round?

Exactly... PAC stopping shane at this point means absolutely nothing. Especially when his own people have said shane needs to retire (roach) and that shane is going to tire after a round (ariza)...

I'm expecting shane to be stopped inside of 8.

[Kev]

To stop Shane would be an incredible feat and should not be downplayed if Manny Pac does it.

I disagree to an extent. If Pacquiao knocks him out, or has him out on his feet and the referee stops it, then that is an incredible feat. But if Nazim pulls Shane out, for me that is to be expected. Like I said before, you saw what Nazim said to Shane after the 10th in the Mayweather fight. It's like Game said, Pacquiao is a harder puncher than Mayweather, has just as much if not more speed and is also a volume puncher with incredible accuracy. If Mosley was close to being stopped by Floyd after being gassed after 3 rounds, how do you expect him to deal with a guy who throws 90 punches a round?

Exactly... PAC stopping shane at this point means absolutely nothing. Especially when his own people have said shane needs to retire (roach) and that shane is going to tire after a round (ariza)...

I'm expecting shane to be stopped inside of 8.

If he stopped Shane that would still be a big deal. Shane has never been stopped in his entire career. You guys write fighters off soooooo quickly.

He's not a corpse now he lost to Floyd. Ok he's not in his prime but he's still going to be a tought challenge and has never lacked durability.

Hopkins, Johnson and Tarver are still winning fights in their 40's and Shane has always been in fantastic shape.

He ain't no Mayweather, we know that, but he didn't gas out against a much bigger man in Sergio Mora and was pushing the pace in the championship rounds, so it would be a big deal if Manny could stop him.

[CutMeMick]

For those who say this is a gimmie or just a stay busy or a money making fight...

Well come on let's keep it real so were Clottey and Margarito.

[Julius Rain]

For those who say this is a gimmie or just a stay busy or a money making fight...

Well come on let's keep it real so were Clottey and Margarito.

I actually agree with you Mick. I think there's really nothing else out there for pac but Mayweather. Same goes for Floyd. I dont think Timothy, Alexander, Berto, JMM (floyd already proved) or anybody else is anything but a gimmie or just stay busy or a money making fight.

The only real task would be above welterweight -> Sergio Martinez

[Gandalf]

For those who say this is a gimmie or just a stay busy or a money making fight...

Well come on let's keep it real so were Clottey and Margarito.

I actually agree with you Mick. I think there's really nothing else out there for pac but Mayweather. Same goes for Floyd. I dont think Timothy, Alexander, Berto, JMM (floyd already proved) or anybody else is anything but a gimmie or just stay busy or a money making fight.

The only real task would be above welterweight -> Sergio Martinez

How can anyone say that a potential Marquez fight at 140 is a "gimmie"? That is an outrageous statement considering that Marquez has had two fights with Manny, gone down 4 times and yet still outboxed him in the vast majority of the rounds. Also Bradley is young, fast, skilled and undefeated. Berto considerably less so, but still undefeated. And we are to believe that Clottey, Margarito and a slumped Mosley are the best challenges we can give Manny?

Everyone would like to see the Mayweather fight, but let's not kid ourselves that there aren't more viable options out there than what we are currently being spoonfed. Martinez at 154 would be great too, but at WW and below there are still good fights to be had.

[Julius Rain]

For those who say this is a gimmie or just a stay busy or a money making fight...

Well come on let's keep it real so were Clottey and Margarito.

I actually agree with you Mick. I think there's really nothing else out there for pac but Mayweather. Same goes for Floyd. I dont think Timothy, Alexander, Berto, JMM (floyd already proved) or anybody else is anything but a gimmie or just stay busy or a money making fight.

The only real task would be above welterweight -> Sergio Martinez

How can anyone say that a potential Marquez fight at 140 is a "gimmie"? That is an outrageous statement considering that Marquez has had two fights with Manny, gone down 4 times and yet still outboxed him in the vast majority of the rounds. Also Bradley is young, fast, skilled and undefeated. Berto considerably less so, but still undefeated. And we are to believe that Clottey, Margarito and a slumped Mosley are the best challenges we can give Manny?

Everyone would like to see the Mayweather fight, but let's not kid ourselves that there aren't more viable options out there than what we are currently being spoonfed. Martinez at 154 would be great too, but at WW and below there are still good fights to be had.

Miles your saying Marquez would be a tough fight for Pac at 140? Thats your opinion and I guess your entitled to it. Let JMM fight at 140 first before you truly delude yourself. I too have an opinion, I think pac beats JMM in a third fight and I know what you will say afterwards. JMM is old, past it, out of his weight class. Its the same song. I am not saying Mosley is a better fight, but at least Mosley isn't removed from his weight class. I don't think you can use that one on this fight.

As for the other 140 pounders, from what I've seen I think they are all a level below Pac and Floyd but there names do not carry the same weight as a Cotto, Margarito, Mosley. Pac is the biggest name in boxing, he will be pit against other big names. Timothy, Alexander, Berto and anyone else are just not there yet. But I think eventually pac will run out of big name fighters and will get to these guys if the Floyd fight continues to stall.

I stick to my opinion, the only real fight out there for Pac is Floyd, anything else in WW is a stay busy, money maker fight.

[Gandalf]

For those who say this is a gimmie or just a stay busy or a money making fight...

Well come on let's keep it real so were Clottey and Margarito.

I actually agree with you Mick. I think there's really nothing else out there for pac but Mayweather. Same goes for Floyd. I dont think Timothy, Alexander, Berto, JMM (floyd already proved) or anybody else is anything but a gimmie or just stay busy or a money making fight.

The only real task would be above welterweight -> Sergio Martinez

How can anyone say that a potential Marquez fight at 140 is a "gimmie"? That is an outrageous statement considering that Marquez has had two fights with Manny, gone down 4 times and yet still outboxed him in the vast majority of the rounds. Also Bradley is young, fast, skilled and undefeated. Berto considerably less so, but still undefeated. And we are to believe that Clottey, Margarito and a slumped Mosley are the best challenges we can give Manny?

Everyone would like to see the Mayweather fight, but let's not kid ourselves that there aren't more viable options out there than what we are currently being spoonfed. Martinez at 154 would be great too, but at WW and below there are still good fights to be had.

Miles your saying Marquez would be a tough fight for Pac at 140? Thats your opinion and I guess your entitled to it. Let JMM fight at 140 first before you truly delude yourself. I too have an opinion, I think pac beats JMM in a third fight and I know what you will say afterwards. JMM is old, past it, out of his weight class. Its the same song. I am not saying Mosley is a better fight, but at least Mosley isn't removed from his weight class. I don't think you can use that one on this fight.

As for the other 140 pounders, from what I've seen I think they are all a level below Pac and Floyd but there names do not carry the same weight as a Cotto, Margarito, Mosley. Pac is the biggest name in boxing, he will be pit against other big names. Timothy, Alexander, Berto and anyone else are just not there yet. But I think eventually pac will run out of big name fighters and will get to these guys if the Floyd fight continues to stall.

I stick to my opinion, the only real fight out there for Pac is Floyd, anything else in WW is a stay busy, money maker fight.

I think Marquez has a couple of fights in him max. It would be interesting to see him step up to 140 in his next fight, but there is no denying that Marquez is the one fighter above all others that has given Pac the most problems. Morales did it the one time, but Marquez has won the majority of the rounds twice in a row. Marquez deserves respect and more so considering most writers thought he won the last fight. We are all entitled to our opinions and I haven't even said that Marquez beats Pacquiao at 140, but it is most definitely a credible fight. The facts speak for themselves. These guys have history and Marquez has outboxed Pacquiao in both fights. The only doubting factor is the weight, but if Manny were to come down in weight and Marquez go up then that evens the playing field somewhat. Noone realistically expects Manny to boil down to 135 at this stage and it is ludicrious to even go there.

There is a trend in Pac's recent opponents and that is the fact that Arum owns them all. We are only getting Mosley/Pac because Mosley went rogue and against the wishes of Goldenboy who wanted the fight for Marquez. To suggest that Margarito deserved a shot at Pac is crazy talk. What has Mosley done recently to deserve a shot either? Marquez should have had his shot this time out. There was a demand from the fans who know the history and once again Arum and Pac have given a big middle finger to the expectations of the fans. Nobody is getting any fun from the current match up if it goes according to how many of us fear it will.

Of all the fighters at 140, I think Tim Bradley is the real deal. Sure, maybe he isn't quite known enough, but I think all the ingredients of a quality fighter are there. Tim Bradley would certainly be more deserving of a shot than Clottey was. Face it, we are being dicked around by Arum and Pac again and people keep on trying to justify bare faced crookery.

[InTheNeutralCorner]

To add some new life to this discussion, seeing as though it's still going at the top of the thread list.... -

What if Mosley puts up a turn back the clock showing where at least 9 rounds give Pac a real run for his money, with some really intelligent, focused fighting,,, would that actually give Pac some more credit for winning this fight?? (whether anyone see's Mosley capable of that or not)

If that were to happen I would be delighted. What I don't want above all is for Shane to shoot his load after four and be pulled out looking like Shrek after six. Mosley is far older than any of Pacs recent opponents, been more inactive, seems to get tired early and just hasn't been winning. The omen's are ominous. I really worry that we are going to be seeing a tired worn legend of the game, sat on his stool not responding to his corner. That would be horrible.

Even Margarito became repetitive after eight, nobody wants to see Pac beat up on Mosley. So, if Mosley can roll back the clock, I would be delighted. But what I really want to see is Pac fight someone younger, undamaged, fast and on a winning streak. All of the recent opponents have been damaged fighters. He could have fought Berto, but once again has chosen someone who lost considerably more rounds than he has won in the past 4 years. There are no unbeaten names on his resume.

Are you sure there are no unbeaten names on Manny's resume?
Jorge Solis, Emmanuel Lucero, Nedal Hussein, Seung-Kon Chae and Medgoen Singsurat.

[Gandalf]

To add some new life to this discussion, seeing as though it's still going at the top of the thread list.... -

What if Mosley puts up a turn back the clock showing where at least 9 rounds give Pac a real run for his money, with some really intelligent, focused fighting,,, would that actually give Pac some more credit for winning this fight?? (whether anyone see's Mosley capable of that or not)

If that were to happen I would be delighted. What I don't want above all is for Shane to shoot his load after four and be pulled out looking like Shrek after six. Mosley is far older than any of Pacs recent opponents, been more inactive, seems to get tired early and just hasn't been winning. The omen's are ominous. I really worry that we are going to be seeing a tired worn legend of the game, sat on his stool not responding to his corner. That would be horrible.

Even Margarito became repetitive after eight, nobody wants to see Pac beat up on Mosley. So, if Mosley can roll back the clock, I would be delighted. But what I really want to see is Pac fight someone younger, undamaged, fast and on a winning streak. All of the recent opponents have been damaged fighters. He could have fought Berto, but once again has chosen someone who lost considerably more rounds than he has won in the past 4 years. There are no unbeaten names on his resume.

Are you sure there are no unbeaten names on Manny's resume?
Jorge Solis, Emmanuel Lucero, Nedal Hussein, Seung-Kon Chae and Medgoen Singsurat.

Well, of course you can go back through the resume and find some, but certainly not in many years.

[bzkfn]

For those who say this is a gimmie or just a stay busy or a money making fight...

Well come on let's keep it real so were Clottey and Margarito.

I actually agree with you Mick. I think there's really nothing else out there for pac but Mayweather. Same goes for Floyd. I dont think Timothy, Alexander, Berto, JMM (floyd already proved) or anybody else is anything but a gimmie or just stay busy or a money making fight.

The only real task would be above welterweight -> Sergio Martinez

How can anyone say that a potential Marquez fight at 140 is a "gimmie"? That is an outrageous statement considering that Marquez has had two fights with Manny, gone down 4 times and yet still outboxed him in the vast majority of the rounds. Also Bradley is young, fast, skilled and undefeated. Berto considerably less so, but still undefeated. And we are to believe that Clottey, Margarito and a slumped Mosley are the best challenges we can give Manny?

Everyone would like to see the Mayweather fight, but let's not kid ourselves that there aren't more viable options out there than what we are currently being spoonfed. Martinez at 154 would be great too, but at WW and below there are still good fights to be had.

Miles your saying Marquez would be a tough fight for Pac at 140? Thats your opinion and I guess your entitled to it. Let JMM fight at 140 first before you truly delude yourself. I too have an opinion, I think pac beats JMM in a third fight and I know what you will say afterwards. JMM is old, past it, out of his weight class. Its the same song. I am not saying Mosley is a better fight, but at least Mosley isn't removed from his weight class. I don't think you can use that one on this fight.

As for the other 140 pounders, from what I've seen I think they are all a level below Pac and Floyd but there names do not carry the same weight as a Cotto, Margarito, Mosley. Pac is the biggest name in boxing, he will be pit against other big names. Timothy, Alexander, Berto and anyone else are just not there yet. But I think eventually pac will run out of big name fighters and will get to these guys if the Floyd fight continues to stall.

I stick to my opinion, the only real fight out there for Pac is Floyd, anything else in WW is a stay busy, money maker fight.

I think Marquez has a couple of fights in him max. It would be interesting to see him step up to 140 in his next fight, but there is no denying that Marquez is the one fighter above all others that has given Pac the most problems. Morales did it the one time, but Marquez has won the majority of the rounds twice in a row. Marquez deserves respect and more so considering most writers thought he won the last fight. We are all entitled to our opinions and I haven't even said that Marquez beats Pacquiao at 140, but it is most definitely a credible fight. The facts speak for themselves. These guys have history and Marquez has outboxed Pacquiao in both fights. The only doubting factor is the weight, but if Manny were to come down in weight and Marquez go up then that evens the playing field somewhat. Noone realistically expects Manny to boil down to 135 at this stage and it is ludicrious to even go there.

There is a trend in Pac's recent opponents and that is the fact that Arum owns them all. We are only getting Mosley/Pac because Mosley went rogue and against the wishes of Goldenboy who wanted the fight for Marquez. To suggest that Margarito deserved a shot at Pac is crazy talk. What has Mosley done recently to deserve a shot either? Marquez should have had his shot this time out. There was a demand from the fans who know the history and once again Arum and Pac have given a big middle finger to the expectations of the fans. Nobody is getting any fun from the current match up if it goes according to how many of us fear it will.

Of all the fighters at 140, I think Tim Bradley is the real deal. Sure, maybe he isn't quite known enough, but I think all the ingredients of a quality fighter are there. Tim Bradley would certainly be more deserving of a shot than Clottey was. Face it, we are being dicked around by Arum and Pac again and people keep on trying to justify bare faced crookery.

I could live with the Clottey fight to be honest. He is a real strong welterweight and I thought it was interesting to see how Pac dealt with a fighter who didn't budge at his punches. The Margarito fight was a joke though. Fighting for 154lb title at a catchweight while rewarding a cheater with a payday on the bggest stage was just all bullshit to me. Personally, outside of Mayweather, the fight I'd like to see Pac in the most is Marquez 3. It's like Miles said, nobody has presented Pac with more problems and even after Marquez 1st fight with Diaz some guys on HBO were saying he was better than Pacquiao. I think Marquez deserves that fight. I thought Pac won the 1st fight but I thought Marquez won the 2nd fight. For me they are 1-1 and a 3rd fight has to be made. If challenges are few and far between for Pacquiao right now, I'm confused to why fans don't want to see him set the record straight once and for all.

[Julius Rain]

For those who say this is a gimmie or just a stay busy or a money making fight...

Well come on let's keep it real so were Clottey and Margarito.

I actually agree with you Mick. I think there's really nothing else out there for pac but Mayweather. Same goes for Floyd. I dont think Timothy, Alexander, Berto, JMM (floyd already proved) or anybody else is anything but a gimmie or just stay busy or a money making fight.

The only real task would be above welterweight -> Sergio Martinez

How can anyone say that a potential Marquez fight at 140 is a "gimmie"? That is an outrageous statement considering that Marquez has had two fights with Manny, gone down 4 times and yet still outboxed him in the vast majority of the rounds. Also Bradley is young, fast, skilled and undefeated. Berto considerably less so, but still undefeated. And we are to believe that Clottey, Margarito and a slumped Mosley are the best challenges we can give Manny?

Everyone would like to see the Mayweather fight, but let's not kid ourselves that there aren't more viable options out there than what we are currently being spoonfed. Martinez at 154 would be great too, but at WW and below there are still good fights to be had.

Miles your saying Marquez would be a tough fight for Pac at 140? Thats your opinion and I guess your entitled to it. Let JMM fight at 140 first before you truly delude yourself. I too have an opinion, I think pac beats JMM in a third fight and I know what you will say afterwards. JMM is old, past it, out of his weight class. Its the same song. I am not saying Mosley is a better fight, but at least Mosley isn't removed from his weight class. I don't think you can use that one on this fight.

As for the other 140 pounders, from what I've seen I think they are all a level below Pac and Floyd but there names do not carry the same weight as a Cotto, Margarito, Mosley. Pac is the biggest name in boxing, he will be pit against other big names. Timothy, Alexander, Berto and anyone else are just not there yet. But I think eventually pac will run out of big name fighters and will get to these guys if the Floyd fight continues to stall.

I stick to my opinion, the only real fight out there for Pac is Floyd, anything else in WW is a stay busy, money maker fight.

I think Marquez has a couple of fights in him max. It would be interesting to see him step up to 140 in his next fight, but there is no denying that Marquez is the one fighter above all others that has given Pac the most problems. Morales did it the one time, but Marquez has won the majority of the rounds twice in a row. Marquez deserves respect and more so considering most writers thought he won the last fight. We are all entitled to our opinions and I haven't even said that Marquez beats Pacquiao at 140, but it is most definitely a credible fight. The facts speak for themselves. These guys have history and Marquez has outboxed Pacquiao in both fights. The only doubting factor is the weight, but if Manny were to come down in weight and Marquez go up then that evens the playing field somewhat. Noone realistically expects Manny to boil down to 135 at this stage and it is ludicrious to even go there.

There is a trend in Pac's recent opponents and that is the fact that Arum owns them all. We are only getting Mosley/Pac because Mosley went rogue and against the wishes of Goldenboy who wanted the fight for Marquez. To suggest that Margarito deserved a shot at Pac is crazy talk. What has Mosley done recently to deserve a shot either? Marquez should have had his shot this time out. There was a demand from the fans who know the history and once again Arum and Pac have given a big middle finger to the expectations of the fans. Nobody is getting any fun from the current match up if it goes according to how many of us fear it will.

Of all the fighters at 140, I think Tim Bradley is the real deal. Sure, maybe he isn't quite known enough, but I think all the ingredients of a quality fighter are there. Tim Bradley would certainly be more deserving of a shot than Clottey was. Face it, we are being dicked around by Arum and Pac again and people keep on trying to justify bare faced crookery.

You're right about Marquez being the guy who has trouble pac twice. There is no denying that. There is no denying the fact that JMM is going down more often in fights and is fighting a more aggressive fight. There is no denying the other fact that, the welterweight pacman is not the same featherweight JMM had fought. The other fact that you can not deny is pac have proven himself at welterweight while JMM has not.

Also Miles, you have such a big problem with pac having fights at catch weights. What did you think about the JMM/Floyd match up. Or the fact that you are suggesting pac to have a fight with JMM at well a catchweight 140? JMM is not a 140 fighter and pac is a 147 fighter which technically would be a catch weight for that match up, right?

I hope JMMs next fight is at 140 and not against the likes of Katsidis, Diaz who are guys suited for his style. 3 of his last 4 fights have been against those two and its been inside 2 years. While pac has gone up and dominated 6 fights since they last fought. You like to criticize who pac fights, well if you loook at their resume aside from floyd (who was a sound lost) on JMMs resume, pacs oppenent beats JMMs p4p or no matter how you look at it.

Diaz
Katsidis
Casamayor

Are those three wins better then

Margarito
Clottey
Cotto
Hatton
Dela Hoya

Not even close. I dont want take away how impressive JMM look going up and getting those wins, but you can not compare his wins over pacs wins. You want to call pacs oppenent old, wash up, drain, or any other excuse you can come up with. How about Casa who was 2 fights remove from a lost to Santa Cruz, a fight remove from struggling to katsidis who yes is JMMs last fight. Now why would JMM fight a guy who was already Ko'd by the guy who he tko'd Casa? Wait infact why would he rematch a guy who he already ko'd DIAz!!!!! In the last two years, JMM have only won fights against Diaz and Katsidis. In the last two years Pac have wins over Dela Hoya, Hatton, Cotto, Clottey, Margarito. Whos selection of oppenent in the past two years has look shitty now MIles?

You like criticizes pacs opponents or the fights he takes well take a look at other fighters. JMM is actually worst.

[JT Rock]

it comes with the territory of PFP#1

The matchmaking is designed to find the best known name, perceived threat and ring the most money out of it with measured to no risk.

Thats what happens when you reach the big time.

I dont think its an indictment on Pac, I bet he would fight Wlad Klitschko if he was allowed. I think Roach, Kontz and Arum control the boat like they should but probably a bit much and oppurtunistic.

Roach said Hell no to Yuri Foreman at 154 because he was to tall and rangy. A year later he is in the ring with Margarito weird!!! thats an example of the cherry pick I was referring to.

Foreman is faster and moves better, but Margarito is probably stronger and perceived tougher with a bigger name

[JT Rock]

I think Berto poses the biggest risk, he has helacious handspeed and a viscious meanstreak of late. He seems to be sitting down on his punches and like Pac seems to be punching thru people now instead of tagging them like he's hitting a speedbag.(if that makes sense)
Not to mention his uppercut is probably the best in the business and it comes at you like lightning

Sure he went life and death a few times against Estrada and Collazzo..
Estrada gave Mosely fits if I remember and no one and I mean no one looks good against Luis Collazzo.

[bzkfn]

For those who say this is a gimmie or just a stay busy or a money making fight...

Well come on let's keep it real so were Clottey and Margarito.

I actually agree with you Mick. I think there's really nothing else out there for pac but Mayweather. Same goes for Floyd. I dont think Timothy, Alexander, Berto, JMM (floyd already proved) or anybody else is anything but a gimmie or just stay busy or a money making fight.

The only real task would be above welterweight -> Sergio Martinez

How can anyone say that a potential Marquez fight at 140 is a "gimmie"? That is an outrageous statement considering that Marquez has had two fights with Manny, gone down 4 times and yet still outboxed him in the vast majority of the rounds. Also Bradley is young, fast, skilled and undefeated. Berto considerably less so, but still undefeated. And we are to believe that Clottey, Margarito and a slumped Mosley are the best challenges we can give Manny?

Everyone would like to see the Mayweather fight, but let's not kid ourselves that there aren't more viable options out there than what we are currently being spoonfed. Martinez at 154 would be great too, but at WW and below there are still good fights to be had.

Miles your saying Marquez would be a tough fight for Pac at 140? Thats your opinion and I guess your entitled to it. Let JMM fight at 140 first before you truly delude yourself. I too have an opinion, I think pac beats JMM in a third fight and I know what you will say afterwards. JMM is old, past it, out of his weight class. Its the same song. I am not saying Mosley is a better fight, but at least Mosley isn't removed from his weight class. I don't think you can use that one on this fight.

As for the other 140 pounders, from what I've seen I think they are all a level below Pac and Floyd but there names do not carry the same weight as a Cotto, Margarito, Mosley. Pac is the biggest name in boxing, he will be pit against other big names. Timothy, Alexander, Berto and anyone else are just not there yet. But I think eventually pac will run out of big name fighters and will get to these guys if the Floyd fight continues to stall.

I stick to my opinion, the only real fight out there for Pac is Floyd, anything else in WW is a stay busy, money maker fight.

I think Marquez has a couple of fights in him max. It would be interesting to see him step up to 140 in his next fight, but there is no denying that Marquez is the one fighter above all others that has given Pac the most problems. Morales did it the one time, but Marquez has won the majority of the rounds twice in a row. Marquez deserves respect and more so considering most writers thought he won the last fight. We are all entitled to our opinions and I haven't even said that Marquez beats Pacquiao at 140, but it is most definitely a credible fight. The facts speak for themselves. These guys have history and Marquez has outboxed Pacquiao in both fights. The only doubting factor is the weight, but if Manny were to come down in weight and Marquez go up then that evens the playing field somewhat. Noone realistically expects Manny to boil down to 135 at this stage and it is ludicrious to even go there.

There is a trend in Pac's recent opponents and that is the fact that Arum owns them all. We are only getting Mosley/Pac because Mosley went rogue and against the wishes of Goldenboy who wanted the fight for Marquez. To suggest that Margarito deserved a shot at Pac is crazy talk. What has Mosley done recently to deserve a shot either? Marquez should have had his shot this time out. There was a demand from the fans who know the history and once again Arum and Pac have given a big middle finger to the expectations of the fans. Nobody is getting any fun from the current match up if it goes according to how many of us fear it will.

Of all the fighters at 140, I think Tim Bradley is the real deal. Sure, maybe he isn't quite known enough, but I think all the ingredients of a quality fighter are there. Tim Bradley would certainly be more deserving of a shot than Clottey was. Face it, we are being dicked around by Arum and Pac again and people keep on trying to justify bare faced crookery.

You're right about Marquez being the guy who has trouble pac twice. There is no denying that. There is no denying the fact that JMM is going down more often in fights and is fighting a more aggressive fight. There is no denying the other fact that, the welterweight pacman is not the same featherweight JMM had fought. The other fact that you can not deny is pac have proven himself at welterweight while JMM has not.

Also Miles, you have such a big problem with pac having fights at catch weights. What did you think about the JMM/Floyd match up. Or the fact that you are suggesting pac to have a fight with JMM at well a catchweight 140? JMM is not a 140 fighter and pac is a 147 fighter which technically would be a catch weight for that match up, right?

I hope JMMs next fight is at 140 and not against the likes of Katsidis, Diaz who are guys suited for his style. 3 of his last 4 fights have been against those two and its been inside 2 years. While pac has gone up and dominated 6 fights since they last fought. You like to criticize who pac fights, well if you loook at their resume aside from floyd (who was a sound lost) on JMMs resume, pacs oppenent beats JMMs p4p or no matter how you look at it.

Diaz
Katsidis
Casamayor

Are those three wins better then

Margarito
Clottey
Cotto
Hatton
Dela Hoya

Not even close. I dont want take away how impressive JMM look going up and getting those wins, but you can not compare his wins over pacs wins. You want to call pacs oppenent old, wash up, drain, or any other excuse you can come up with. How about Casa who was 2 fights remove from a lost to Santa Cruz, a fight remove from struggling to katsidis who yes is JMMs last fight. Now why would JMM fight a guy who was already Ko'd by the guy who he tko'd Casa? Wait infact why would he rematch a guy who he already ko'd DIAz!!!!! In the last two years, JMM have only won fights against Diaz and Katsidis. In the last two years Pac have wins over Dela Hoya, Hatton, Cotto, Clottey, Margarito. Whos selection of oppenent in the past two years has look shitty now MIles?

You like criticizes pacs opponents or the fights he takes well take a look at other fighters. JMM is actually worst.

Julius, just out of interest, do you have an issue with Pac-Marquez at Welter? Because while I agree with Miles that a fight at 140lb would be more of an even fight, I accept that this is boxing, and when you hold the marbles, you get to make demands and personally, while people think JMM has no business above Lightweight, I think he does...if Pacquiao is the opponent. JMM has proved himself against Pacquiao twice and that for me is enough to warrant a 3rd fight.

[Pavlik]

It's amazing just a few years back Cotto, Clottey, Margarito and Mosely ruled the welters now since they have lost each before facing PAC now they're not ENOUGH for Manny.
I'll reverse the scenario PAC just like what Max Kellerman said got hit more and does not look like the PAC from 2 yrs ago, IF PAC LOSES IN THE FUTURE I WILL NOT CREDIT ANY OF THEM BECAUSE PAC IS NOT IN HIS PRIME ANYMORE.