Mares-Agbeko, What I Saw

[marbleheadmaui]

There is no doubt in my mind that had Agbeko retaliated to the degree warranted or roles reversed he would have been dq'd. It was just that biased and referee should seriously be investigated.

Agbeko should have taken a good low shot in the fourth round and waited no longer. THAT may well have changed both the referees and Mares' mindset about what was going on. At most it'd have cost him a point. And had Mares been given time? That would have given Agbeko time to excoriate the ref about how he was letting Agbeko be abused.

I just don't think its in some guys nature to need crutches and play along with the mind games and manuvering. I get what you say about the eye for an eye though. As such he was already flirting with unintentional headbutt and cut caused around 4th (?) and I really think ref was looking for excuse, he would not have been giving the pass. The last place a guys mind needs to be is on doing the job of the referee. I always flashback to the bs and whining Tyson was doing in regards to butts from Holyfield and how it led to and resulted in the bite, an extreme case yes and no Mares is not Tyson.

I hear what you are saying, but I guess I think it SHOULD be in a top fighter's mind not to let himself get abused in the ring. NOBODY but perhaps the ref, would have thought Agbeko was acting inappropriately in retaliating last night, would they?

Course, as always, it is easy to think clearly about stuff like this from the comfort of my office while I'm not getting drilled in the family jewels.

[marbleheadmaui]

I really like Abner Mares but he could of been DQ'ed for his antics last night, he must of landed atleast 30 low blows. And the worse thing is that a clear low blow was called a knockdown an absolute disgrace.

Abner Mares was winning the early rounds, but Joseph Agbeko was coming back and could of been on the verge of stealing the decision, had that ridiculous 11th round not happened.

1 Mares 10-8
2 Mares 10-9
3 Mares 10-9
4 Agbeko 10-9
5 Mares 10-9
6 Mares 10-9
7 Agbeko 10-9
8 Mares 10-9
9 Agbeko 10-9
10 Agbeko 10-9 it should of been 10-8
11 Mares 10-8 BS though
12 Mares 10-9

That's how i had it but in reality, Joseph Agbeko should of had two 10-8 rounds. In the 10th and 11th rounds for 100 percent.

One can make a pretty good argument that Mares could, and perhaps should have been penalized at least two points prior to the 11th round. Then that shot in the 11th could have made the ref call a DQ.

Especially if he would of been deducted points way before the 10th round, which in reality he should have. I mean some of those shots were to the leg it was ridiculous.

Given the number of times Mora chided Mares? I thought he could/should have begun deducting points pretty early, like rounds 4-5.

[Spicoli]

There is no doubt in my mind that had Agbeko retaliated to the degree warranted or roles reversed he would have been dq'd. It was just that biased and referee should seriously be investigated.

Agbeko should have taken a good low shot in the fourth round and waited no longer. THAT may well have changed both the referees and Mares' mindset about what was going on. At most it'd have cost him a point. And had Mares been given time? That would have given Agbeko time to excoriate the ref about how he was letting Agbeko be abused.

I just don't think its in some guys nature to need crutches and play along with the mind games and manuvering. I get what you say about the eye for an eye though. As such he was already flirting with unintentional headbutt and cut caused around 4th (?) and I really think ref was looking for excuse, he would not have been giving the pass. The last place a guys mind needs to be is on doing the job of the referee. I always flashback to the bs and whining Tyson was doing in regards to butts from Holyfield and how it led to and resulted in the bite, an extreme case yes and no Mares is not Tyson.

I hear what you are saying, but I guess I think it SHOULD be in a top fighter's mind not to let himself get abused in the ring., NOBODY but perhaps the ref would have thought Agbeko was acting inappropriately in retaliating last night, would they?

Course, as always, it is easy to think clearly about stuff like this from the comfort of my office while I'm not getting drilled in the family jewels.

Aside from the partisan crowd your right. But at the end of the night nobody but the ref has as big an influence in how any fight ends up on the cards.

[marbleheadmaui]

There is no doubt in my mind that had Agbeko retaliated to the degree warranted or roles reversed he would have been dq'd. It was just that biased and referee should seriously be investigated.

Agbeko should have taken a good low shot in the fourth round and waited no longer. THAT may well have changed both the referees and Mares' mindset about what was going on. At most it'd have cost him a point. And had Mares been given time? That would have given Agbeko time to excoriate the ref about how he was letting Agbeko be abused.

I just don't think its in some guys nature to need crutches and play along with the mind games and manuvering. I get what you say about the eye for an eye though. As such he was already flirting with unintentional headbutt and cut caused around 4th (?) and I really think ref was looking for excuse, he would not have been giving the pass. The last place a guys mind needs to be is on doing the job of the referee. I always flashback to the bs and whining Tyson was doing in regards to butts from Holyfield and how it led to and resulted in the bite, an extreme case yes and no Mares is not Tyson.

I hear what you are saying, but I guess I think it SHOULD be in a top fighter's mind not to let himself get abused in the ring., NOBODY but perhaps the ref would have thought Agbeko was acting inappropriately in retaliating last night, would they?

Course, as always, it is easy to think clearly about stuff like this from the comfort of my office while I'm not getting drilled in the family jewels.

Aside from the partisan crowd your right. But at the end of the night nobody but the ref has as big an influence in how any fight ends up on the cards.

Certainly true. I go back to what "protect yourself at all times" really must mean. It has to include protecting yourself when nobody else will.

[Spicoli]

There is no doubt in my mind that had Agbeko retaliated to the degree warranted or roles reversed he would have been dq'd. It was just that biased and referee should seriously be investigated.

Agbeko should have taken a good low shot in the fourth round and waited no longer. THAT may well have changed both the referees and Mares' mindset about what was going on. At most it'd have cost him a point. And had Mares been given time? That would have given Agbeko time to excoriate the ref about how he was letting Agbeko be abused.

I just don't think its in some guys nature to need crutches and play along with the mind games and manuvering. I get what you say about the eye for an eye though. As such he was already flirting with unintentional headbutt and cut caused around 4th (?) and I really think ref was looking for excuse, he would not have been giving the pass. The last place a guys mind needs to be is on doing the job of the referee. I always flashback to the bs and whining Tyson was doing in regards to butts from Holyfield and how it led to and resulted in the bite, an extreme case yes and no Mares is not Tyson.

I hear what you are saying, but I guess I think it SHOULD be in a top fighter's mind not to let himself get abused in the ring., NOBODY but perhaps the ref would have thought Agbeko was acting inappropriately in retaliating last night, would they?

Course, as always, it is easy to think clearly about stuff like this from the comfort of my office while I'm not getting drilled in the family jewels.

Aside from the partisan crowd your right. But at the end of the night nobody but the ref has as big an influence in how any fight ends up on the cards.

Certainly true. I go back to what "protect yourself at all times" really must mean. It has to include protecting yourself when nobody else will.

That may regain a guys macho point but who protects you from a clearly biased ref who is openly stacking the deck?

[marbleheadmaui]

There is no doubt in my mind that had Agbeko retaliated to the degree warranted or roles reversed he would have been dq'd. It was just that biased and referee should seriously be investigated.

Agbeko should have taken a good low shot in the fourth round and waited no longer. THAT may well have changed both the referees and Mares' mindset about what was going on. At most it'd have cost him a point. And had Mares been given time? That would have given Agbeko time to excoriate the ref about how he was letting Agbeko be abused.

I just don't think its in some guys nature to need crutches and play along with the mind games and manuvering. I get what you say about the eye for an eye though. As such he was already flirting with unintentional headbutt and cut caused around 4th (?) and I really think ref was looking for excuse, he would not have been giving the pass. The last place a guys mind needs to be is on doing the job of the referee. I always flashback to the bs and whining Tyson was doing in regards to butts from Holyfield and how it led to and resulted in the bite, an extreme case yes and no Mares is not Tyson.

I hear what you are saying, but I guess I think it SHOULD be in a top fighter's mind not to let himself get abused in the ring., NOBODY but perhaps the ref would have thought Agbeko was acting inappropriately in retaliating last night, would they?

Course, as always, it is easy to think clearly about stuff like this from the comfort of my office while I'm not getting drilled in the family jewels.

Aside from the partisan crowd your right. But at the end of the night nobody but the ref has as big an influence in how any fight ends up on the cards.

Certainly true. I go back to what "protect yourself at all times" really must mean. It has to include protecting yourself when nobody else will.

That may regain a guys macho point but who protects you from a clearly biased ref who is openly stacking the deck?

One does what one can. Agbeko should have gone low at Mares and used the time to lobby Mora publically. It may have dissuaded Mares and it couldn't have made things any worse with Mora could it?

Worse? How could it get any worse?

[Kev]

Dont know if its been raised here yet but apparently the refeeree involved was the same one who disqualified Petersosn for hitting low against Brandon Rios.

So his behaviour here seems even more suspect. There's a letters page on boxingtalk about it that's quite interesting.

[:::PSL:::]

I think Mora is a racist. That's my honest opinion.

[THE THIRD MAN]

When will we see a referee actually referee again? I like Abner Mares, he is a great fighter, but he is being misinformed by his handlers if he thinks he will get away with this all the time. I thought Vic was just being a sore loser last time, i have changed my mind after the Agbeko fight. Mares should've been DQ'd and until we get a referee who has the guts to just say enough is enough then these controveries will continue. I want to see rematches with either Vic or Agbeko. There is unfinished business here before any of the three take on Nonito!

[captainanddew]

I really like Abner Mares but he could of been DQ'ed for his antics last night, he must of landed atleast 30 low blows. And the worse thing is that a clear low blow was called a knockdown an absolute disgrace.

Abner Mares was winning the early rounds, but Joseph Agbeko was coming back and could of been on the verge of stealing the decision, had that ridiculous 11th round not happened.

1 Mares 10-8
2 Mares 10-9
3 Mares 10-9
4 Agbeko 10-9
5 Mares 10-9
6 Mares 10-9
7 Agbeko 10-9
8 Mares 10-9
9 Agbeko 10-9
10 Agbeko 10-9 it should of been 10-8
11 Mares 10-8 BS though
12 Mares 10-9

That's how i had it but in reality, Joseph Agbeko should of had two 10-8 rounds. In the 10th and 11th
rounds for 100 percent.

Point 1: shouldn't we all start with the premise that getting hit low that many times changes a fight and takes something out of a fighter?

Point 2-the judges sitting ringside had it 113-113, 115-111, 115-111 and round 11 changed the outcome of the fight.

Agbeko was winning the round. It should have been clearly called a low blow and a point taken away. Thus, Agbeko 10-8.

It was likely (haven't seen the cards) scored 10-8 Mares by all 3 judges because there was a shot that landed and was called by the ref a knockdown.

How many pts would change if the ref got the call right, penalized Mares a point, and then Agbeko wins the round 10-8 on the cards as it should have been? 4 pts.

Thus, the official scorecards would have been: 115-111 Agbeko, 113-113, 113-113. DRAW!!!!!

[Majesty]

Those saying what the decision could have been given the point deductions or not.

A bigger argument could be made that if the ref was penalizing Mares properly the fight wouldn't have even went to decision, he'd have been DQ'd by the 10th or 11th round at MOST.

[marbleheadmaui]

Those saying what the decision could have been given the point deductions or not.

A bigger argument could be made that if the ref was penalizing Mares properly the fight wouldn't have even went to decision, he'd have been DQ'd by the 10th or 11th round at MOST.

Yup. Of course once we start down that road one wonders if Mares even throws that punch had he been penalized earlier.

[johnsebastianmiran]

I watched the fight on tape after I got home and expected to see a really good fight. I was not sleepy so I watched it. As round one came to a close I was wondering where the real referee was hiding. All I could say was that I saw this man impersonating a boxing official before in The Rios-Peterson fight. They should have let his seeing eye dog call the shots. I have been a fan since I was five years old and for about two years before Vietnam got in the way of my having fun in those small tournaments I was involved in. Remember this saying, "You can't fight a war on two fronts." That referee, if he wasn't blind as a bat, he was incompetent at worst. He also left his actions open to accusations of corruption and his history shows in my eyes that it is possible. There was another ref that castigated even Felix Trinidad during a fight or two, Jay Naydee comes to mind and his redemption in my eyes never came even In the Tyzu-Judah fight. The low blows were bad enough but the indifference and the underlying hostility ruined the fight and left a bad taste in fan's mouths. I think the referee should start looking for another line of work. You miss one low blow or even four but I lost count after thirty and I was wondering if I could get a match worth that stupid ref. In closing I'd like to say in all fairness that this ref wasn't the only disgraceful piece of steaming hot shit on this list of misfits but to date this fool should remember what Abraham Lincoln once said,"You can fool some of the people all the time but yopu can't fool all the people all the time." He tried it on HBO of all places.