Addressing the PED problem

[Beanflicker]

It was recently estimated by VADA that roughly 375 UFC fighters could be random blood and urine tested twice each year, with annual costs of somewhere between $1 to 1.5 million dollars.

Max Boxing - News - Azad Championship Report - Floyd Mayweather and the new wave of drug testing in boxing

Test the top-rated thousand boxers a dozen times a year and it's less than twenty million a year. Pay for it by billing each individual promotion on a sliding scale depending on how much the promotion makes in revenue (obviously Pac Marquez 4 pays a huge slice compared to some non-TV event that features some of the top thousand boxers) and it would work out as a really small promotional expense.

Who's going to agree to cough up millions like that?

Also, what's to stop a fighter from simply refusing to take random drug tests?

[TysonBomb]

As long as the drugs being used are undetectable, nothing more can be done

Testing is always a step behind ... its an arms race and testing is losing badly and it seems that nothing will change

[Kirkland Laing]

It was recently estimated by VADA that roughly 375 UFC fighters could be random blood and urine tested twice each year, with annual costs of somewhere between $1 to 1.5 million dollars.

Max Boxing - News - Azad Championship Report - Floyd Mayweather and the new wave of drug testing in boxing

Test the top-rated thousand boxers a dozen times a year and it's less than twenty million a year. Pay for it by billing each individual promotion on a sliding scale depending on how much the promotion makes in revenue (obviously Pac Marquez 4 pays a huge slice compared to some non-TV event that features some of the top thousand boxers) and it would work out as a really small promotional expense.

Who's going to agree to cough up millions like that?

Also, what's to stop a fighter from simply refusing to take random drug tests?

The promotion last weekend grossed well over a hundred million dollars. The US boxing industry grosses billions of dollars a year, never mind the global take. Let's say that the US boxing industry only grosses two billion dollars a year and decides to fund testing for the top thousand boxers. Firstly, testing on that scale would probably significantly reduce the twenty million cost but let's stay at twenty. That's one percent of the gross, and in reality would be much less than one percent.

If a fighter refuses testing treat him the same way any other athlete who refuses testing is treated.

[Julius Rain]

Can we just continue watching boxing and agree peds in boxing is a myth?

[TitoFan]

Let's start with the premise that most people believe PEDs in boxing are a serious problem.
Having established that it is a serious problem, the next step is to identify viable solutions.

Cost, when weighed against the potential health and life risks that PEDs represent in the ring, should not be an obstacle toward providing a solution. More than adequate explanations have been provided as to how the financials would easily be worked out.

What would be the next excuse to delay doing something?

[AdamGB]

Can we just continue watching boxing and agree peds in boxing is a myth?

Everything from baseball to cycling is rife with it, but you think it's anything but rife in an already corrupt sport were under performing means getting punched in the face 100s of times, concussed, brain damaged or killed?

[Julius Rain]

Can we just continue watching boxing and agree peds in boxing is a myth?

Everything from baseball to cycling is rife with it, but you think it's anything but rife in an already corrupt sport were under performing means getting punched in the face 100s of times, concussed, brain damaged or killed?

I understand your point but we can't keep going around accusing fighters every time they have a great performance or look different physically. I'm all for better state commission drug testing but until then I rather give fighrers the benefit of the doubt.

[Beanflicker]

The promotion last weekend grossed well over a hundred million dollars. The US boxing industry grosses billions of dollars a year, never mind the global take. Let's say that the US boxing industry only grosses two billion dollars a year and decides to fund testing for the top thousand boxers. Firstly, testing on that scale would probably significantly reduce the twenty million cost but let's stay at twenty. That's one percent of the gross, and in reality would be much less than one percent.

If a fighter refuses testing treat him the same way any other athlete who refuses testing is treated.

Well first off we're talking GROSS revenue, which, after expenses such as taxes, boxer purses, promotional costs, production costs, lawyer costs, insurance costs, employee payroll costs, ect ect, we're looking at well under that 2 billion estimate left for other expenses.

Secondly, it's going to cost a hell of a lot more than 20 mil to impliment random drug testing on 1000 boxers. You're talking the cost of the test, cost of analyzing the test, paying for scientists and other qualified personal to administer the tests, lab costs, material costs, ect ect. With random drug tests, you'd have to test a boxer at least 6 times a year for it to mean anything, so you're looking at 6000 tests per year. Keep in mind not every boxer lives in a major city like Las Vegas or New York, so you're also paying for travel expenses to fly these drug testers around the world to visit these boxers 6 times a year to administer these tests. We're talking about a hell of a lot of travel $$$. Obviously I don't have the numbers, but to me 20 million is a completely unrealistic number to tackle this kind of task.

So lets say after all the expenses, you have 300 million left. I'm not sure of the numbers, but I'll be generous and say that the drug testing you're talking about is going to swallow up at least half of that. So how do we get these guys to agree to give up that extra 50% of their profit margin? Essentially, you're asking them to give up that much money to ensure their fighters don't perform as well and have shorter careers/less fights.

And then you have the issue that the promoter is paying the drug testers directly, so it opens the doors for accusations of corruption and bribes, and the public doesn't fully trust the drug testing after all that. And then you have to also deal with the fact that these extensive drug tests can be cheated, so after all this messing around and spending, you still don't have a gaurentee of a clean sport. And then you have guys who just get a medical exemption to inject testosterone, so your expensive testing doesn't even apply to them.

It just seems unrealistic to me.

[IamInuit]

It was recently estimated by VADA that roughly 375 UFC fighters could be random blood and urine tested twice each year, with annual costs of somewhere between $1 to 1.5 million dollars.

Max Boxing - News - Azad Championship Report - Floyd Mayweather and the new wave of drug testing in boxing

Test the top-rated thousand boxers a dozen times a year and it's less than twenty million a year. Pay for it by billing each individual promotion on a sliding scale depending on how much the promotion makes in revenue (obviously Pac Marquez 4 pays a huge slice compared to some non-TV event that features some of the top thousand boxers) and it would work out as a really small promotional expense.

Who's going to agree to cough up millions like that?

Also, what's to stop a fighter from simply refusing to take random drug tests?

Who pays for all the amateur testing that goes on all year long?
You make it a rule. Start at the championship level.

[Rantcatrat]

We need tougher deterrents. For example, the punishment for failing drug tests needs to be more severe. Instead of six months or no punishment (Peterson), there needs to be, for example, a 1.5 year minimum suspension for the first offense and 3 years for next offense. If the fighter is caught prior to a fight, and the promoter elects to go through with the fight, a large percentage of the fighter's purse needs to be forfeited, say 65% or something.

I don't think its fair to throw the fighter under the bus when imo many of the promoters know full well whats going on and no doubt also the governing leeches. In addition these conditioning coaches that have fighters take the B12 shot in the ass for certain periods of time. It may sound naive but based on the intelligent quotient of some of these fighters, I'd be willing to bet many do not even know whats being injected.

Promoters lose $ too if the fighter is on the sidelines.

[IamInuit]

Can we just continue watching boxing and agree peds in boxing is a myth?

Everything from baseball to cycling is rife with it, but you think it's anything but rife in an already corrupt sport were under performing means getting punched in the face 100s of times, concussed, brain damaged or killed?

I understand your point but we can't keep going around accusing fighters every time they have a great performance or look different physically. I'm all for better state commission drug testing but until then I rather give fighrers the benefit of the doubt.

Yes that gets me a bit also. Manny had not even woke up yet and allegations started. Never mind the fact that Marquez only weighed 143 or 1 pound more the the last go, was heavy into weight training and landed a punch that would have ko'd half the planet.

[IamInuit]

We need tougher deterrents. For example, the punishment for failing drug tests needs to be more severe. Instead of six months or no punishment (Peterson), there needs to be, for example, a 1.5 year minimum suspension for the first offense and 3 years for next offense. If the fighter is caught prior to a fight, and the promoter elects to go through with the fight, a large percentage of the fighter's purse needs to be forfeited, say 65% or something.

I don't think its fair to throw the fighter under the bus when imo many of the promoters know full well whats going on and no doubt also the governing leeches. In addition these conditioning coaches that have fighters take the B12 shot in the ass for certain periods of time. It may sound naive but based on the intelligent quotient of some of these fighters, I'd be willing to bet many do not even know whats being injected.

Promoters lose $ too if the fighter is on the sidelines.

Yeah but they weigh the odds of getting caught and know dam well that the chances are slim with scheduled testing.

[Beanflicker]

Who pays for all the amateur testing that goes on all year long?
You make it a rule. Start at the championship level.

What kind of extra testing are we talking about?

[IamInuit]

Who pays for all the amateur testing that goes on all year long?
You make it a rule. Start at the championship level.

What kind of extra testing are we talking about?

Random for all title fights. The knock on the door at 2 a.m. on a Sunday kind of testing. If boxing really wants to address the issue then some people are going to have to be inconvenienced. These pre/post fight tests are not going to catch anyone unless they have an IQ of 30 and it takes 31 to bark.

[Beanflicker]

Who pays for all the amateur testing that goes on all year long?
You make it a rule. Start at the championship level.

What kind of extra testing are we talking about?

Random for all title fights. The knock on the door at 2 a.m. on a Sunday kind of testing. If boxing really wants to address the issue then some people are going to have to be inconvenienced. These pre/post fight tests are not going to catch anyone unless they have an IQ of 30 and it takes 31 to bark.

The trouble is, athletes have been cheating random drug testing for decades.

What happens is they get an athlete to sign a declaration that states where they can be found during a certain period of time, like "during July, through the hours of 10am-4pm, I can be found at my home at 123 Fake Street in Brooklyn". Shit happens in life though, and an instance might occur where you won't be at the place you said you'd be. Maybe you have to make an unexpected trip to go see a sick relative. So they stipulated that you can miss a random drug test, you just have to go before the commission and present the reason why you weren't where you said you'd be, which is easy enough to do. Then they get you to sign another declaration for a time period several months later.

So an athlete can give an address where he knows he won't be, use PEDs, miss the test, go before a commision and say "sorry that day I had to go visit my uncle in Philly who was sick", sign a declaration for 2 months later, cycle off, and piss clean.

They can't just do it at any time. Then you have guys saying "hey WTF, they woke me up at 2am on a Sunday morning, disturbing my essential rest time, and they tested my opponent at 7pm without disturbing him."