Thatchers Dead

[Howlin Mad Missy]

So its not true that the coal industry was dying a slow and painful death long befiore Thatcher came along? Its not true that it was costing a shit load of money to help it limp along?

All Ive heard/read so far is Thatcher fucked things up for me/us/insert place name here. Without any real explanation as to why it was all her fault.

Our coal industry was not as competitive compared to the german because there's was subsidised.
Her first attack on the tu's miners failed so she set about baiting them in to a second round. She began stockpiling of coal so when a strike took place it would have less an effect for longer. Banned secondary action so workers in other industries couldnot strike to show support. sequestration of union money meant miners families took to collecting on the streets to survive. She basically starved them back to work. Evil bitch, ruined the sense of community turned families against each other - 'no such thing as society'.

She sold off industries back to the people who already owned it which in turn was supposed to make it more competitive....anyone see their bills go down.
She turned this country from manufacturing into a service country where we have to import everything and can't manage on our own. Economists are now saying we should try to build up our manufacturing base - really? After we sold everything and closed the country down.

Allowing people to buy council homes was fine - having no building programme to replace them, dumb.

She supported Pinochet and depending on your source killed up to 3000, tortured 30,000
Refused sanctions against Aparthied in S.Africa
Allowed use of US bases/UK airspace to bomb Libya
Poll Tax
Shoot to kill in N.Ireland

I take it you know nothing about politics?

Oh no I can quote stuff from the internet just fine.

Whilst the rest of us lived through it, watched the news, read the papers, saw the effects first hand, had two generations that worked down the pits, took politics at college and university, but you're proved my point.

We've answered your question and you're trying to twist the argument in to something else.

I havent twisted anything? 2 generations? Surely at some point someone should have had the brains to get out of it? Maybe go to college and do politics?

They did, good money in it. And why are you personally having a go at me you tool? You asked about what thatcher did to make it her fault (even though people had told you) and now you're having a personal dig at me.

Oh yeah, you called her a cunt and Master said she screwed the minors, my bad

You serious? You dropped the 'you dont know boxing politics' line on me and now Im a tool for giving you a dig back?

Heres the thing, and the thing that annoys me about all this. For all your living it, sleeping it, breathing it (mind the fumes) and your politics GCSE (I apologise in advance for this), all Ive got from you over the last 2 days here and elsewhere is hatred for someone who made as far as you're concerned shit decisions on the countries behalf. So much so that its funny and acceptable that people who if you have a look are probably as, if not more politically retarded than I am get pissed in streets they dont live in and throw petrol bombs at police. All in the name of that woman that closed down our....their....someones mines.

Thats why I asked the question. Im not convinced of the answer either. What investment was going to make an already sinking ship float again given the competition? And wasnt it already subsidised? Werent 'we' paying others to use our coal?

you don't actually have to have studied to take notice of the world around you, therefore in your own words politically retarded (so I was correct and you got pissy about nothing), so me listing what she was responsible for won't make any difference if you never took notice first time round.

I don't see you actually attempting any sort of critique of her policies with me or Miles or Master or Kirkland or Di - so you must correct when you admit you know nothing but feel the need to pick a fight anyway.Thatcher would be proud of your distraction tactics

Packing yourself with the hurd wont wash with me young Miss. You listing what she is responsible for gave nothing more than Ive read umpteen times over the last few days. Would it make you feel any better if I elaborated on the points Ive tentatively made and asked for a response on? Would it make you feel better if I said she sold off dying services and let wounded industries die? I doubt it.

I'd rather be politically reatarded to be honest. The one thing worse than knowing nothing. Pretending you know something.

no point really as you would be incorrect.

You can try and bait me if you like but I've always been politically active, I even stood for council election so quite willing to put my money where my mouth. Quite nice to be able to say you believe in something rather than one of the shrugging couldn't give a toss sheeple.

[Howlin Mad Missy]

and if you dislike my tone on facebook you're more than welcome to not read it - like I said, you'd be doing her proud.

[Memphis]

So its not true that the coal industry was dying a slow and painful death long befiore Thatcher came along? Its not true that it was costing a shit load of money to help it limp along?

All Ive heard/read so far is Thatcher fucked things up for me/us/insert place name here. Without any real explanation as to why it was all her fault.

Our coal industry was not as competitive compared to the german because there's was subsidised.
Her first attack on the tu's miners failed so she set about baiting them in to a second round. She began stockpiling of coal so when a strike took place it would have less an effect for longer. Banned secondary action so workers in other industries couldnot strike to show support. sequestration of union money meant miners families took to collecting on the streets to survive. She basically starved them back to work. Evil bitch, ruined the sense of community turned families against each other - 'no such thing as society'.

She sold off industries back to the people who already owned it which in turn was supposed to make it more competitive....anyone see their bills go down.
She turned this country from manufacturing into a service country where we have to import everything and can't manage on our own. Economists are now saying we should try to build up our manufacturing base - really? After we sold everything and closed the country down.

Allowing people to buy council homes was fine - having no building programme to replace them, dumb.

She supported Pinochet and depending on your source killed up to 3000, tortured 30,000
Refused sanctions against Aparthied in S.Africa
Allowed use of US bases/UK airspace to bomb Libya
Poll Tax
Shoot to kill in N.Ireland

I take it you know nothing about politics?

Oh no I can quote stuff from the internet just fine.

Whilst the rest of us lived through it, watched the news, read the papers, saw the effects first hand, had two generations that worked down the pits, took politics at college and university, but you're proved my point.

We've answered your question and you're trying to twist the argument in to something else.

I havent twisted anything? 2 generations? Surely at some point someone should have had the brains to get out of it? Maybe go to college and do politics?

They did, good money in it. And why are you personally having a go at me you tool? You asked about what thatcher did to make it her fault (even though people had told you) and now you're having a personal dig at me.

Oh yeah, you called her a cunt and Master said she screwed the minors, my bad

You serious? You dropped the 'you dont know boxing politics' line on me and now Im a tool for giving you a dig back?

Heres the thing, and the thing that annoys me about all this. For all your living it, sleeping it, breathing it (mind the fumes) and your politics GCSE (I apologise in advance for this), all Ive got from you over the last 2 days here and elsewhere is hatred for someone who made as far as you're concerned shit decisions on the countries behalf. So much so that its funny and acceptable that people who if you have a look are probably as, if not more politically retarded than I am get pissed in streets they dont live in and throw petrol bombs at police. All in the name of that woman that closed down our....their....someones mines.

Thats why I asked the question. Im not convinced of the answer either. What investment was going to make an already sinking ship float again given the competition? And wasnt it already subsidised? Werent 'we' paying others to use our coal?

you don't actually have to have studied to take notice of the world around you, therefore in your own words politically retarded (so I was correct and you got pissy about nothing), so me listing what she was responsible for won't make any difference if you never took notice first time round.

I don't see you actually attempting any sort of critique of her policies with me or Miles or Master or Kirkland or Di - so you must correct when you admit you know nothing but feel the need to pick a fight anyway.Thatcher would be proud of your distraction tactics

Packing yourself with the hurd wont wash with me young Miss. You listing what she is responsible for gave nothing more than Ive read umpteen times over the last few days. Would it make you feel any better if I elaborated on the points Ive tentatively made and asked for a response on? Would it make you feel better if I said she sold off dying services and let wounded industries die? I doubt it.

I'd rather be politically reatarded to be honest. The one thing worse than knowing nothing. Pretending you know something.

no point really as you would be incorrect.

You can try and bait me if you like but I've always been politically active, I even stood for council election so quite willing to put my money where my mouth. Quite nice to be able to say you believe in something rather than one of the shrugging couldn't give a toss sheeple.

Thats it in a nutshell for me to be honest. You politically enlightened types are all the same.

Couldnt give a toss sheeple? Are you talking about me or the masses that sit on their arses complaining that Maggie ruined their lives by shutting down't pit?

Im sure you would have waved a magic wand and made everything OK, well done. Im not trying to bait you, you do that yourself, Im just saying, actually not saying it, just suggesting it and you're getting menstrual about it.

[Gandalf]

Missy has made good points in this thread so I don't see why you are on her case, Memphis. Your empty point about Thatcher and privatisation makes NO sense either. It means you pay a lot more no matter what utility you are talking about and they were all privatised. A man can justify paying higher taxes to equal the playing field somewhat, but a man cannot justify paying higher bills to give shareholder satisfaction. It is nonsense and only an ideologue could rationalise it.

[Memphis]

Missy has made good points in this thread so I don't see why you are on her case, Memphis. Your empty point about Thatcher and privatisation makes NO sense either. It means you pay a lot more no matter what utility you are talking about and they were all privatised. A man can justify paying higher taxes to equal the playing field somewhat, but a man cannot justify paying higher bills to give shareholder satisfaction. It is nonsense and only an ideologue could rationalise it.

Who's on anyones case? All Ive said is Im sick of all the scripted Thatcher hate venom being spat by every Tom Dick and Harry using it as some sort of buffer before slagging off someone who's just snuffed it, even moreso the fuckwits who dont even bother to do that, just get pissed on street corners they dont live on and throw petrol bombs at police?

I asked for something more than 'she fucked the minors' or 'she's a cunt'. I asked the questions, got a response, asked some more, got no response. Par for the course from the politically enlightened I'd imagine?

[Gandalf]

When you have done no good in your life expect nothing less. Selling a nation on an absurd Friedman basis is less than virtuous.

Memphis, you have been clearly on Missy's case whence that sprawling mess of replies and with you making no decent arguments in response. It had to be pointed out. Clearly a parent.

[Memphis]

When you have done no good in your life expect nothing less. Selling a nation on an absurd Friedman basis is less than virtuous.

Memphis, you have been clearly on Missy's case whence that sprawling mess of replies and with you making no decent arguments in response. It had to be pointed out. Clearly a parent.

Ok maybe you can pick up the mantel? The arguement was that our mines were shit because they werent subsidised. They were though werent they, several attempts in fact? Discuss. Also what investment was going to turn the ship around.

You're right, I am a parent, which means I can deal with these spats of pentulance with a dash of humour and nonchalance.

It would be quite easy to reel off some pro Thatcher rhetoric cut and shut from various sources wouldnt it? Im on neither side so I'll stick to asking my own questions which I think relevant. Whether someone answers them or not is up to them.

[Gandalf]

When you have done no good in your life expect nothing less. Selling a nation on an absurd Friedman basis is less than virtuous.

Memphis, you have been clearly on Missy's case whence that sprawling mess of replies and with you making no decent arguments in response. It had to be pointed out. Clearly a parent.

Ok maybe you can pick up the mantel? The arguement was that our mines were shit because they werent subsidised. They were though werent they, several attempts in fact? Discuss. Also what investment was going to turn the ship around.

You're right, I am a parent, which means I can deal with these spats of pentulance with a dash of humour and nonchalance.

It would be quite easy to reel off some pro Thatcher rhetoric cut and shut from various sources wouldnt it? Im on neither side so I'll stick to asking my own questions which I think relevant. Whether someone answers them or not is up to them.

Mining was just one aspect. All the arguments have been inputted. You have simply failed to compute any of them and that is because you are ignorant.

Being a parent also means that you are a basic human being without the means to detach and avoid obvious mistakes in life. Most parents have this issue. You don't see many people like me with 5 children.

If I saw a train wreck I would never give birth on railway lines. That is Britain today. You are asking to be cut into pieces. All those people of the 80's, their penalty was what their children inherited. The same will be said 2 generations from now.

Maybe you could buy your children some tutors as you are a failure and your schools are dying. You deserve it, Maggies boy.

[Howlin Mad Missy]

When you have done no good in your life expect nothing less. Selling a nation on an absurd Friedman basis is less than virtuous.

Memphis, you have been clearly on Missy's case whence that sprawling mess of replies and with you making no decent arguments in response. It had to be pointed out. Clearly a parent.

Ok maybe you can pick up the mantel? The arguement was that our mines were shit because they werent subsidised. They were though werent they, several attempts in fact? Discuss. Also what investment was going to turn the ship around.

You're right, I am a parent, which means I can deal with these spats of pentulance with a dash of humour and nonchalance.

It would be quite easy to reel off some pro Thatcher rhetoric cut and shut from various sources wouldnt it? Im on neither side so I'll stick to asking my own questions which I think relevant. Whether someone answers them or not is up to them.

we've answered them, you've ignored to respond to any political points that have been made, so there's no point in discussing it.

You're claiming that myself and others are merely repeating what we've seen elsewhere when that is clearly not the case, when like I stated those of who were around at the time, watched the news, read the papers, got involved in issues and yes actually studied politics which again you throw back at me as if I should be ashamed of it