Lets end the Mike Tyson debate

[IamInuit]

Gene Tunney defended his heavyweight title 2 times, the rematch vs Dempsey and a fight vs Tom Heeney.

Max Baer fought Joe Louis, and no way no how does Tyson beat Louis. Joe was too powerful and too precise with his punches.

But that was a very long list so good on you for posting that

Yeah I know he did but he never really went on a run. I also know that Baer fought Louis. I was going at first in the order that fighters became belt holders or recognized as such so I mixed in two angles or I would have went over the character limit. I don't think its far fetched to suggest that Tyson beats Louis. Joe had a shaky chin and Mike would not have to look for him. Its not like Louis would be using the shoot and run tactic. The point was to show that Tyson love him or hate him deserves to be in the conversation when talking about the greatest heavyweights of all time.

I don't think Joe's chin was shaky so much as he could get knocked off balance every so often...I mean 72 total fights and only 2 stoppage losses, one coming when he was really long in the tooth vs one of the greatest pound for pound punchers in the history of the game....come on now.

Mike Tyson IS great, I never denied it...I just have a tough time fitting him securely in the top 10, but he's certainly in the neighborhood.

So yes....about Tyson vs Bowe?

Bowe may have beaten him but the reverse is also the case. Shame they had a blood oath not to fight each other. I think Tua and Ike would have also been interesting fights with Mike.

[Mr140]

Holyfeild had one of the greatest resumes of any fighter i have ever seen no fighter has gone for 175 to heavyweight and been consider top ten but Holyfeild. No way Tyson can beat Holyfeild unless he has a heart attack in the ring which could happen. He was a better boxer then Tyson and had a better chin, he also would smother Tyson inside game and if he had to get dirty Holyfeild makes Hopkins blush. Tyson is great i give him top ten but unlike the others he is kinda like a what if, Holyfield, Lennox, and Ali showed that they could win vs guys that are in the top ten.

[El Kabong]

Holyfeild had a one of the greatest resume of any fighter i have ever seen no fighter has gone for 175 to heavyweight and been consider top ten but Holyfeild. No way Tyson can beat Holyfeild unless he has a heart attack in the ring which could happen. He was a better boxer then Tyson and had a better chin, he also would smother Tyson inside game and if he had to get dirty Holyfeild make Hopkins blush. Tyson great i give him top ten but unlike the others he kinda like what if, Holyfield, Lennox, and Ali showed that they could win vs guys that are in the top ten.

To which everyone will mention Larry Holmes who Tyson beat the dog crap out of is a Top 10 All-Time Great Heavyweight.

[Mr140]

Even though Larry was coming off losses and a 2 year lay off i give Tyson the win but Holyfeild and Lennox had more and they kicked Tyson ass as for Ali well his resume speaks for its self.

[greynotsoold]

There was a point where a Tyson fight and a Bowe fight were scheduled for the same weekend in Vegas- maybe Tyson vs Byrd, and a Bowe/Holyfield fight, and I think the Tyson fight was rescheduled- and my friend was in town that weekend. He watched Tyson work out and Bowe workout. He said that Tyson was a whole level above bowe in terms of speed and power. For what that is worth.
I think Louis beats Tyson just about every time. There is, of course, the chance that Tyson comes out and blitzes Louis. But I don't think that is likely because Louis didn't start slow so much as he took his time. Come out, make him fight, and he'd go right with you. I think he would time Tyson coming in with those punches he threw, and he is the most devastating puncher ever. And if louis started landing the jab, then Tyson is in for a one way beating for as long as he could take it.
But I think Tyson beats Ali, especially the young Ali. We'll get into that when the protests come.

[nuggetdotcom]

There have been two all time great heavyweights since the war, Joe Louis and Cassius Clay. Unfortunately Rocky Marciano does not deserve to join them because he was never tested against serious opposition (most of his opponents were over 40 years old), bit like Joe Calzaghe but that's for another thread.
The best that Mike Tyson can hope for, if we exclude the cheating and fouling in the ring, together with even worse behaviour outside, is that he is compared favourably to Joe Frazier, a fighter of similar style, an Olympic Champion but still not quite an all time great.
The worst that we can remember about Mike Tyson is that a generation of dangerous dogs were named after him by phsycopathic nutters who beleived the 80's hype (some even named their kids after him!).
So lets get it in perspective, Joe Frazier acheived far more in his career than Mike Tyson, who has been humiliated many times since Buster Douglas sussed him out.

[Master]

I think Tyson beats Joe Louis but Joe was the better champion because he showed consistency and a will to win when the odds were against him.

[ray corso]

beanflicker or anyone else; Someone please enlighten me on the "new sciences" in sports and the more modern techniques in training that enables Tyson to beat any heavy before the 1960's (love to hear this)

Please elaborate on the "training sciense "stuff"" HA!!!! Can't wait to learn what Mike ate at the training table in the Catskills!!! Ray.

[IamInuit]

There have been two all time great heavyweights since the war, Joe Louis and Cassius Clay. Unfortunately Rocky Marciano does not deserve to join them because he was never tested against serious opposition (most of his opponents were over 40 years old), bit like Joe Calzaghe but that's for another thread.
The best that Mike Tyson can hope for, if we exclude the cheating and fouling in the ring, together with even worse behaviour outside, is that he is compared favourably to Joe Frazier, a fighter of similar style, an Olympic Champion but still not quite an all time great.
The worst that we can remember about Mike Tyson is that a generation of dangerous dogs were named after him by phsycopathic nutters who beleived the 80's hype (some even named their kids after him!).
So lets get it in perspective, Joe Frazier acheived far more in his career than Mike Tyson, who has been humiliated many times since Buster Douglas sussed him out.

You cant simply narrow the scope and then broaden it depending on who the person is. The suggestion that there have only been two great heavyweights since WW2 is ridiculous and who cares whether some half wit punk names his pitbull after him or that Tyson was a dickhead? Guys like Liston, Ketchel, Benny Leonard, Walker and yes even Robinson to name but a few make Tyson look like a cub scout. And Joe Frazier and him really fought nothing alike at all unless you consider a hook conjoining their styles. A prime Mike Tyson would have been at the top of the pile in any era including Ali's. What he did or did not do outside the ring or how many people name their budgies after him is not a qualifier for his standing historically as a fighter.