Nelson Mandela has died

[El Kabong]

There's no such things as saints and as they say history is written by the winners, so there's no doubt that the negatives will be downplayed and the positives will be held up for all to see.

Sometimes the "positives" aren't so positive and the "negatives" are made up/imagined and vice versa. The War Between The States is a PERFECT example of when History stops being about truth and becomes about a false agenda.

[Beanflicker]

I don't know why people have these rose colored glasses on when talking about guys like Mandela and Che Guevera, who have so much blood on their hands.

Mandela was a historic figure for sure, but lets speak honestly about him instead of perpetuating the propaganda.

[ryanman]

Nelson Mandela according to the world = One of the great men of our time.
Nelson Mandela according to Saddos = The world's biggest cunt.

[Beanflicker]

Nelson Mandela according to Saddos = The world's biggest cunt.

Haha. I don't think he was that bad, I think the animosity comes from people looking at him as the virtue of peace, when he did have a bloody history that people either want to block out or are just too lazy to research.

[Master]

Mandela has said himself that he did make mistakes and regrets some of his actions but without him there South Africa would have been in a worse state than it is now. The civil unrest would have been a lot worse.

Thatcher was wrong to not support sanctions and boycott South Africa.

You are all wrong to bring up his terrorism in the pretence that you think people are being hypocritical of his past. Stop trying to do a Miles, he does it with conviction and meaning – smashup you do it poorly.

[Dark Lord Al]

Nelson Mandela according to the world = One of the great men of our time.
Nelson Mandela according to Saddos = The world's biggest cunt.

Didn't Winnie Mandela have the worlds biggest cunt?

[Violent Demise]

Well, based purely on my twitter feed, it is depressing to see people who were 'truly shocked' and saddened at the death of Paul Walker making jokes about 'Has someone died? lol' when Mandela dies.
@smashup - It's easy to use the two wrongs don't make a right argument, but how much longer would apartheid have continued without the second wrongs that helped to bring the situation to its head and de Clerc having to bow to international pressure to end apartheid.

There's no such things as saints and as they say history is written by the winners, so there's no doubt that the negatives will be downplayed and the positives will be held up for all to see.

Losing Paul Walker was worse than losing Mandela.

[Andre]

The media and the world should tell the entirety of his story. A man who was frustrated and resorted to violence and then only after years in prison realized the flaws of his actions and sought peace.


This is a time to learn lessons about his life not to hold him up as a saint.

The voice of reason .

[Beanz]

The hypocrisy lies with Dicks like Cameron who never took a stand against Apartheid
Cameron's freebie to apartheid South Africa - UK Politics - UK - The Independent and now can't wait to spout a soundbite. At least Bush who stupidly called anyone who wasn't a right wing conservative "a communist" seems to have kept his gob shut.It is lazy and self righteous to judge Mandela and his actions from the standpoint of a white person not living in South Africa when he began to stand his ground. Of course he is not a saint but few people finding themselves in his situation would have used that opportunity to do so much good. Ghandi's idea of a spinning wheel in every Indian house would have hurled it back into the dark ages but that does not negate the incredible achievements he initiated in taking on the British Empire. People seem to be in a rush to prove their own credibility in not being taken in by the medias spin. You have to willfully disregard so much to lend some of the comments here any credibility. Have some respect and try at least to look for some common ground while his family and country are in mourning.



Nelson Mandela, boxer: fought in the ring before he fought apartheid - Swide

[Gandalf]

I think most people respect that Mandela stood up against a hideous system and eventually managed to become President himself, but that doesn't mean that his legacy as actual President should be swept under the carpet.

Watching American CNN yesterday was a massive exercise in double standards and hypocrisy. They had war criminal Blair fawning away, Bush of course got his Tweet in, and EVERY person was waffling on as though Mandela was a saint. There was not a single mention of Mandela's violent past, there was not a single criticism of his tenure as President. Now I am not saying anyone needs to raked over hot coals, but a little balance should be the order of the day in a news network and there was none. The only place I see balancing the sheet is The Real News and of course nobody will see that as it isn't selected via remote control.

Furthermore, the kinds of people in 'mourning' were the same people that had Mandela on terrorist lists until 2008, the same people who ignore the apartheid in occupied Palestine, the same countries that actively supported apartheid South Africa. That for me is the most galling aspect of it all.

My final observation is that you are going to have Mandela, like Luther King, put into saint mode and have the content and meaning of what they believed hidden under the carpets. Racial equality is important, but the true message of Luther King was warning against US militarism and wealth inequality. These two things are worse than ever before and yet every year that gets lost under the innacurate notion that race is not such a massive issue in American society. Mandela was typically scornful of the West as a younger man and later somewhat sold out, but that was what Mandela was about. When you get old, you want a quiet life, but the younger Mandela and the message within is something being totally ignored by the mainstream media right now. It will likely vanish into the ether like the main tenets of Luther King.

[Spicoli]

Rest in peace Mandela. It was the Jerry Dammers and Specials spin off song that brought him to attention in 84'. Yeh, revolutionary and rebel who resorted to violence and was no saint early on against an oppressive violent authority, and became leader of a nation...sound familiar? The company he kept and the means to an end sought were no worse than some of our own leaders at one time or another. He wasn't a Saint, and neither are we. Might just be me, I think John Brown might of had the right idea given the circumstances!

[Gandalf]

Nelson Mandela according to the world = One of the great men of our time.
Nelson Mandela according to Saddos = The world's biggest cunt.

The worlds media says the former, the latter is just being a bit more realistic. The mainstream media in particular is a grooming exercise, you know the deal with power and control. They need to project Mandela as saint as he capitulated to the West and justifies them and their about turn on him.

The reality is that South Africa is still a basket case country and the only real difference is that everyone can now vote, but now more white people are joining the blacks in poverty. Admittedly, some blacks have done very well, but Mandela as President was an exercise in capitulation to the so called demands of national debt and imperial control.

He should have given a fuck you gesture and allowed South Africa to be as screwed up as it would be now anyway. At least stay true to proper values. Instead it just became the American model but with more violent crime. 'You can vote, but the US investors control this country'. That was Mandela's political legacy.

You've had Castro as an AV, you more than most know what choices you should make when people are going to listen to you. Would I after all my whining let myself come back to the UK after exile and allow the Queen to remain? I would push her off Worthing Pier and tell her children, "now get a job as you are the real definition of bullshit". You don't capitulate and sell out just because you are older.

You tell them straight and instead Mandela sold out. Of course major news networks are like drooling bunnies, South Africa was a money spinner, and when you could have had a real resistance, Mandela was preyed upon. Just a weak old man and there is no shame in that, but of course getting someone old and vulnerable will be shouted to the rafters.

Mandela was a courageous, charming and brilliant man, but he was fed into a den of hyena's and said fair do's. He lived a long time, he could have done it hardcore like the sacrifice that he made.

[smashup]

Mandela has said himself that he did make mistakes and regrets some of his actions but without him there South Africa would have been in a worse state than it is now. The civil unrest would have been a lot worse.

Thatcher was wrong to not support sanctions and boycott South Africa.

You are all wrong to bring up his terrorism in the pretence that you think people are being hypocritical of his past. Stop trying to do a Miles, he does it with conviction and meaning – smashup you do it poorly.

Explain to everyone what you think is wrong with posting the facts that he gave orders for bombings that claimed hundreds of innocent lives?
I couldn't give a flying fuck what he did for Africa after his release, im just stating facts.

[Master]

Mandela has said himself that he did make mistakes and regrets some of his actions but without him there South Africa would have been in a worse state than it is now. The civil unrest would have been a lot worse.

Thatcher was wrong to not support sanctions and boycott South Africa.

You are all wrong to bring up his terrorism in the pretence that you think people are being hypocritical of his past. Stop trying to do a Miles, he does it with conviction and meaning – smashup you do it poorly.

Explain to everyone what you think is wrong with posting the facts that he gave orders for bombings that claimed hundreds of innocent lives?
I couldn't give a flying fuck what he did for Africa after his release, im just stating facts.

I have stated a number of facts as well. Trying to undermine his legacy at this time is not clever.

[Gandalf]

Mind you, I was being flippant with language and I wouldn't push the Queen off a pier. I would have her locked up like Mandela because she is the opposite of social equality. Mandela of course stood up for a society that is far more free than British society. Britain is under a class based apartheid, but for some reason refuses to shake off the bounds of a single family.