Quote Originally Posted by Greenbeanz View Post
Quote Originally Posted by Gandalf View Post
This has nothing to do with prejudice on my part, GB. I am angry about America (as everybody should be) and I also don't give a hoot for the paralympics, but that has nothing to do with anything in this thread. My being married to someone and living successfully in a different culture also has nothing to do with this thread. I am against uncontrolled immigration for pragmatical social and economic reasons.

I have explained my point of view repeatedly, but it is you that express the Guardian reader point of view (which you accuse me of!). The typical Guardian reader is not on the same level as the tabloid media reader, the immigrants are largely coming after the jobs of the tabloid reader and of course they are angry and fearful. History says that they are right.

That's where I find it funny that you can accuse me of being a snob. I'm on the side of the ordinary English worker. He is being ripped off, ignored at the ballot box, and is desperate. If I was a true snob, I would say let them all in, as in truth, I have nothing to lose. I don't want that to be though.

I think the common concerns are correct ones and that the system is an elite tool to purposely cause social fragementation, and then you factor in Britain being a police state. Well, it all makes sense. There will be unrest, of course you need to control communications.
Miles you are such a square, your dopey sheep like following of fear mongering facists like Farrage makes that quite clear as do your many assumptions. I don't read the Guardian, I read the Times. If you really think that people choose a newspaper solely because the editorial slant matches their own personal politics then again you are acting like a snob. You don't care about working class people because you have never been one. How many factories have you worked in? How many building sites? Have you ever even dipped your toe into the relatively safe middle classed commune of a kibbutz or socialist work camp ? I know from experience that when you travel to another country you will at first be inclined to do many jobs that others would not but that is not the whole story. Does the fact the I have been willing to do agricultural work before in Italy mean that I was stealing a local persons job? What about working in Biggin Hill airport stores despite not being a Londoner and having to pitch a tent in the local woods to do so ? Was It my fault that local people didn't want to do the night shift? Was I stealing their Job?

You keep talking about uncontrolled immigration and illegal immigration, I am not suggesting either of those things is a good idea. There are already laws in place that mean immigrants caught sleeping rough get deported and are not allowed to return for a year. You have nothing to lose because you don't live here. Economic isolation would be terrible for this country and yet you would be happy to watch it stagnate from afar because it would increase your own fragile feeling of superiority which you remind us all of repeatedly.

Don't forget I have two kids both in their twenties and they have not found it easy to find work but they have and they both remark how a lot of their generation seem to feel that they have a sense of entitlement and are very lazy. I see students like at at University too but rarely are they foreign. When I left school and worked in a shoe factory the previous generation worked much harder than mine and although much of the work was unskilled they were able to earn fantastic money on a piece work system that rewarded their effort. That work ethic is often still their amongst Eastern Europeans whether they are dentists or plumbers. And yes the UK was desperately short of Dentists before many Polish turned up.

If anybody is being fragmentory and divisive it is well landed Politicians like Farrage. I have far more in common with My Lithuanian tattoo artist than I do with him, the Tories and the more reactionary tabloid reader that you have sided with.
Honestly, listen to yourself. You can't resist ad hominem attacks, you then accuse me of never belonging to the working classes. I simply said your immigration views reflect those of The Guardian more than any tabloid. I know, I read them all too. What types of jobs do you think my old school leaving friends do back home? Working class, low paying jobs. I did them too from the age of 14.

Your post doesn't warrant any serious response as you are unable to discuss anything rationally or as an adult. You do not feel threatened and so put your fingers in your ears and whistle a merry song whilst national borders are being abused daily.

I will agree that some people can be lazy, but start paying them 3 times the minimum wage, and see how productive they will suddenly become. Like magic, English workers would find the desire to work. That's what the average Polish worker is getting in his or her currency.

Instead you waffle on about how lazy the English are and what a benefit the foreigners are to the economy. Such research shows the benefits to be marginal at best, and it is sheep like you that keep on parroting utter gibberish. And don't forget, your personal anecdotes are worth nothing. They are not intellectual and should be ignored. The words of a wise man, apparently.