Max powerism 101:

[Max Power]

Screw you Rocco!

I haven't started any threads in months. And shouldn't these slanderous ones be in that nasty little hidden board I stumbled across earlier?

You think size is the only factor I look at when I compare boxers? If that were the case then you could easily refute any argument because obviously smaller boxers can and do beat bigger ones. Otherwise there'd be no point to boxing because we'd know who the winners will be.

But I'm sorry, when discussing the HW division, where you are expressly ALLOWED to outweigh your opponent by an unlimited amount, then proportions become extremely important!

In fact, aside from skill, which is a subjective assessment, weight is the next most important and the first most directly measurable important quality in assessing a HW fighter. It's inescapable.

When for instance, Wladimir Klitschko fought the then only undefeated American HW Ray Austin, there was no height or weight advantage for either, they were exactly the same. So Wladimir must have possessed some other feature that was decisive in this fight... QUALITY.

And when 205lb Holyfield lost to Riddick Bowe, his trainers decided for him to bulk up to 215 for the next fight with Bowe which he won. They did NOT think he should further cut his weight for "speed" reasons!

[ruthless rocco]

Whoops my bad! I over complicated the lesson. Let's start over.


MAX POWERISM 101:

Newer is better.

[palmerq]

When for instance, Wladimir Klitschko fought the then only undefeated American HW Ray Austin, there was no height or weight advantage for either, they were exactly the same. So Wladimir must have possessed some other feature that was decisive in this fight... QUALITY.

I don't think ray austin was ever undefeated.

[Max Power]

When for instance, Wladimir Klitschko fought the then only undefeated American HW Ray Austin, there was no height or weight advantage for either, they were exactly the same. So Wladimir must have possessed some other feature that was decisive in this fight... QUALITY.

I don't think ray austin was ever undefeated.

Well he was.. Until he met Wladimir.

In fact even the draw vs Ibragimov was basically a win for Austin. He filed a protest because they did not score a KD during the fight. The panel agreed, did not overturn the decision but based on findings, is what earned Austin his shot.

[p4pking]

When for instance, Wladimir Klitschko fought the then only undefeated American HW Ray Austin, there was no height or weight advantage for either, they were exactly the same. So Wladimir must have possessed some other feature that was decisive in this fight... QUALITY.

I don't think ray austin was ever undefeated.

Well he was.. Until he met Wladimir.

In fact even the draw vs Ibragimov was basically a win for Austin. He filed a protest because they did not score a KD during the fight. The panel agreed, did not overturn the decision but based on findings, is what earned Austin his shot.

Ray Austin - Boxer

[SugarBoxing]

I want to write a word support to @Max Power

that sometimes, very untraditional way of thinking might be very valuable.

[Max Power]

I want to write a word support to @Max Power

that sometimes, very untraditional way of thinking might be very valuable.

Thanks, but where I'm from, the tradition is reversed.

You could approximately sum up my assertations even more simply, without any analysis..

It goes..

"AS IF most of these guys you try to promote against the ones you bash would stand any chance whatsoever!"

It is unimaginable what the upper echelons of HW boxing today would do to long ago eras boxers.

But all nationalist and racist reasons aside, there is a more basic reason why anybody, even modernist fans sometimes make illegitimate comparison and it is confusion over the term HW.

Past eras were CALLED HW but they were largely synonymous with the Cruiserweight and at even earlier times the current light HW division.

It then becomes obvious that current limit weight boxers are faster, more skilled and more athletic than any boxers of the past.

The only thing these old guys have in common with current HW's is the NAME only.

Take a look at these 2 "boys" here...

http://image.trucktrend.com/f/featur...hammad-ali.jpg.

It's only when you view images like this with respect to what I said above that one realises guys like Clay and Joe were NOT HW's as we describe them today, but GROSSLY OUT OF SHAPE CRUISERS!

Then look at this picture...

http://2l7kr2xl4t7418ewd3w7ur01d2m.w...weigh-in-1.jpg

Do you see the difference, yes or no?

[TitoFan]

Are we talking up Ray "The Rainman" Austin here??

I saw the fight.
If I were defending Wlad's record, I'd leave Rainman out of the argument.


Also, I know encyclopedic sources are generally frowned upon around here, but.....
Admittedly, not having been a big "Rainman" follower during his forgettable career, I must resort to Wikipedia for this sort of thing.

So..... weren't there 3 defeats in Rainman's record when he "fought" (and I use the term loosely) Wladimir?
Including one by knockout?

Someone enlighten me how this somehow constitutes an undefeated record.

[Jimanuel Boogustus]

Newer IS better.

You don't often here ''..and the old', do you

Logic

[Andre]

I can see your point,modern fighters do have it better in so many ways. In general over all the weights I think the fighters of old were more mentally tough from the work during the times and were more determined grittier fighters that could go for some amazing number of rounds.Most fights were for around an hour but varied from 20 minutes up to 3 and half hours. One bare fisted boxing match went for 3 hours 16 miniutes after which one fighter Simon Byrne died 3 days later (Byrne had also killed a man in the ring prior to his last fight.)
Theres the difference; skills correct diets advanced techniques lesser rounds and gloves.
Cant compare the two really and then there s the guys who fell into the game in between the two extremes some had some of the old grit in them some more of the newer stuff some a touch of both hard to draw a distinct line in the sand though. 20 rounds,15,12,10. You take one fighter from here to there or one from there to here and each may not do so well in the others eras.

[palmerq]

I want to write a word support to @Max Power

that sometimes, very untraditional way of thinking might be very valuable.

I also like reading max powers posts too(Although sometimes they get a bit repetitive), he certainly offers something different and I think he certainly makes a few interesting points... Different opinions make forum reading fun

[Max Power]

I want to write a word support to @Max Power

that sometimes, very untraditional way of thinking might be very valuable.

I also like reading max powers posts too(Although sometimes they get a bit repetitive), he certainly offers something different and I think he certainly makes a few interesting points... Different opinions make forum reading fun

@palmerq and @NVSemin

I appreciate your tolerance of opinions of course and thank you.

I try to not become repetitive but sometimes the topics argued against are themselves repetitive. A typical thing I have found with many posters I argue with is "merry go rounding". By the time something has been fully argued out, it goes back to square one.

[Dark Lord Al]

Screw you Rocco!

I haven't started any threads in months. And shouldn't these slanderous ones be in that nasty little hidden board I stumbled across earlier?

You think size is the only factor I look at when I compare boxers? If that were the case then you could easily refute any argument because obviously smaller boxers can and do beat bigger ones. Otherwise there'd be no point to boxing because we'd know who the winners will be.

But I'm sorry, when discussing the HW division, where you are expressly ALLOWED to outweigh your opponent by an unlimited amount, then proportions become extremely important!





In fact, aside from skill, which is a subjective assessment, weight is the next most important and the first most directly measurable important quality in assessing a HW fighter. It's inescapable.

When for instance, Wladimir Klitschko fought the then only undefeated American HW Ray Austin, there was no height or weight advantage for either, they were exactly the same. So Wladimir must have possessed some other feature that was decisive in this fight... QUALITY.

And when 205lb Holyfield lost to Riddick Bowe, his trainers decided for him to bulk up to 215 for the next fight with Bowe which he won. They did NOT think he should further cut his weight for "speed" reasons!

That's because you were banned.