Does anyone in their right mind....

[Beanflicker]

[QUOTE=TitoFan;1312000]

Sure, I think RJJ also could've beatan Dariusz Michalczewski, and Joe Calzgahe but he didnt want to go overseas. Now he looks ass out hypocritical for saying that. Since then: he's been to Austraila, Moscow, Krasnodar, Russia?? And Poland and back to Russia.
Manny Steward use to critizize RJJ on his choice and timing of fights, I agree.
.

I don't think it's really hypocritical because it's completely different scenarios. Back then, he was the p4p king on top of the boxing world who had, at one point, been the victim of the worst robbery in the history of boxing when they literally stole an Olympic gold medal from him in South Korea and gave it to the home town guy, so I can see why he was apprehensive to go overseas. Now, he's an old man basically fighting exhibitions overseas for a quick pay cheque because some promoter came up with enough money.

I'm sure there are reasons why a lot of the fights didn't happen... I know the Nigel Benn fight didn't happen because Benn was handled by King, who wanted (I think) a three fight option on Roy if the fight was signed (Roy, not wanting to sign himself over to Don King, declined). Jones moved up to 175 before Calzaghe was ever a world champ, so that never could have happened. But I think the shame is guys like Eubank and Dariusz for not coming over to fight Roy. I understand that Darisuz was technically the linear champion, but Roy was looked at as not only the #1 in the division, but the #1 in the sport. Those guys should have been falling over themselves to come fight Jones and take their stab at greatness. Dariusz, Eubanks, they were warriors and I know they weren't scared of Jones. But IMO they have no confidence in being able to beat him, they already had large home fan bases where they made a ton of money per fight and packed the arenas, and they didn't want to jeopardize that by going to America and getting obliterated by Jones. Benn and Eubank were great by Jones and Toney would have handed both of them their asses.

[Ron Swanson]

I don't think you're going to get much argument about RJJ being one of the greats.
Like many fighters, after he lost or really was beaten, he lost his confidence and seemed to be easy pickings for a time, which was a shock and hard to watch.

After Roy came down from HW and had to lose all of that weight he lost two things: Hunger and punch resistance. After being HW it was all said and done. He will be in the history books as not one of the greatest of all times, but for achieving a feat- no matter how relatively miniscule that feat was- that no one else can probably do coming up from being a MW: That is winning the HW Championship of the World.

I think that no one will break that record or accomplishment in my lifetime. Not the way HW's are set now and not the way MW's are so much smaller than they were even ten years ago.

A look at the MW division and you look at overblown Welter's for the most part. Even GGG looks small for a MW. Quillin is probably the only true legitimate MW sized fighter in the division today along with Andy Lee, but everyone else looks small.

You do know Chris Byrd came from MW to win the HW title too right?

[Beanflicker]

I don't think Byrd ever officially fought at MW. His first fight he weighed in at 169 and from there it was up, up, up. Jones spent a few years at MW.

[ykdadamaja]

I don't think Byrd ever officially fought at MW. His first fight he weighed in at 169 and from there it was up, up, up. Jones spent a few years at MW.

... and it was only one fight at Super Middle, then he did two at cruiser, then after that he remained a Heavyweight. Plus, he never won a title at Super Middle or Cruiser. RJJ won MW, Super Middle, LH, and then Heavy. The only title in that span that Jones did not take was the Cruiser... and he fights at Cruiser now and I think he wants that title.

[SlimTrae]

[QUOTE=Beanflicker;1312048]

Sure, I think RJJ also could've beatan Dariusz Michalczewski, and Joe Calzgahe but he didnt want to go overseas. Now he looks ass out hypocritical for saying that. Since then: he's been to Austraila, Moscow, Krasnodar, Russia?? And Poland and back to Russia.
Manny Steward use to critizize RJJ on his choice and timing of fights, I agree.
.

I don't think it's really hypocritical because it's completely different scenarios. Back then, he was the p4p king on top of the boxing world who had, at one point, been the victim of the worst robbery in the history of boxing when they literally stole an Olympic gold medal from him in South Korea and gave it to the home town guy, so I can see why he was apprehensive to go overseas. Now, he's an old man basically fighting exhibitions overseas for a quick pay cheque because some promoter came up with enough money.

I'm sure there are reasons why a lot of the fights didn't happen... I know the Nigel Benn fight didn't happen because Benn was handled by King, who wanted (I think) a three fight option on Roy if the fight was signed (Roy, not wanting to sign himself over to Don King, declined). Jones moved up to 175 before Calzaghe was ever a world champ, so that never could have happened. But I think the shame is guys like Eubank and Dariusz for not coming over to fight Roy. I understand that Darisuz was technically the linear champion, but Roy was looked at as not only the #1 in the division, but the #1 in the sport. Those guys should have been falling over themselves to come fight Jones and take their stab at greatness. Dariusz, Eubanks, they were warriors and I know they weren't scared of Jones. But IMO they have no confidence in being able to beat him, they already had large home fan bases where they made a ton of money per fight and packed the arenas, and they didn't want to jeopardize that by going to America and getting obliterated by Jones. Benn and Eubank were great by Jones and Toney would have handed both of them their asses.

I can't say I totally agree, but you got a pretty solid argument.

[birch]

If any of you have watched the Behind the Ropes programme on SkySports, Eubank admits that he did not consider himself in the same league as RJJ or Toney and was happy fighting in Britain and been rated as the best this side of the pond. I think he even went as far to say RJJ would probably have beaten him.

However, RJJ says that the only opponent he would have had issues with during the 90s was Chris Eubank, due to his style.

For what it's worth, I think RJJ wipes the floor with anybody during the 90s.

[sanatogen]

Collins did go looking for Roy, but may only now actually get his wish to face him.

Back then, It could have been an entertaining fight while it lasted.

Roy did state that Calzaghe was too much risk for little reward for an earlier fight.

[Beanflicker]

If any of you have watched the Behind the Ropes programme on SkySports, Eubank admits that he did not consider himself in the same league as RJJ or Toney and was happy fighting in Britain and been rated as the best this side of the pond. I think he even went as far to say RJJ would probably have beaten him.

However, RJJ says that the only opponent he would have had issues with during the 90s was Chris Eubank, due to his style.

For what it's worth, I think RJJ wipes the floor with anybody during the 90s.

That's pretty big of Chris to admit, and I 100% believe that was also what Dariusz was doing over in Germany. If they had any real confidence in beating Roy, they would have come over and done it. When you already have a built-in fan base and you can make a ton of money fighting lighter opposition, there really isn't that same hunger to challenge a truly great fighter and risk losing the mystique you have in your own country.

Dariusz did the right thing because even to this day you still have people claiming Roy ducked him and Dariusz would have beaten RJJ. Dariusz got to fight out his career in Germany and be a folk hero. If he went over to the states and fought Jones he would have been made to look mediocre like everyone else Roy fought and it would have been gone.

[imp]

Styles make fights and I hate to say it but Tarver would have given him problems every time out. But there is no denying that he was an artist in the ring.

He beat him the first time