The Fight: Walrus vs SlimTrae (Political Objectivity)

[SlimTrae]

Let me make sure I have this: You are sort of a libertarian? Total libertarian or partially? Just curious.

Does the libertarian movement you espouse consist of David Nolan? (I 4got his name so I had to google it just now) He is given credit from many websites, books I've come across as the founder of the current movement in 1971. Is this the form of libertarian you get down with? or is there another name to find the genesis of your version/brand of libertarianism? If there is more than one...


And in 2012 Was Gary Johnson the Presidential Nominee for the libertarian party you get down with? If so, did you vote for him? Do you have a history here that shows how you supported the libertarian candidate? Any?

You see: I am similar to the dude mentioned in Jesus' parable (the will of the 2 sons) I am like the one who said (NO) I will not do the will- as in (no;I do NOT proclaim to be a libertarian)
Yet when it came time to doing the will (behavior/actions of a libertarian) I have a history here- where I linked a website that asked political questions and attempted to link the responses to candidates -

I was told my views were favorable to a Gary Johnson over Obama & Romney.
May I ask, did U vote for Gary Johnson the 2012 Libertarian candidate? Did you vote for Ron Paul who was once a libertarian candidate? My point is: are there actions that make you feel that you should call yourself a libertarian? Call your bookshelf aka closet a libertarian closet?

When --then Senator Obama got the nod for the Democratic Nominee, I voted for Ron Paul- I wasn't trying to call myself a libertarian, I was just doing the actions of one. And you? If need be- I can find the link/thread -that validates my so-called political score card ranking me to Gary Johnson- to which I think...Kabong told me about Gary..and that he was a libertarian.
Point again? I didn't find Gary, rather my views on what I felt aligned me to him: not Obama, nor Romney. You should take the test- then link it here and show us your results..I mean to see how libertarian you are?

[SlimTrae]

Final thoughts on your use of the word "libertarian"

I have come to accept that Ron Paul was (once) a Republican who espoused conservative values.
He changed his party during Reagan's era- and aligned himself briefly with the libertarian party-
I think he stated he was never fully a libertarian and rather held views that he hoped they as a party would endorse.

Then he left, and went back to the Republican Party- claiming the same thing: hoping the conservatives would come to see things his way-

when he lost the 2012 nominee- I can show where he was asked to endorse Romney. He said no and explained. His son however went on to endorse Romney. Feel free to correct me: but from the posts I have seen of yours--it seems that you favor Rand over Ron.

Is Rand a libertarian to you? And what would prevent you a self proclaimed libertarian from supporting one? What would cause you to consider voting for Rubio-as a libertarian? Why label yourself at all?

Ron Paul's labels don't matter me no way or the other- its the words he uses. His take on the Federal Reserve. His take on waging wars, his take on African-Americans in the penal system, his take on abortion that I see eye to eye with. I don't know who he learned from -but I did read one dude who he quoted:
a dude named Henrie Fairlie
During the 1980 Republican convention, he wrote a column for The Washington Post describing the delegates as Narrow minded, book banning, truth censoring, mean spirited; ungenerous, envious, intolerant, afraid; chicken, bullying; trivially moral, falsely patriotic; family cheapening, flag cheapening, God cheapening; the common man, shallow, small, sanctimonious."
Oh, yeah, I can get down with where he's coming from. On the for real side.

Surely the British fellows here can chime in on this dude. & the term "the establishment". Well per history Henry Fairlie is considered the one who (coined) the phrase.

His works in the 1960s was published in The New Republic, The Washington Post, The New Yorker
How did he view Dems? He distrusted John F. Kennedy & claimed John K's charisma and promises gave the country false expectations for change-

He deemed the Reagan era/coalition as: Tax-cutting regulation-haters
Fairlie's critique of American conservatism began with the Reagan GOP & claimed: that by embracing the free market so completely, the party had gone calamitously awry
Republicans, he argued, could never succeed in uniting the country as long as they supported business interests so completely with both their policy choices and their rhetoric: "The nation cannot be brought to you, as if it were Masterpiece Theatre, by a grant from Mobil Oil,"

Ron Paul hipped me to this dude- And Ron espouses libertarian views- and when I looked at their web page? Did they not agree with the same sex marriage via 14th amendment? DO you? Do they not agree that abortion is not about American morals/values but about the woman and her own body? And you? Do they not argue today that Republicans are wrong to want to spend more on military than Obama is today? And you?

These hardly seem the issues to which you get down with. So unless there is another party of libertarians...what exactly makes you one? No argument from me..Im just curious why you don't call yourself a conservative and leave it at that. And again feel free to show my posts of liberalism along with the claims. Maybe you can show something in me that I cant see from within. Its all good.
Truth, that is..

[walrus]

@SlimTrae stop having arguments with me when I'm not present. How the hell am I going to catch up with all your posts now. You break down my paragraphs into sentences but that tends to take things out of context. I did say I wasn't enthralled with any candidates, you asked me where, I don't know at this point but it's in the next president thread. Just like I keep saying I see little difference between the parties. In the end, when politicians take off, most though not all move to the middle. We all have our noble ideas but in reality we live in the middle. I consider myself a libertarian only sometimes, as I said, I'm a registered independent. Are you going to break this down sentence by sentence. If you keep doing that I'm going to have to write a book here to stop you.

[SlimTrae]

Lol, i guess i didn't see your store hours. Like I'm here everyday. We all post---whenever we can.
But if you'd like to discuss in real time, then lay the hours out. Heck, we can even get a referee (master) Brock, Beans whoever. And they can time us on response time to ensure neither is googling things they claim to know.

But if not....please don't ask me to do what no one here is doing...posting to each other in real time.



I broke it down sentence by sentence to keep each idea (in) context. So when i claim people who take my words out of context, i copy it to validate the claim.
Where have i taken anything out of context? In fact my sentences usually in with a question pertaining to your accusations of you being a libertarian and me being a liberal.
Last i add links as proof of where i stand, then ask the same of you.

Feel, free to write a book. I like (the cat in the hat) styled books.

You did answer my question of how much of a libertarian you are: sometimes.
Answers eliminate the need for me to break down your posts.

Allegations, accusations, and ambiguous retorts is what causes me to go line by line precept by precept.