The Myth of the British National Health Servi

[brocktonblockbust]

1st off, as a one off, Beanz is right to now be addressing me as The Brock. Not Brock. He has learned to address me in a royal manner, as I do so well deserve to be, as I have utterly earned it by my gracious and magnanimous character, demeanor and disposition, and that is without even mentioning my sanctimonious persona, or my merciful.reluctance to.resort to cruelty, malice, or meanness.

Now then, as grateful as Beanz clearly and most justifiably is to the NHS for the family reasons he has provided here--and that goes without saying that, in all honesty (and not without the least bit of sincerity) every single one of us would WITHOUT QUESTION feel in equal measure precisely that gratefulness he expressed above were WE to have been the beneficiaries of that service he was provided--it is also noteworthy that even in the poorest of countries (the UK not falling within that category, at least not before 2030 anyway) there is indeed (as amazing as it may seem to some westerners) an actually surprisingly adequate and well-equipped health care system.which delays.rather well if I may say so myself with similar urgent health.matters, rendering the argument that the NHS is any kind.of unique godsend etc. quite null and.void, to say the very least.

Nowhere else would she have been operated on so quickly by one of the top neurosurgeons in the country with our limited financial resources. That alone makes the NHS much more than the piss that you label it as. The NHS is unique. Just because you do not understand or appreciate that does not make it not so.

I do not expect that you compared the speed with which they attended to your families urgent needs with the potential speed of other systems around the world, and you'd be surprised how quickly Singapore, Taiwan, Brunei, UAE or even Canada's systems may have responded in equally speedy measure.

[Beanz]

1st off, as a one off, Beanz is right to now be addressing me as The Brock. Not Brock. He has learned to address me in a royal manner, as I do so well deserve to be, as I have utterly earned it by my gracious and magnanimous character, demeanor and disposition, and that is without even mentioning my sanctimonious persona, or my merciful.reluctance to.resort to cruelty, malice, or meanness.

Now then, as grateful as Beanz clearly and most justifiably is to the NHS for the family reasons he has provided here--and that goes without saying that, in all honesty (and not without the least bit of sincerity) every single one of us would WITHOUT QUESTION feel in equal measure precisely that gratefulness he expressed above were WE to have been the beneficiaries of that service he was provided--it is also noteworthy that even in the poorest of countries (the UK not falling within that category, at least not before 2030 anyway) there is indeed (as amazing as it may seem to some westerners) an actually surprisingly adequate and well-equipped health care system.which delays.rather well if I may say so myself with similar urgent health.matters, rendering the argument that the NHS is any kind.of unique godsend etc. quite null and.void, to say the very least.

Nowhere else would she have been operated on so quickly by one of the top neurosurgeons in the country with our limited financial resources. That alone makes the NHS much more than the piss that you label it as. The NHS is unique. Just because you do not understand or appreciate that does not make it not so.

I do not expect that you compared the speed with which they attended to your families urgent needs with the potential speed of other systems around the world, and you'd be surprised how quickly Singapore, Taiwan, Brunei, UAE or even Canada's systems may have responded in equally speedy measure.

Do not expect -potential- may have- none of these are anything but supposition so your entire post is meaningless. You do this a lot you just dribble out stuff and pretend that it is debate. I am talking about real life experience of a NATIONAL HEALTH SERVICE being able to utilise the best person for the Job in the place he was needed at that time. You are pretending that not having to fill out a mountain of forms or travel to find the right neurosurgeon or hospital like we would have elsewhere is irelevant because then you can justify the following stupid statement.

The NHS is piss. Tell us more how is the NHS piss. That from you personal experience? Something you read? Something you want to be true?

It's weird it seems that a few americans don't really give a f**k about many things and are quite offended or nonplussed when others do.

[Gandalf]

Health care is a human right and should be free at the point of use for all. I remember as a teenager going to hospital and the doctor right there and then said they could operate. I procrastinated and never did the surgery, but now if I wanted to do that it would cost me about 8,000 pounds out here. I wish I did do it then and missed a great opportunity. The UK in that respect is great. However, the last time I went to a doctor they tried referring me to a private clinic for something that could have been easily handled without going private. I saw that as a sign that things were changing there.

What the politicians have done to the health care system is criminal and at the same time they reduce corporation taxes and continue to allow the rich to avoid paying any taxes. The shortfall could easily come from that and instead they purposely hand contracts to their friends. It is criminal and that is how they think. The rich must get richer and the price worth paying is the collapse of the NHS.

[brocktonblockbust]

Nonplussed come.on, B. I'm never nonplussed plus you suck at math. NHS is piss because patients have to 'self diagnose' and then go to the doctor for unknown conditions. NHS is only good for known conditions. Nonplus, NHS has been very selective about who gets the "best treatment". If you went private you'd certainly get less cancellations as well. Doctors have zero training on new, rare diseases.

[Gandalf]

Nonplussed come.on, B. I'm never nonplussed plus you suck at math. NHS is piss because patients have to 'self diagnose' and then go to the doctor for unknown conditions. NHS is only good for known conditions. Nonplus, NHS has been very selective about who gets the "best treatment". If you went private you'd certainly get less cancellations as well. Doctors have zero training on new, rare diseases.

Why should people be forced to turn to private health care when health care is a human right? The money to pay for the system is there, but instead you would rather the super rich not pay their share of tax which is what has happened. Then the same elite get health contracts on the cheap and lo and behold they get even richer and ordinary people lose out even more. 'Tax them for it' cry the masses, 'Give us back our health care!'. 'No' says Brock, 'They worked hard for that money and it is their right to park the profits in an offshore tax haven'.

[brocktonblockbust]

What right do you or anyone have to decide what others should "fairly" pay? Or to decide for others how altruistic they "should" be?

[Gandalf]

Half of Americans aged 27-37 on an income of 24,000 dollars of less do not have health coverage. My point is that with your philosophy where the rich avoid paying taxes you have massive inequality and human suffering. In a system where people do not have health coverage they struggle to get treatment and serious conditions do not get diagnosed. To deny them health care coverage because of an ideology where money (all money is created by banks) should remain in the pockets of the wealthy and distribution be denied is essentially an evil one. That is where a system like the NHS is necessary and it is necessary because of the difference it can make to the lives of ordinary people who cannot afford to spend 10,000 dollars a year covering their family.

[brocktonblockbust]

I never said there is no massive inequality nor did I say that millions of people cannot get treatment. Please tell.me how you/anyone would implement this massive collection of funds via taxation of the billionaires, into some kind of health service apparatus. So, step one is ...... "_____________{place someone's name here} unilaterally declares that _____________[place the type of billionaire in the blank, e.g. a sudden Power Ball winner/a poor man who suddenly inherited mega-millions/a diligent entrepreneur/a genius inventor/a conniving oil tycoon, etc.] Should starting RIGHT NOW no longer avail him/herself of ______________(place specific bullet point of tax code here) in order to treat _______________ (place specific G.A.A.P. accounting scenario here) as an extraordinary circumstance/unusual and/or catastrophic event, thereby qualifying for a tax credit...."

That was Step 1. Umm,........ Yeah, that would.go over easily through the Legislative Branch, i.e. THOUSANDS OF LAWMAKERS AND STAGES OF VOTING ON PROPOSED BILLS, ETC.............

Do you realize we have not even gone to Step 2 yet? Redistributing this newfound money? This is worse than a fairy tale.

[Beanz]

Nonplussed come.on, B. I'm never nonplussed plus you suck at math. NHS is piss because patients have to 'self diagnose' and then go to the doctor for unknown conditions. NHS is only good for known conditions. Nonplus, NHS has been very selective about who gets the "best treatment". If you went private you'd certainly get less cancellations as well. Doctors have zero training on new, rare diseases.

This is all complete bollocks. Typical arrogance from someone who despite having never used the service pretends that they are some kind of authority. You don't have to self diagnose at all, what do you think examinations, scans etc are for? Idiot.The whole point of the NHS is that it is not selective about who gets the best treatment. The idea that doctors have zero training on new rare diseases Is also just complete fabrication from you. You just make stuff up. Why? Seriously what does it matter to you that the NHS is so loved in a country you look down your nose at?

[brocktonblockbust]

Nonplussed come.on, B. I'm never nonplussed plus you suck at math. NHS is piss because patients have to 'self diagnose' and then go to the doctor for unknown conditions. NHS is only good for known conditions. Nonplus, NHS has been very selective about who gets the "best treatment". If you went private you'd certainly get less cancellations as well. Doctors have zero training on new, rare diseases.

This is all complete bollocks. Typical arrogance from someone who despite having never used the service pretends that they are some kind of authority. You don't have to self diagnose at all, what do you think examinations, scans etc are for? Idiot.The whole point of the NHS is that it is not selective about who gets the best treatment. The idea that doctors have zero training on new rare diseases Is also just complete fabrication from you. You just make stuff up. Why? Seriously what does it matter to you that the NHS is so loved in a country you look down your nose at?

You are 2 pork pies short of a picnic mate. I have direct experience with your NHS. Have you no empathy for the vast numbers of elderly, vulnerable people left on trolleys for hours and hours? Are you that heartless, you nasty little.man? Is the utter lack of diagnosis and the piss-poor lack of treatment and even drugs OK with you? Try and question some of your stubborn and long-held beliefs. Mate the NHS is sinking. You can't even reform it. Take a look at what France, Germany or Holland does. What a beautiful mix of public and private! Your Chancellor is writing checks to this communist-style monstrosity.

[Beanz]

Nonplussed come.on, B. I'm never nonplussed plus you suck at math. NHS is piss because patients have to 'self diagnose' and then go to the doctor for unknown conditions. NHS is only good for known conditions. Nonplus, NHS has been very selective about who gets the "best treatment". If you went private you'd certainly get less cancellations as well. Doctors have zero training on new, rare diseases.

This is all complete bollocks. Typical arrogance from someone who despite having never used the service pretends that they are some kind of authority. You don't have to self diagnose at all, what do you think examinations, scans etc are for? Idiot.The whole point of the NHS is that it is not selective about who gets the best treatment. The idea that doctors have zero training on new rare diseases Is also just complete fabrication from you. You just make stuff up. Why? Seriously what does it matter to you that the NHS is so loved in a country you look down your nose at?

You are 2 pork pies short of a picnic mate. I have direct experience with your NHS. Have you no empathy for the vast numbers of elderly, vulnerable people left on trolleys for hours and hours? Are you that heartless, you nasty little.man? Is the utter lack of diagnosis and the piss-poor lack of treatment and even drugs OK with you? Try and question some of your stubborn and long-held beliefs. Mate the NHS is sinking. You can't even reform it. Take a look at what France, Germany or Holland does. What a beautiful mix of public and private! Your Chancellor is writing checks to this communist-style monstrosity.

How do you have direct experience if you have never lived here? The tories whose ideology is mirrored by the kind of politics you admire and believe in are responsible for those people left to wait for treatment and yet I am the heartless nasty little man? You are the one constantly mocking people for empathy and scoffing at the idea of social justice not me. Only an American and a pretty brainwashed deluded one at that would call the NHS a 'communist style monstrosity'. You just make stuff up constantly and never address any of the points when people call you out on your bullshit.

Did you even read this - The Tory blueprint for wrecking our public services

The reason the NHS is struggling is because much like Thatcher closing down the mining industry the current Government wants it to fail to justify privatising it. I get that you have thrown your lot in with the elite but if you want to do that you must live with the consequences of being trampled underfoot by the corporate behemoth you have just voted for. You are now an employer of Trump enterprises but that does not give you the right to come and spread your toxic corporate bullshit here. We don't want to ape your failed system its stinks and this widening between the haves and have nots is the real nasty secret in the room. People are dying because of such a sick philosophy and you are actively trying to spread the rot with your corporate slave propaganda.

It is American companies lie ATOS that have the blood of hundreds of dead British disabled and terminally ill people found fit for work on their hands. There is it seems, no lows to which your model will not stoop in an effort to make money.

[Beanz]

Nonplussed come.on, B. I'm never nonplussed plus you suck at math. NHS is piss because patients have to 'self diagnose' and then go to the doctor for unknown conditions. NHS is only good for known conditions. Nonplus, NHS has been very selective about who gets the "best treatment". If you went private you'd certainly get less cancellations as well. Doctors have zero training on new, rare diseases.

This is all complete bollocks. Typical arrogance from someone who despite having never used the service pretends that they are some kind of authority. You don't have to self diagnose at all, what do you think examinations, scans etc are for? Idiot.The whole point of the NHS is that it is not selective about who gets the best treatment. The idea that doctors have zero training on new rare diseases Is also just complete fabrication from you. You just make stuff up. Why? Seriously what does it matter to you that the NHS is so loved in a country you look down your nose at?

You are 2 pork pies short of a picnic mate. I have direct experience with your NHS. Have you no empathy for the vast numbers of elderly, vulnerable people left on trolleys for hours and hours? Are you that heartless, you nasty little.man? Is the utter lack of diagnosis and the piss-poor lack of treatment and even drugs OK with you? Try and question some of your stubborn and long-held beliefs. Mate the NHS is sinking. You can't even reform it. Take a look at what France, Germany or Holland does. What a beautiful mix of public and private! Your Chancellor is writing checks to this communist-style monstrosity.

So you 'direct experience ' turns out to be, no experience whatsoever and merely being in the UK for three days, once in your life.:-) It seems the Trump habit of just making stuff up and then saying "oh you shouldn't take him literally" is catching.Is it the same with the 350 million pound a week the NHS was promised if we left the expensive EU now turning into actual cuts in expenditure?

[Dark Lord Al]

Both my father in law and sister have spent a lot of time in hospital over the last 12 months, and yes it isn't ideal but all in all the NHS was really good and the treatment excellent.
If we stop treating foreign people who come over to take advantage of the free health care , then the service would be better for the people who pay into the system.

[Fenster]

I've just spent nearly two months in hospital so have current first-hand experience of the good and bad. I waited 14 hours to get a bed on a ward, but in my experience, considering the daily pressure nurses/staff are under, the actual care was excellent - the majority are competent at their job (which I guess should be the expected average), with every Nurse Ratched there were half-a-dozen angels.

Can't believe how many people live in their own filth (before being forced to clean), shit and piss themselves and refuse to speak english (the last point is not linked to the others). And the amount that have the cheek to demand a special/particular menu. And get physical/abusive with the nurses (always female nurses). And should be in a mental home. And are fucking time wasters (some poor souls definitely/obviously enjoyed living in the hospital more than outside).

A shout out to the young Filipino nurses - several on my ward - who were the most excellent/dedicated/caring/upbeat lovely people i've ever came across. An eye opener for anyone that believes all immigration is a wrongun.

[El Kabong]

I've just spent nearly two months in hospital so have current first-hand experience of the good and bad. I waited 14 hours to get a bed on a ward, but in my experience, considering the daily pressure nurses/staff are under, the actual care was excellent - the majority are competent at their job (which I guess should be the expected average), with every Nurse Ratched there were half-a-dozen angels.

Can't believe how many people live in their own filth (before being forced to clean), shit and piss themselves and refuse to speak english (the last point is not linked to the others). And the amount that have the cheek to demand a special/particular menu. And get physical/abusive with the nurses (always female nurses). And should be in a mental home. And are fucking time wasters (some poor souls definitely/obviously enjoyed living in the hospital more than outside).

A shout out to the young Filipino nurses - several on my ward - who were the most excellent/dedicated/caring/upbeat lovely people i've ever came across. An eye opener for anyone that believes all immigration is a wrongun.

I hate that you have been ill Fenster, many well wishes to you and for your speedy recovery.


The problem with a social safety net of any kind is IMMIGRATION especially ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION. You have people who do not and have not paid into the system, they have no skin in the game but demand the same rights. Of course under the Hippocratic oath it is the duty of any and all doctors and nurses to provide care for their fellow human beings regardless of their ability to be paid for such services. This then becomes a moral quandary much like "If you need medicine and the medicine is more than you can afford is it immoral for you to steal the medicine if that is the only means by which you can survive"