Some cultures are better than others ? True, False, Impossible to answer conclusively

[El Kabong]

"We don't throw gays off rooftops"

Of course not. But there's plenty of documented, violent crimes against gays in the U.S.... one of the most recent being the infamous shooting at the Orlando gay bar. It's not part of the mainstream culture to violently attack gays, of course, but a lot of misguided, hateful people do. It's not part of the Saudi culture to throw gays off rooftops... but I'm sure it has happened lots of times. It goes back to my original statement.

"We don't marry our first cousins"

Again, the vast majority of Americans don't. But there's documented issues with inbreeding in states such as Kentucky. Again, you can't judge a culture because of some extremist sectors.


When all is said and done, I'd rather live in this part of the world than in the Middle East..... but that's mostly I was born and raised in the West and am used to our ways. If I'd been born and raised over there I might very well see things a little differently.

Ah yes, the Pulse Nightclub shooting, the one done by the guy who pledged his allegiance to ISIS.....brilliant example of how horrible AMERICANS are to gays

Violence against gays in the United States is not community sanctioned, it's not "Hey everyone, we're going to sing 'It's Raining Men' and throw these guys off of the roof and if they survive the fall you crowd of people below just pelt them with rocks until they stop moving, it'll be a great community effort right?"....that doesn't happen TitoFan.



"Again, the vast majority of Americans don't".....


So I guess we just won't ever be able to tell if one culture is better than another seeing how Kentuckians are constantly blowing everything up and beheading anyone who doesn't abide by their backwards ways of thinking.




Dude, at least be reasonable....the Orlando nightclub shooting as an example of how Americans treat gay people....that hurts my brain to even attempt to put myself in your shoes and imagine how you decided that was an argument which helped YOUR side of this debate. Holy shit man...what will we see next?


'You see, Sirhan Sirhan's assassination of Robert Kennedy illustrates just how poorly Americans view Catholics'

'One must understand....you see how Leon Klinghoffer was treated aboard the Achille Lauro. That shows just how horrible Americans treat those with disabilities'

'When you look at Pan Am flight 103, you begin to notice just how much hate Americans have for international flights'

[TitoFan]

"Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses...."

Omar Mateen was an American with Muslim parents, who emigrated to the States almost 4 decades ago.

Every example of naturalized citizens you so gleefully post were just that..... naturalized citizens.

But let's remove all immigrants from the picture as far as the American culture argument goes, so we don't have any bias one way or the other.
What does that leave us? A handful of Indians?

What is America (or rather... the United States... because the term "America" technically includes the entire hemisphere), but a conglomerate of vast groups of immigrants who migrated at one point or another in history. Italians, Irish, Africans, Puerto Ricans, Cubans, Asian, so on and so forth, etc, etc, etc. Hell...... even MUSLIMS!!

How are we managing to throw dividing lines here to claim culture superiority, when the U.S. is truly a melting pot of different cultures, all rolled into one.

Further yet..... what clear and correct vantage point do we have to claim that the atrocities committed by groups of misguided souls actually represent the culture of an entire people or nation?? If you can answer that question truthfully and without bias, be my guest.

But let's forget about the Mateen's of the world. How about good ol' American names..... like Timothy McVeigh? John Allen Williams? Seung-Hui Cho? (Oops.... he's of Asian descent. Damn that Asian culture..... they are hereby deemed inferior). James Eagan Holmes? Wade Michael Page? Frazier Glenn Miller Jr.? David Koresh?

I could go on but what's the point. Many of these are anti-government, or white supremacists, or neo-Nazis, or all of the above.

Do they represent the majority of Americ..... er.....United States citizens? Of course not. Just like the "gay-throwing mobs" in the Middle East are not representative of that culture. They're deluded fanatics, just like those in the United States.

For all the advancements and freedoms enjoyed by the average Mr. White in Everytown, USA...... there's still a lot of social ills that could be used to point fingers at the (ahem) culture. How about the apparent new penalty for jaywalking in Sacramento, California (if you happen to be black)? What is it..... body-slam to the concrete, followed by 20 punches to the head... is that it?

I don't want to go out on a limb here...... but I'm gonna venture to say it's probably safer for a black person to cross the street in Riyadh than in Sacramento.
Just a hunch.

[El Kabong]

"Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses...."

Omar Mateen was an American with Muslim parents, who emigrated to the States almost 4 decades ago.

Every example of naturalized citizens you so gleefully post were just that..... naturalized citizens.

But let's remove all immigrants from the picture as far as the American culture argument goes, so we don't have any bias one way or the other.
What does that leave us? A handful of Indians?

What is America (or rather... the United States... because the term "America" technically includes the entire hemisphere), but a conglomerate of vast groups of immigrants who migrated at one point or another in history. Italians, Irish, Africans, Puerto Ricans, Cubans, Asian, so on and so forth, etc, etc, etc. Hell...... even MUSLIMS!!

How are we managing to throw dividing lines here to claim culture superiority, when the U.S. is truly a melting pot of different cultures, all rolled into one.

Further yet..... what clear and correct vantage point do we have to claim that the atrocities committed by groups of misguided souls actually represent the culture of an entire people or nation?? If you can answer that question truthfully and without bias, be my guest.

But let's forget about the Mateen's of the world. How about good ol' American names..... like Timothy McVeigh? John Allen Williams? Seung-Hui Cho? (Oops.... he's of Asian descent. Damn that Asian culture..... they are hereby deemed inferior). James Eagan Holmes? Wade Michael Page? Frazier Glenn Miller Jr.? David Koresh?

I could go on but what's the point. Many of these are anti-government, or white supremacists, or neo-Nazis, or all of the above.

Do they represent the majority of Americ..... er.....United States citizens? Of course not. Just like the "gay-throwing mobs" in the Middle East are not representative of that culture. They're deluded fanatics, just like those in the United States.

For all the advancements and freedoms enjoyed by the average Mr. White in Everytown, USA...... there's still a lot of social ills that could be used to point fingers at the (ahem) culture. How about the apparent new penalty for jaywalking in Sacramento, California (if you happen to be black)? What is it..... body-slam to the concrete, followed by 20 punches to the head... is that it?

I don't want to go out on a limb here...... but I'm gonna venture to say it's probably safer for a black person to cross the street in Riyadh than in Sacramento.
Just a hunch.

"There once was a man from Nantucket...."....I can recite parts of poems too ya know


Ah yes, Omar Mateen had what kind of parents? Oh that's right MUSLIM parents and 1 specifically, his father Mir Seddique Mateen apparently had some CULTURAL feelings about gays saying in a video (and I quote): "Allah will punish those involved in homosexuality," & "not an issue that humans should deal with."....yes oh so All-American almost like The Cleavers on Leave It To Beaver ....his father was PRO-Taliban dude....oh pshaw, that's like being in the Neighborhood Watch, it's as American as apple pie by golly


This isn't an argument about immigration, if you want to mention the Muslims who immigrate and DON'T shoot shit up or blow things up then please I beg you do so. I'm not saying they are incapable of assimilation to Western society, quite a few are. Ayaan Hirsi Ali, Bridgitte Gabriel, Salman Rushdie....there's plenty who adapt pretty well and let people live their lives without murdering people. Did the Chinese murder people? Did the Irish? Did the Jews? Did the Italians? Did the Germans (even in WW1 & 2 they didn't do that shit!!!) Did the Japanese (NO! and they were locked up in WW2!!!)? Who blows people up and beheads people? Militant Islamists AND Cartel members from Mexico/Central America.....soooo yeah let's try to remember this going forward shall we?

Assimilation into the American/Western culture leads to this Melting pot you're crying about. Yeah, Americans want people who come to America to like their freedoms, enjoy their freedoms, appreciate that people fought and died to limit government and allow them the ability to think, act, do for themselves rather than dictate to them what is and is not acceptable. Problem is, some folks cling real tight to the beliefs of religious groups or political groups and when that happens there' friction.


The black person in Sacramento probably hadn't been castrated or been called "Slave" (in Arabic "Abed"...and yes that's still a term used to this day)...but hey let's move some folks to Riyadh where the penalty for stealing (I know, it's not jaywalking) is cutting off your hand...and as mentioned before, sure it's NOT jaywalking but women wearing pants, they get lashes.....for wearing pants dude.


"It's safer for a black person to cross the street in Riyadh" ....fucking ridiculous on it's face....yeah it was hella safe for the millions of black slaves who were castrated when they were taken to Saudi Arabia.....oh yeah, by the way....


Slavery is STILL A THING there .....but yeah we just can't tell which culture is better or worse, it's #unpossible

[brocktonblockbust]

No. No. No. No

Omar Mateen WAS NOT AN AMERICAN

BELIEVE ME.

[El Kabong]

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/ariana-g...di-isis-claim/

23-year-old Salman Abedi.....just your average Briton really, fish & chips enthusiast, loved a game of footie (so long as no women were playing) Inch Allah....just your average run of the mill English "Lad"

[TitoFan]

Let me clear up a misconception you seem to have, Lyle.
Ready?


ISIS isn't a culture.


Yes, I know.... unbelievable, huh.

Regardless of their lofty title (State, indeed....), it's nothing more than a bunch of barbaric, overzealous thugs claiming that they represent a real culture. They don't. This fact alone crumbles all the examples you so gleefully trot out there to make your point.

[El Kabong]

Let me clear up a misconception you seem to have, Lyle.
Ready?


ISIS isn't a culture.


Yes, I know.... unbelievable, huh.

Regardless of their lofty title (State, indeed....), it's nothing more than a bunch of barbaric, overzealous thugs claiming that they represent a real culture. They don't. This fact alone crumbles all the examples you so gleefully trot out there to make your point.

Oh it's "unbelievable" alright.....I bring up Saudi Arabia ISIS isn't a culture., I bring up Indonesia ISIS isn't a culture., I bring up Syria ISIS isn't a culture., I bring up Bangladesh ISIS isn't a culture., I bring up the Taliban ISIS isn't a culture. ....unbelievable doesn't even begin to describe it TitoFan, it's fucking sad that this is how far one will go to simply disagree with me. It's sad.


Keep those eyes closed, pay no attention to any terrorist attacks of the past 20 or so years, it's NOT Islam, I mean how could we ever tell? How can we tell? it's impossible to tell.


Who is throwing gays off of roofs?

IT'S IMPOSSIBLE TO TELL

Who is caning women who wear pants?

IT'S IMPOSSIBLE TO TELL

Who is chopping heads off of non-believer infidels?

IT'S IMPOSSIBLE TO TELL


Maybe YOU personally feel better thinking IT'S IMPOSSIBLE TO TELL if one culture is better than another, but I am betting if you were personally faced with the situation of being gay or a woman in one of those nations, you MIGHT, MAYBE, POSSIBLY have different feelings....but hell what am I saying? IT'S IMPOSSIBLE TO TELL