Who's The Best

[GaMo]

Honestly, I don't recall Roy ever cleaning out a division

He held just about every belt available at 175
He held the WBC, WBA, IBF, IBO, IBF, WBF, IBA
And Ring Magazine titles at Light-Heavyweight
The WBO and WBU are the only belts he didn't own
But he was quite clearly the man at 175.

Darius was the lineal champ and they shared the division and Roy never beat him. Do I think Roy would have beaten him? Yes. But that doesn't change the fact that he didn't clean the division out. Hagler, Hopkins, JCC, Duran, Joe Louis, Mike Tyson, Lennox Lewis...etc., all cleaned their divisions out.

Michalczewski never fought outside of Europe
And Boxing in Germany during the 90s was so corrupt
Just look at Sven Ottke's career and you'll see it
Biased refereeing and blind judges.

I'm sure Roy would've welcomed him in America
But after the Olympics Roy wasn't keen on traveling
And Germany was the last place you'd want to go back then.

[mikeeod]

Honestly, I don't recall Roy ever cleaning out a division

He held just about every belt available at 175
He held the WBC, WBA, IBF, IBO, IBF, WBF, IBA
And Ring Magazine titles at Light-Heavyweight
The WBO and WBU are the only belts he didn't own
But he was quite clearly the man at 175.

Darius was the lineal champ and they shared the division and Roy never beat him. Do I think Roy would have beaten him? Yes. But that doesn't change the fact that he didn't clean the division out. Hagler, Hopkins, JCC, Duran, Joe Louis, Mike Tyson, Lennox Lewis...etc., all cleaned their divisions out.

Michalczewski never fought outside of Europe
And Boxing in Germany during the 90s was so corrupt
Just look at Sven Ottke's career and you'll see it
Biased refereeing and blind judges.

I'm sure Roy would've welcomed him in America
But after the Olympics Roy wasn't keen on traveling
And Germany was the last place you'd want to go back then.

Not saying you are wrong on your points, but fact still remains that he never cleaned out the division. Was the same thing at 160 and 168 as well. I thought Roy was clearly the best, but you still have to beat the other top fighters in your division to prove it. I thought GMan was by far the better fighter than Nigel Benn, and look how that turned out. Same with Tyson vs. Douglas. Just because you are favored or are perceived to be the guaranteed winner doesn't mean that it is a foregone conclusion.

[GaMo]

Honestly, I don't recall Roy ever cleaning out a division

He held just about every belt available at 175
He held the WBC, WBA, IBF, IBO, IBF, WBF, IBA
And Ring Magazine titles at Light-Heavyweight
The WBO and WBU are the only belts he didn't own
But he was quite clearly the man at 175.

Darius was the lineal champ and they shared the division and Roy never beat him. Do I think Roy would have beaten him? Yes. But that doesn't change the fact that he didn't clean the division out. Hagler, Hopkins, JCC, Duran, Joe Louis, Mike Tyson, Lennox Lewis...etc., all cleaned their divisions out.

Michalczewski never fought outside of Europe
And Boxing in Germany during the 90s was so corrupt
Just look at Sven Ottke's career and you'll see it
Biased refereeing and blind judges.

I'm sure Roy would've welcomed him in America
But after the Olympics Roy wasn't keen on traveling
And Germany was the last place you'd want to go back then.

Not saying you are wrong on your points, but fact still remains that he never cleaned out the division. Was the same thing at 160 and 168 as well. I thought Roy was clearly the best, but you still have to beat the other top fighters in your division to prove it. I thought GMan was by far the better fighter than Nigel Benn, and look how that turned out. Same with Tyson vs. Douglas. Just because you are favored or are perceived to be the guaranteed winner doesn't mean that it is a foregone conclusion.

He definitely didn't clean out 160, 168 or Heavyweight
But he beat the best at 168 (Toney) and the best at 160 (Hopkins)
Guys like Eubank and Benn never seemed in a rush to fight him
Ottke and Calzaghe never left home. At 175 Jones was the man
So much so that I think he'd have an easy night with Andre Ward.

[mikeeod]

Honestly, I don't recall Roy ever cleaning out a division

He held just about every belt available at 175
He held the WBC, WBA, IBF, IBO, IBF, WBF, IBA
And Ring Magazine titles at Light-Heavyweight
The WBO and WBU are the only belts he didn't own
But he was quite clearly the man at 175.

Darius was the lineal champ and they shared the division and Roy never beat him. Do I think Roy would have beaten him? Yes. But that doesn't change the fact that he didn't clean the division out. Hagler, Hopkins, JCC, Duran, Joe Louis, Mike Tyson, Lennox Lewis...etc., all cleaned their divisions out.

Michalczewski never fought outside of Europe
And Boxing in Germany during the 90s was so corrupt
Just look at Sven Ottke's career and you'll see it
Biased refereeing and blind judges.

I'm sure Roy would've welcomed him in America
But after the Olympics Roy wasn't keen on traveling
And Germany was the last place you'd want to go back then.

Not saying you are wrong on your points, but fact still remains that he never cleaned out the division. Was the same thing at 160 and 168 as well. I thought Roy was clearly the best, but you still have to beat the other top fighters in your division to prove it. I thought GMan was by far the better fighter than Nigel Benn, and look how that turned out. Same with Tyson vs. Douglas. Just because you are favored or are perceived to be the guaranteed winner doesn't mean that it is a foregone conclusion.

He definitely didn't clean out 160, 168 or Heavyweight
But he beat the best at 168 (Toney) and the best at 160 (Hopkins)
Guys like Eubank and Benn never seemed in a rush to fight him
Ottke and Calzaghe never left home. At 175 Jones was the man
So much so that I think he'd have an easy night with Andre Ward.

Agree with most of what you say. I think Ward is the modern day Hopkins, so again, I don't think Roy is a guaranteed winner or has an easy night with Ward. Ward and Hop both are masters at shutting down the other guy's offense and making him fight an uncomfortable fight. Ward is bigger than Hop, so that makes it even more difficult for Roy. Would be a great match up in my opinion.

[Fenster]

He definitely didn't clean out 160, 168 or Heavyweight
But he beat the best at 168 (Toney) and the best at 160 (Hopkins)
Guys like Eubank and Benn never seemed in a rush to fight him
Ottke and Calzaghe never left home. At 175 Jones was the man
So much so that I think he'd have an easy night with Andre Ward.

Roy never left home either (forget the excuses, I know them all, just stating a fact). The only reason he had the IBF/WBA titles at LH was because Michalczewski was stripped after beating Hill. The Ring changed their rules to gift/promote Roy.

So unless you believe Americans should get special dispensation for being American Roy should have travelled to challenge the true champ - Michalczewski.

[GaMo]

He definitely didn't clean out 160, 168 or Heavyweight
But he beat the best at 168 (Toney) and the best at 160 (Hopkins)
Guys like Eubank and Benn never seemed in a rush to fight him
Ottke and Calzaghe never left home. At 175 Jones was the man
So much so that I think he'd have an easy night with Andre Ward.

Roy never left home either (forget the excuses, I know them all, just stating a fact). The only reason he had the IBF/WBA titles at LH was because Michalczewski was stripped after beating Hill. The Ring changed their rules to gift/promote Roy.

So unless you believe Americans should get special dispensation for being American Roy should have travelled to challenge the true champ - Michalczewski.

Fair point but like I said, Germany was corrupt back then
Extremely bad judging and unprofessional refereeing
Meant that Jones would have to have scored a knockout to win.

Just look at Sven Ottke's unbeaten title reign as an example

[Fenster]

He definitely didn't clean out 160, 168 or Heavyweight
But he beat the best at 168 (Toney) and the best at 160 (Hopkins)
Guys like Eubank and Benn never seemed in a rush to fight him
Ottke and Calzaghe never left home. At 175 Jones was the man
So much so that I think he'd have an easy night with Andre Ward.

Roy never left home either (forget the excuses, I know them all, just stating a fact). The only reason he had the IBF/WBA titles at LH was because Michalczewski was stripped after beating Hill. The Ring changed their rules to gift/promote Roy.

So unless you believe Americans should get special dispensation for being American Roy should have travelled to challenge the true champ - Michalczewski.

Fair point but like I said, Germany was corrupt back then
Extremely bad judging and unprofessional refereeing
Meant that Jones would have to have scored a knockout to win.

Just look at Sven Ottke's unbeaten title reign as an example

I've seen a few Ottke "robberies" that weren't robberies, they were close/debatable decisions that he had every right to win. People claim "robbery" about disputed decisions week in week out, especially when they haven't seen the fights they're talking about.

Foreign fighters in America claim it's corrupt/inept when they lose too.

[GaMo]

Leonard is leading this poll but isn't surprising
But you could argue that he lost to Hagler (I had it a draw)
And that he lost the return with Hearns (I think he did)
So he could actually be 3-3 against Hagler, Hearns and Duran.

[Spicoli]

Leonard benefited and thrived in a legendary era, cliché but he clashed with like minded greats and that tips it for me. Mayweather became more of a chorographer in career and actual bouts sometimes felt secondary especially after Hatton and wtf retirement. Look only couple weeks ago. Tremendous boxer but a piss attitude and hardly pushed beyond 'just getting the w' at least to me. Somewhere along the line we started hearing..mainly in mma friendly lead up and post Mcgregor..oh he's the best boxer ever and pointing to being 50-0. Roy was a reflex phenome and superb athlete but as has been mentioned he really did have a silver platter and a very very cushy network contract at the time. They basically rotated some very thin 'mandatories' sprinkled in with an early version of Hopkins, a Toney who looked and acted like he was psyched out before the bell even rang and a Virgil Hill. Those were top notch wins and he embarrassed Toney and Toney deserved it but where Jones holds those as 'best' wins they don't tend to be blemishes for a Toney or a Hopkins. Not really. The did very well improved afterwards, specifically Hopkins. He beat good fighter for sure, Griffin, Harding, Tate, and Johnson. Jones had company at 168 and frankly he had zero interest in cleaning house. For one he didn't have to and hindsight being 20-20 so many now say 'well he would have cruised Benn or Eubank or Michalczewski. I'm not so easily convinced and we'll never know. There was noooo chance HBO was going to do business with Showtime for fans to see either. To some degree I may hold him still fighting against him. It's farcical and damn dangerous. Then again a shot ghost of Leonard was being ko'd by Camacho so there's that .

[GaMo]

He definitely didn't clean out 160, 168 or Heavyweight
But he beat the best at 168 (Toney) and the best at 160 (Hopkins)
Guys like Eubank and Benn never seemed in a rush to fight him
Ottke and Calzaghe never left home. At 175 Jones was the man
So much so that I think he'd have an easy night with Andre Ward.

Roy never left home either (forget the excuses, I know them all, just stating a fact). The only reason he had the IBF/WBA titles at LH was because Michalczewski was stripped after beating Hill. The Ring changed their rules to gift/promote Roy.

So unless you believe Americans should get special dispensation for being American Roy should have travelled to challenge the true champ - Michalczewski.

Fair point but like I said, Germany was corrupt back then
Extremely bad judging and unprofessional refereeing
Meant that Jones would have to have scored a knockout to win.

Just look at Sven Ottke's unbeaten title reign as an example

I've seen a few Ottke "robberies" that weren't robberies, they were close/debatable decisions that he had every right to win. People claim "robbery" about disputed decisions week in week out, especially when they haven't seen the fights they're talking about.

Foreign fighters in America claim it's corrupt/inept when they lose too.

It's been a while since I have seen these fights
So maybe you're correct but I seem to remember
Robin Reid knocking him down and it getting ruled a slip
Then Reid losing two or three points for nothing
Didn't he actually get warned at one stage for punching?
Like I said it's been a while so I could be wrong
I actually remember Reid beating both Ottke and Calzaghe.

[Dark Lord Al]

For talent ,achievement and power this guy was better than all 3.
He once floored David Haye something Wlad could not do.

[erics44]

Leonard will win this poll, boxing fans are very nostaligic

in reality he would lose to both jones and mayweather by some margin

[Master]

Leonard will win this poll, boxing fans are very nostaligic

in reality he would lose to both jones and mayweather by some margin

Leonard wins because he is really is the best not because of nostalgia. I am not even a fan of his but even I realise that he is one of the greatest fighters in the history of the game. His accomplishments in the ring are better than Jones and Floyd.

[Fenster]

Leonard will win this poll, boxing fans are very nostaligic

in reality he would lose to both jones and mayweather by some margin

Roy might have beat him as he's naturally bigger.

Floyd? No way. He was at his best below welter.

Prime Oscar and Mosley would have beat Floyd at welter too let alone Ray.

[erics44]

Leonard will win this poll, boxing fans are very nostaligic

in reality he would lose to both jones and mayweather by some margin

Roy might have beat him as he's naturally bigger.

Floyd? No way. He was at his best below welter.

Prime Oscar and Mosley would have beat Floyd at welter too let alone Ray.

thought we were talking lb4lb?