Vasyl Lomachenko v Jorge Linares on May 12th NYC

[Spicoli]

I am a Linares fan and hope he wins but I think he is going to get cut up and lose.

You may very well be right. I'll be rooting for Linares, though. I'd love to see a lid put on this ridiculously premature p4p frenzy that's accompanied Loma since his 4th or 5th pro fight.

Loma deserves credit for what he has done so far, I will not criticise him for that.

I would agree with Ron, that Garcia has been avoided by Linares whilst he cashed in against our Brits who are not on the level of him, Loma or Garcia.

I'm not denying or knocking Loma's skill. It just bugs me that in professional boxing, he got the proverbial "Advance to GO... Collect $200" card (from the classic Monopoly game). Anybody who gets to fight for a professional title in his 2nd pro fight is at the very least going to get a raised eyebrow. Then again, I'll grant that he's fought quality guys right off the bat, unlike a couple of well-known entities who began fighting live bodies after about 40 pro fights. I'm a fan of the traditional way... bringing the guy up steadily until he's fighting for a title after about 13-20 pro fights, give or take a few.

Again I say who wants to see Loma beat 13-20 "bodies" the fact that he went straight for top fighters shows he is an exceptional and skilled boxer.

How he got handed a title fight in his 2nd pro fight is what I don't like. To each his own. Too many fighters spend years toiling away to get a shot to have a prima donna waltz in and get a title shot immediately.
He could've fought 13-20 good fighters on his way to a title shot.
Geez... at least 10. Build up the interest the normal way.

I agree with the microwaved red carpet treatment and never a fan of it. It's not a matter of if a guy can come right out and win what are essentially interchangeable trinkets now. It's the fact that you earn your spot, you do the time regardless of some amateur ranks and it goes to network exposure, purses and simply plying a trade. It's the nature of the business and the beast. Loma or anyone else fighting 5,10,20 fights before making the massive network stage and having a shot assumes all rungs in the ladder are just stiffs and cans and that's seldom the case. Well unless you're a Wilder maybe but I digress . It has always rubbed me as shortcutting a fighter based as much on a record that no longer applies nearly as much as talents. No of course I'm not saying Loma is not phenomenal and very talented, but he was afforded the exception and I don't doubt others could have done the same trinket collecting if they were as well. It's also much better for the fans to see a guy develop and face much variety, frankly be seen on a normal stage in process. Just unrealistic to 'skip' grades Imo. The BIG names will not always get the BIG names and a title doesn't need to be involved all the time. I wasn't a fan of Oscar but I think they had a great blue print for him coming out of Olympics and introduction to fan base and wide exposure. He went through riding deep undercards and multiple networks people have not heard of and opposition leveled up almost in same time span as Loma. And he also ran into a few bumps in the road vs a couple of those 'cans' and fans got to enjoy it more. Just my opinion.

[Alpha]

I don't mind guys getting title shots early in a career as long as they earn it. If you want a title shot in your second fight then you should need to beat the #1 ranked guy or the mandatory, otherwise get in line. This is boxing tho and you can grease palms to get anything you want.

[TitoFan]

I am a Linares fan and hope he wins but I think he is going to get cut up and lose.

You may very well be right. I'll be rooting for Linares, though. I'd love to see a lid put on this ridiculously premature p4p frenzy that's accompanied Loma since his 4th or 5th pro fight.

Loma deserves credit for what he has done so far, I will not criticise him for that.

I would agree with Ron, that Garcia has been avoided by Linares whilst he cashed in against our Brits who are not on the level of him, Loma or Garcia.

I'm not denying or knocking Loma's skill. It just bugs me that in professional boxing, he got the proverbial "Advance to GO... Collect $200" card (from the classic Monopoly game). Anybody who gets to fight for a professional title in his 2nd pro fight is at the very least going to get a raised eyebrow. Then again, I'll grant that he's fought quality guys right off the bat, unlike a couple of well-known entities who began fighting live bodies after about 40 pro fights. I'm a fan of the traditional way... bringing the guy up steadily until he's fighting for a title after about 13-20 pro fights, give or take a few.

Again I say who wants to see Loma beat 13-20 "bodies" the fact that he went straight for top fighters shows he is an exceptional and skilled boxer.

How he got handed a title fight in his 2nd pro fight is what I don't like. To each his own. Too many fighters spend years toiling away to get a shot to have a prima donna waltz in and get a title shot immediately.
He could've fought 13-20 good fighters on his way to a title shot.
Geez... at least 10. Build up the interest the normal way.

I agree with the microwaved red carpet treatment and never a fan of it. It's not a matter of if a guy can come right out and win what are essentially interchangeable trinkets now. It's the fact that you earn your spot, you do the time regardless of some amateur ranks and it goes to network exposure, purses and simply plying a trade. It's the nature of the business and the beast. Loma or anyone else fighting 5,10,20 fights before making the massive network stage and having a shot assumes all rungs in the ladder are just stiffs and cans and that's seldom the case. Well unless you're a Wilder maybe but I digress . It has always rubbed me as shortcutting a fighter based as much on a record that no longer applies nearly as much as talents. No of course I'm not saying Loma is not phenomenal and very talented, but he was afforded the exception and I don't doubt others could have done the same trinket collecting if they were as well. It's also much better for the fans to see a guy develop and face much variety, frankly be seen on a normal stage in process. Just unrealistic to 'skip' grades Imo. The BIG names will not always get the BIG names and a title doesn't need to be involved all the time. I wasn't a fan of Oscar but I think they had a great blue print for him coming out of Olympics and introduction to fan base and wide exposure. He went through riding deep undercards and multiple networks people have not heard of and opposition leveled up almost in same time span as Loma. And he also ran into a few bumps in the road vs a couple of those 'cans' and fans got to enjoy it more. Just my opinion.

Exactly my point. Only better explained.

[El Kabong]

Woah woah woah, @TitoFan where's the hate for Gulliermo Rigondeaux or Zhou Shiming? Those guys just tore up the Olympics and ended up getting title shots really quick too....but Loma is the guy you don't respect for going immediately for the titles, why?

I like Lomachenko, I really want him to fight as much as possible because he's an amazing talent and his style is incredible. He should win going away and I hope he does. Loma is an amazing talent.

[TitoFan]

Woah woah woah, @TitoFan where's the hate for Gulliermo Rigondeaux or Zhou Shiming? Those guys just tore up the Olympics and ended up getting title shots really quick too....but Loma is the guy you don't respect for going immediately for the titles, why?

I like Lomachenko, I really want him to fight as much as possible because he's an amazing talent and his style is incredible. He should win going away and I hope he does. Loma is an amazing talent.

Same goes for both, especially Shiming, who's all of 9-2 and has already been a (cough) world champion. That's just me. I'm sure there's plenty of fans who don't mind the shortcut treatment. I'll give Loma this, at least he didn't start off his first 30 professional fights fighting cadavers, ala Canelo. I think you have it all wrong. I don't "disrespect" Loma for..... and I quote..... "going immediately for the titles". I'd bet more than a handful of guys, coming off the amateurs, are probably full of themselves enough that they'll take a title fight 1 or 2 fights into their pro careers if you grant it to them. As was said by another poster, it's something that should be earned, not given to you because of all the amateur career buildup/hype. Hell... Loma will probably end up being an ATG before it's all over. But IMO, he shouldn't have been granted a world title fight in his 2nd pro contest.

[El Kabong]

Same goes for both, especially Shiming, who's all of 9-2 and has already been a (cough) world champion. That's just me. I'm sure there's plenty of fans who don't mind the shortcut treatment. I'll give Loma this, at least he didn't start off his first 30 professional fights fighting cadavers, ala Canelo. I think you have it all wrong. I don't "disrespect" Loma for..... and I quote..... "going immediately for the titles". I'd bet more than a handful of guys, coming off the amateurs, are probably full of themselves enough that they'll take a title fight 1 or 2 fights into their pro careers if you grant it to them. As was said by another poster, it's something that should be earned, not given to you because of all the amateur career buildup/hype. Hell... Loma will probably end up being an ATG before it's all over. But IMO, he shouldn't have been granted a world title fight in his 2nd pro contest.

Well you're nothing if not consistent, so that is all I was worried about. I think if a fighter is ready for the big leagues then he's ready for the big leagues and there's no need to risk damaging him in unnecessary fights if he's already ready to contend for a title. That's the trouble with boxing, you see some fighters get rushed and some fighters take it too slow and you're left wondering "What could have been?" in both cases.


Is Shiming even still fighting at this point? He's been out since his TKO loss in July of 2017.


Lomachenko is a dominant fighter very impressive to watch him work.

[Alpha]

Same goes for both, especially Shiming, who's all of 9-2 and has already been a (cough) world champion. That's just me. I'm sure there's plenty of fans who don't mind the shortcut treatment. I'll give Loma this, at least he didn't start off his first 30 professional fights fighting cadavers, ala Canelo. I think you have it all wrong. I don't "disrespect" Loma for..... and I quote..... "going immediately for the titles". I'd bet more than a handful of guys, coming off the amateurs, are probably full of themselves enough that they'll take a title fight 1 or 2 fights into their pro careers if you grant it to them. As was said by another poster, it's something that should be earned, not given to you because of all the amateur career buildup/hype. Hell... Loma will probably end up being an ATG before it's all over. But IMO, he shouldn't have been granted a world title fight in his 2nd pro contest.

Well you're nothing if not consistent, so that is all I was worried about. I think if a fighter is ready for the big leagues then he's ready for the big leagues and there's no need to risk damaging him in unnecessary fights if he's already ready to contend for a title. That's the trouble with boxing, you see some fighters get rushed and some fighters take it too slow and you're left wondering "What could have been?" in both cases.


Is Shiming even still fighting at this point? He's been out since his TKO loss in July of 2017.


Lomachenko is a dominant fighter very impressive to watch him work.

Yea I like to see young guys moved fast, the Japanese are great at testing their prospects. There are also many guys from other nations being moved fast at the moment. Not getting a title shot in their 2nd fight fast but stepping up in competition.

I don't mind a fighter getting a title shot in their 2nd fight if they are ready and capable, although I feel it's unfair to those fighters who have fought (paid) their way into the rankings, especially #1 rated guy or the mandatory.

[TitoFan]

Same goes for both, especially Shiming, who's all of 9-2 and has already been a (cough) world champion. That's just me. I'm sure there's plenty of fans who don't mind the shortcut treatment. I'll give Loma this, at least he didn't start off his first 30 professional fights fighting cadavers, ala Canelo. I think you have it all wrong. I don't "disrespect" Loma for..... and I quote..... "going immediately for the titles". I'd bet more than a handful of guys, coming off the amateurs, are probably full of themselves enough that they'll take a title fight 1 or 2 fights into their pro careers if you grant it to them. As was said by another poster, it's something that should be earned, not given to you because of all the amateur career buildup/hype. Hell... Loma will probably end up being an ATG before it's all over. But IMO, he shouldn't have been granted a world title fight in his 2nd pro contest.

Well you're nothing if not consistent, so that is all I was worried about. I think if a fighter is ready for the big leagues then he's ready for the big leagues and there's no need to risk damaging him in unnecessary fights if he's already ready to contend for a title. That's the trouble with boxing, you see some fighters get rushed and some fighters take it too slow and you're left wondering "What could have been?" in both cases.


Is Shiming even still fighting at this point? He's been out since his TKO loss in July of 2017.


Lomachenko is a dominant fighter very impressive to watch him work.

Yea I like to see young guys moved fast, the Japanese are great at testing their prospects. There are also many guys from other nations being moved fast at the moment. Not getting a title shot in their 2nd fight fast but stepping up in competition.

I don't mind a fighter getting a title shot in their 2nd fight if they are ready and capable, although I feel it's unfair to those fighters who have fought (paid) their way into the rankings, especially #1 rated guy or the mandatory.

TBH guys, I'd rather a fighter be moved along a little "too fast" than "too slow". I'm dead set against the practice of fattening a guy's record just for the sake of the number. 40-0 means zilch, nada, zero.... if it consists of a bunch of nobodies. Especially when it happens in the friendly confines of your own backyard, where you're going to get all sorts of shady decisions to keep you on track. Guys that venture out of their hometown only after having fought about 30 times. I much prefer those who are traveling early in their careers, sometimes to meet elite fighters or champions in their home towns or countries. In the end, Lomachenko will prove his handlers right.... he may already have. But I still like the traditional way of bringing up fighters, regardless of their amateur careers. Loma is one of those notable exceptions. Alpha makes an interesting point. There are other nations who are bringing up their guys rather quickly. From what I've seen, there are different tendencies as far as this is concerned in different countries. In some, fighters with 10 pro fights are already fighting elite competition. In others, fighters with 30 pro fights are still fighting guys making their pro debuts, or with lousy W-L records.