Ray Robinson vs Bob Fitzsimmons (catchweight at 152)

[Master]

Robinson, what did Bob achieve at that weight?

He was 150 when he demolished Dempsey Sr. He didn’t weigh much more when he became heavyweight champion of the world by beating Corbett or when, past his prime he went life and death with a prime Jeffries. He weighed around that much when he KOed 300 pound Ed Dunkorst in the first round. He probably also weighed around this much when he KOed 7 men who all weighed 200+ pounds in 10 rounds, the largest of whom was 6’7” 240 pounds and got KOed in the first round.

Could you argue the same thing for Stanley Ketchel and what he did to Jack Johnson?

[Yuzo]

theres an excerpt in haislet's book about how the boxing stance exists as such in the way that it does to accommodate right hand hitting. that is, that the right hand punch is what came first, and that the boxing stance evolved out of necessity next. he says, "for any movement of the right hand in which power is needed, it is only natural to stand with the left foot forward. it is the natural movement in all throwing events, and it is the position of the blacksmith when swinging a sledge." i always thought this was a reference to bob fitzsimmons.



now then, if the right hand is the original punch, the first punch, then all things, including the boxing stance itself, must exist only as supplementary parts which all ultimately lead back to this basic idea of right hand hitting. that would include the jab. in this view, the jab would have evolved after the right hand, and, like the boxing stance, would exist solely to accommodate it.

if this is the true essence of what boxing is deep down at its core, it should be easy to imagine bob fitzsimmons, standing there in his stance with his jab and his right hand, as a living manifestation of boxing itself.

then there is sugar ray robinson and his lead left hook.



lead is the important distinction to make here, as it implies there is nothing to set it up. that is, that it exists unto itself, not as a supplement to any other thing. this tells you something bigger about what sugar ray robinson actually is.

i think that when you ask the question who wins bob fitzsimmons or sugar ray robinson, what you are really asking is, is it the right hand or is it the lead left hook, and everything that ultimately represents about what boxing actually is. i think that is a very interesting question, and i have not found the answer to it, if you understand what i mean by that.

[Slim the BoxingManiac]

I think if there were anybody able to knock out SRR itd probably be Bob. Dude had an excellent chin and his mastered craft makes me think he'd probably get a decision tho.