Why does Wilder continue to get so much flak?

[Alpha]

I'll enjoy the Wilder ride while it lasts. I actually think he knocks out Fury in a rematch. I still think Usyk causes him all kinds of issues.

[TitoFan]

Boxing is unique and peculiar among sports in the following way:

Wilder knocks out Luis Ortiz in two of his last four fights, and continues to get all sorts of hate.

Fury beats "Tom and Otto" after facing Wilder (and "Sefer and Francesco" before facing Wilder), and continues to have fans fawn all over him.

Go figure.

[powerpuncher]

I guess the question is who on this board thinks that Wilder is an elite fighter? I don’t think that anybody does. I know a lot of casuals do because they don’t really watch boxing, but saying that Wilder isn’t that skilled and would lose to HWs of the past is just preaching to the choir here. Nobody here believes that he is some sort of ATG fighter.

So putting aside what others say about him, what is everyone’s opinion on him? I think that we would all come up with about the same idea. The difference is if we think he beats or loses to Fury or AJ/Ruiz

[p4pking]

I think most of it comes down to his personality, or at least the way he presents it. Of course he lacks skills, but if he were an entirely different character and was honest about that, most people who bash him would probably cheer him on. Suppose for a second he had a Glen Johnson kind of attitude/way of speaking about himself. The fact is his flaws don't make him bad to watch. It's going to be must see viewing any time he fights a top opponent because you just never know if/when he'll land that eraser. For my money he also has gotten a lot better at delivering it. You look at his last few KOs or the knockdowns against Fury, and as much as he was shown up for long stretches of the fights, when he does land there is nothing wild or amateurish about it. Bringing up Oliver McCall, Mercer, Tua etc are extreme examples and of course would be real bad match ups for him, but surely it's to his credit you have to dig up guys that he wouldn't have every chance of flattening? Look how people still talk about Earnie Shavers, who only had a right hand, wasn't any more sound technically than Wilder and to boot couldn't really take a punch.

[powerpuncher]

I think most of it comes down to his personality, or at least the way he presents it. Of course he lacks skills, but if he were an entirely different character and was honest about that, most people who bash him would probably cheer him on. Suppose for a second he had a Glen Johnson kind of attitude/way of speaking about himself. The fact is his flaws don't make him bad to watch. It's going to be must see viewing any time he fights a top opponent because you just never know if/when he'll land that eraser. For my money he also has gotten a lot better at delivering it. You look at his last few KOs or the knockdowns against Fury, and as much as he was shown up for long stretches of the fights, when he does land there is nothing wild or amateurish about it. Bringing up Oliver McCall, Mercer, Tua etc are extreme examples and of course would be real bad match ups for him, but surely it's to his credit you have to dig up guys that he wouldn't have every chance of flattening? Look how people still talk about Earnie Shavers, who only had a right hand, wasn't any more sound technically than Wilder and to boot couldn't really take a punch.

But people only talk about Shavers because of his power and not his greatness. It’s more than likely that Shavers could do the same thing that Wilder is doing now in the current division and people would be clamoring about his power and dominance too.

[p4pking]

I think Ortiz or Fury would have beat the shit out of or stopped Shavers myself, but that wasn't my point. Not saying Wilder is a great, only that the reason people dont like him is because they don't personally. In the ring he is good to watch and his power is fun. He'll be talked about, especially if he keeps going and adds a few more displays of power at a high level.

[TIC]

he finds that sweet spot. however flawed he is, he gets it done. when the time comes and someone avoids that power, it'll be an embarrasing defeat

[Fenster]

I think most of it comes down to his personality, or at least the way he presents it. Of course he lacks skills, but if he were an entirely different character and was honest about that, most people who bash him would probably cheer him on. Suppose for a second he had a Glen Johnson kind of attitude/way of speaking about himself. The fact is his flaws don't make him bad to watch. It's going to be must see viewing any time he fights a top opponent because you just never know if/when he'll land that eraser. For my money he also has gotten a lot better at delivering it. You look at his last few KOs or the knockdowns against Fury, and as much as he was shown up for long stretches of the fights, when he does land there is nothing wild or amateurish about it. Bringing up Oliver McCall, Mercer, Tua etc are extreme examples and of course would be real bad match ups for him, but surely it's to his credit you have to dig up guys that he wouldn't have every chance of flattening? Look how people still talk about Earnie Shavers, who only had a right hand, wasn't any more sound technically than Wilder and to boot couldn't really take a punch.

My point with the iron chins is - they weren't the elite of their time yet I struggle to see Wilder beating them, however, bizarrely I give him more chance against Lennox, Holyfield, Tyson and Bowe (*wait up, wait up). Wilder's power isn't up for debate, imo, he would have been dangerous in any era, however, ironing out Ortiz is quite simply not enough to be in a "greatest ever puncher" conversation (*for what it's worth I think the elite guys would've ironed him out 9 and half out of 10).

There's about a dozen current heavyweights who are serious challenges for Wilder - Uysk, Povetkin, Whyte, Parker, Ruiz, Joshua, even Rivas, Chisora, Pulev, Kownacki, Hunter - maybe he blows them all away, great, he should currently start favourite over all, but just add some funking substance to the hype.

Who anointed Ortiz superior to that lot? Who did he ever beat? (i'm not saying Ortiz is any worst than that lot either... apart from Uysk, of course, who is P4P level)

[p4pking]

I think most of it comes down to his personality, or at least the way he presents it. Of course he lacks skills, but if he were an entirely different character and was honest about that, most people who bash him would probably cheer him on. Suppose for a second he had a Glen Johnson kind of attitude/way of speaking about himself. The fact is his flaws don't make him bad to watch. It's going to be must see viewing any time he fights a top opponent because you just never know if/when he'll land that eraser. For my money he also has gotten a lot better at delivering it. You look at his last few KOs or the knockdowns against Fury, and as much as he was shown up for long stretches of the fights, when he does land there is nothing wild or amateurish about it. Bringing up Oliver McCall, Mercer, Tua etc are extreme examples and of course would be real bad match ups for him, but surely it's to his credit you have to dig up guys that he wouldn't have every chance of flattening? Look how people still talk about Earnie Shavers, who only had a right hand, wasn't any more sound technically than Wilder and to boot couldn't really take a punch.

My point with the iron chins is - they weren't the elite of their time yet I struggle to see Wilder beating them, however, bizarrely I give him more chance against Lennox, Holyfield, Tyson and Bowe (*wait up, wait up). Wilder's power isn't up for debate, imo, he would have been dangerous in any era, however, ironing out Ortiz is quite simply not enough to be in a "greatest ever puncher" conversation (*for what it's worth I think the elite guys would've ironed him out 9 and half out of 10).

There's about a dozen current heavyweights who are serious challenges for Wilder - Uysk, Povetkin, Whyte, Parker, Ruiz, Joshua, even Rivas, Chisora, Pulev, Kownacki, Hunter - maybe he blows them all away, great, he should currently start favourite over all, but just add some funking substance to the hype.

Who anointed Ortiz superior to that lot? Who did he ever beat? (i'm not saying Ortiz is any worst than that lot either... apart from Uysk, of course, who is P4P level)

No argument really, I'm more responding to the people who post as if he's tofu and couldn't possibly beat certain guys(who aren't mount olympus for a skull piece McCall). He has a chance of sparking right out damn near everyone who ever boxed and it's fun to watch. I'd like to see him fight any of those guys as well, or Ortiz do so for that matter. Usyk is also the only one Id be confident putting a dime on to win I think.