Quote Originally Posted by Beanz View Post
Quote Originally Posted by Gandalf View Post
Yes, but you are basically saying that you know better and that they are basically all duped. It couldn't be that actually they want Brexit and that is a priority? The same Brexit that has been delayed by not only May, but the complete resistance of Labour. You don't see how that looked to people?

All Labour had to do was listen. But they didn't and you are displaying the same mentality here with the 'People may have had good intentions, but they were duped and will be shat on'. Well, if so there will be another election in about 5 years.

There is choice but Labour put itself in a terrible position and not only that but had scandalous things in its manifesto. Why would Corbyn want almost fully formed babies murdered? Why would you give the vote to kids? Why would you not listen to the 70% that want significantly reduced migration. It is because they thought they knew better and did not need to listen.

I can tell you right now what happens when you increase the minimum wage 20%. Unemployment and economic stagnation and you have open borders too. That is mental. I don't know better but have witnessed what happened when a similar experiment was tried here. Big mistake and it hurts everybody. Labour might have costed it out in theory, but had they observed it in practice?

Labour was a risk that was likely going to continue Brexit for years. At least now, good or bad, things can move on.

I get that people want Brexit but that does not excuse voting Tory. Plenty of leavers refused to do so.

There was a lot of really good stuff in the Labour manifesto so why can't you bring yourself to admit it. Stuff you preached about for years and now you are back to playing pretend in order to keep to your weird new ideology. I bet you never even read it. Not a word and relied on second hand interpretations.

Just saying things like

"Why would Corbyn want almost fully formed babies murdered" is sick mate. It is the worse form of gutter journalism. To think that i thought you were better than someone who would repeat tabloid shclok like that. The manifesto promised to decriminalize abortion not make it a free for all. What are you a Catholic now? Do you want to control women so much you want to tell them what to do with their bodies?

It is the same as being so mean that even though you live in SK you want to stop people at the bottom of the rung being paid enough to live on. Forgive me but you sound like a right Victorian Scrooge like bastard of a man

Labour wanted to go far beyond most countries in terms of when abortion could be carried and that to me is murder. Abortion in the very early stages as the result of irresponsibility I can understand, but after a certain period, that is then a baby with arms, legs, and common human features. I am not evil and would prefer people to act responsibly and consider their actions before resorting to murder. I am in favor of abortion, but only in the early stages.

Again there you are saying people had 'no excuse to vote Tory'. You are dealing with a 2 party tyranny in a FPTP system, so people could see that they had a chance for Brexit or a chance to continue the same old uncertainty. They seem to want it done. It does not even mean they are Tories.

I agree with you that there was good stuff in the manifesto, but ultimately when push comes to shove the priority here was independence and Corbyn, though I am sure got it privately, was tied to his Party. Or maybe I am wrong and he had his own flip and really wanted the EU having claimed to have voted for it. I don't know. Either way it was a miscalculation that became pronounced as soon as it was obvious his party was pro EU and that he would renege on a promise to respect the results of the referendum. It was an extraordinary miscalculation. It cost Labour the North ot England. That is something that DOES NOT HAPPEN. It did.

I do not want people unable to afford to live. That is untrue. To put it into context here. If you have even a full time supermarket job you can earn about 1.7 million a month. You can rent a 3 bedroom middle class family home for 600,000 or a poorer studio for yourself, furnished, bills included for half that. That leaves you with about 70 plus percent of your income to do what you want with. It isn't the workhouse. Even the lowest level jobs can provide a relatively decent standard of living. It is kind of similar in the UK in that with a little modesty you can do okay. I always had money in the UK, but the truth was I was young and spent it and I spent madly in my early years here too. Not smart.

All I argue is that by not being a consumer maniac, you can actually do okay in life. I am no scrooge as I spend money freely, but within reason. Instead of spending my money on say watches like Walrus, I put it into health or a nice meal or a nice jacket or what have you. It is all part of growing up. Not sure how any of that makes me a bastard of a man, but hey, whatever.