Cooking the Books on Covid-19?

[Spicoli]

Deceptive. Where exactly? You read what you want not what is written. And why is it an exaggeration to point out that direct OR indirect coughing is a way to transfer. Is that not a possibility?

[Gandalf]

Also, Sweden seems to have done it without locking everyone up as did many other countries including here. What are you going to do when you have decimated your economy? It is stupid. People are welcoming their own enslavement. The government does not have the right to make you stay in your home.

They found of the dead here about 97% had existing conditions and the average age was about 77. Just saying. Not many died.

[TIC]

Deceptive. Where exactly? You read what you want not what is written. And why is it an exaggeration to point out that direct OR indirect coughing is a way to transfer. Is that not a possibility?

you say stuff like "No I know how that whole thing works". how what whole thing works? i was asking if you believed the virus can jump from someone else onto you, you admit that you don't really know to what degree they make us sick or what they are exposing us to in actuality & it is proven that just because someone is exposed to a certain disease does not mean they will be infected by it, the household with someone sick & not all getting it as an example, me around sick work mates, ask gandalf if any of his students have ever had a cold around him & if he got sick. i'm saying coughing & sneezing directly on other people is an exaggeration. i'm not sure what sort of people you hang around with but that never happens in my everyday life. people cough & sneeze in my vicinity, most will cover their mouths, not all do, kids are the worst & the disease doesn't transfer to me

[TitoFan]

Why the contentiousness about this virus, TIC? (and to some extent..... Gandalf)

At the end of the day, isn't my right to wear a mask and keep social distancing if I so choose just as important as your choice not to wear one?

And yet.... if we were in close proximity and I felt uncomfortable with not keeping social distancing.... would you not respect those wishes?

Recent anecdote.....

I was at the Post Office recently, and everyone was cooperating with the wearing of the facemasks and keeping to the lines marked on the floor. Everyone but this one dude who insisted on getting up on people in line. I guess he was kind of in a hurry, and couldn't be bothered with rules. He said he "only needed to buy a stamp" and was quite impatient. He wasn't wearing a mask, either. At one point he coughed. Probably meaningless..... but again..... I choose to follow social distancing guidelines, as is my right to do so. Nobody's keeping me at home..... nobody is keeping me from doing my business. At one point the guy comes up to me to ask a question. Already a bit annoyed at the one fool in every line who doesn't know how to behave, I kindly asked him to keep his distance. Fortunately, the guy realized he was being kind of an ass, and backed off and back into his spot on the line. At one point a guy already at the counter saw what was going on, and mercifully bought a stamp to give to the impatient bloke. He thanked the guy.... and off he went. There was a general sigh of relief from the people in line.

It doesn't matter whether you want to believe in anything or not.

It boils down to your rights versus mine. As long as our rights do not infringe on one another, everything should be cool. As soon as you want to impose your rights on mine...... that's a different story.

[TIC]

Why the contentiousness about this virus, TIC? (and to some extent..... Gandalf)

At the end of the day, isn't my right to wear a mask and keep social distancing if I so choose just as important as your choice not to wear one?

And yet.... if we were in close proximity and I felt uncomfortable with not keeping social distancing.... would you not respect those wishes?

Recent anecdote.....

I was at the Post Office recently, and everyone was cooperating with the wearing of the facemasks and keeping to the lines marked on the floor. Everyone but this one dude who insisted on getting up on people in line. I guess he was kind of in a hurry, and couldn't be bothered with rules. He said he "only needed to buy a stamp" and was quite impatient. He wasn't wearing a mask, either. At one point he coughed. Probably meaningless..... but again..... I choose to follow social distancing guidelines, as is my right to do so. Nobody's keeping me at home..... nobody is keeping me from doing my business. At one point the guy comes up to me to ask a question. Already a bit annoyed at the one fool in every line who doesn't know how to behave, I kindly asked him to keep his distance. Fortunately, the guy realized he was being kind of an ass, and backed off and back into his spot on the line. At one point a guy already at the counter saw what was going on, and mercifully bought a stamp to give to the impatient bloke. He thanked the guy.... and off he went. There was a general sigh of relief from the people in line.

It doesn't matter whether you want to believe in anything or not.

It boils down to your rights versus mine. As long as our rights do not infringe on one another, everything should be cool. As soon as you want to impose your rights on mine...... that's a different story.

you are free to wear whatever you want, it's when it becomes mandatory that theres a problem. i will live free. if i am standing close to you am i harming you? you would need to prove your belief. if you don't want people near you stay at home. your fears don't over rule other peoples freedoms. order followers are the cause of slavery

[TitoFan]

Why the contentiousness about this virus, TIC? (and to some extent..... Gandalf)

At the end of the day, isn't my right to wear a mask and keep social distancing if I so choose just as important as your choice not to wear one?

And yet.... if we were in close proximity and I felt uncomfortable with not keeping social distancing.... would you not respect those wishes?

Recent anecdote.....

I was at the Post Office recently, and everyone was cooperating with the wearing of the facemasks and keeping to the lines marked on the floor. Everyone but this one dude who insisted on getting up on people in line. I guess he was kind of in a hurry, and couldn't be bothered with rules. He said he "only needed to buy a stamp" and was quite impatient. He wasn't wearing a mask, either. At one point he coughed. Probably meaningless..... but again..... I choose to follow social distancing guidelines, as is my right to do so. Nobody's keeping me at home..... nobody is keeping me from doing my business. At one point the guy comes up to me to ask a question. Already a bit annoyed at the one fool in every line who doesn't know how to behave, I kindly asked him to keep his distance. Fortunately, the guy realized he was being kind of an ass, and backed off and back into his spot on the line. At one point a guy already at the counter saw what was going on, and mercifully bought a stamp to give to the impatient bloke. He thanked the guy.... and off he went. There was a general sigh of relief from the people in line.

It doesn't matter whether you want to believe in anything or not.

It boils down to your rights versus mine. As long as our rights do not infringe on one another, everything should be cool. As soon as you want to impose your rights on mine...... that's a different story.

you are free to wear whatever you want, it's when it becomes mandatory that theres a problem. i will live free. if i am standing close to you am i harming you? you would need to prove your belief. if you don't want people near you stay at home. your fears don't over rule other peoples freedoms. order followers are the cause of slavery

I think if a business owner asks that you wear a mask in his establishment, it is you that can make a choice to either wear one or stay out.

If there's a line at a shop and you're asked to keep social distance and you don't, it is again your choice... just as it's the shop owner's right to ask you to leave.

When you were just complaining about having to stay home, it was more understandable.

If it was just a matter of rights, it would be one thing. But IMO, your attitude borders on rebelliousness and wanting to buck the system. My rights are still just as important as yours.

[TIC]

Why the contentiousness about this virus, TIC? (and to some extent..... Gandalf)

At the end of the day, isn't my right to wear a mask and keep social distancing if I so choose just as important as your choice not to wear one?

And yet.... if we were in close proximity and I felt uncomfortable with not keeping social distancing.... would you not respect those wishes?

Recent anecdote.....

I was at the Post Office recently, and everyone was cooperating with the wearing of the facemasks and keeping to the lines marked on the floor. Everyone but this one dude who insisted on getting up on people in line. I guess he was kind of in a hurry, and couldn't be bothered with rules. He said he "only needed to buy a stamp" and was quite impatient. He wasn't wearing a mask, either. At one point he coughed. Probably meaningless..... but again..... I choose to follow social distancing guidelines, as is my right to do so. Nobody's keeping me at home..... nobody is keeping me from doing my business. At one point the guy comes up to me to ask a question. Already a bit annoyed at the one fool in every line who doesn't know how to behave, I kindly asked him to keep his distance. Fortunately, the guy realized he was being kind of an ass, and backed off and back into his spot on the line. At one point a guy already at the counter saw what was going on, and mercifully bought a stamp to give to the impatient bloke. He thanked the guy.... and off he went. There was a general sigh of relief from the people in line.

It doesn't matter whether you want to believe in anything or not.

It boils down to your rights versus mine. As long as our rights do not infringe on one another, everything should be cool. As soon as you want to impose your rights on mine...... that's a different story.

you are free to wear whatever you want, it's when it becomes mandatory that theres a problem. i will live free. if i am standing close to you am i harming you? you would need to prove your belief. if you don't want people near you stay at home. your fears don't over rule other peoples freedoms. order followers are the cause of slavery

I think if a business owner asks that you wear a mask in his establishment, it is you that can make a choice to either wear one or stay out.

If there's a line at a shop and you're asked to keep social distance and you don't, it is again your choice... just as it's the shop owner's right to ask you to leave.

When you were just complaining about having to stay home, it was more understandable.

If it was just a matter of rights, it would be one thing. But IMO, your attitude borders on rebelliousness and wanting to buck the system. My rights are still just as important as yours.

a business is private property & if that is their rules to wear a mask i will shop elsewhere, if they require six feet distancing i have no problem with that. what if i'm surfing or at a park with no one else around? should that still apply? no everywhere is the same as where you live. you didn't answer if i would be harming you, because you know you can't prove it & it is just your belief, you just feel because your belief is backed by thugs that is over rules my rights

[TitoFan]

Why the contentiousness about this virus, TIC? (and to some extent..... Gandalf)

At the end of the day, isn't my right to wear a mask and keep social distancing if I so choose just as important as your choice not to wear one?

And yet.... if we were in close proximity and I felt uncomfortable with not keeping social distancing.... would you not respect those wishes?

Recent anecdote.....

I was at the Post Office recently, and everyone was cooperating with the wearing of the facemasks and keeping to the lines marked on the floor. Everyone but this one dude who insisted on getting up on people in line. I guess he was kind of in a hurry, and couldn't be bothered with rules. He said he "only needed to buy a stamp" and was quite impatient. He wasn't wearing a mask, either. At one point he coughed. Probably meaningless..... but again..... I choose to follow social distancing guidelines, as is my right to do so. Nobody's keeping me at home..... nobody is keeping me from doing my business. At one point the guy comes up to me to ask a question. Already a bit annoyed at the one fool in every line who doesn't know how to behave, I kindly asked him to keep his distance. Fortunately, the guy realized he was being kind of an ass, and backed off and back into his spot on the line. At one point a guy already at the counter saw what was going on, and mercifully bought a stamp to give to the impatient bloke. He thanked the guy.... and off he went. There was a general sigh of relief from the people in line.

It doesn't matter whether you want to believe in anything or not.

It boils down to your rights versus mine. As long as our rights do not infringe on one another, everything should be cool. As soon as you want to impose your rights on mine...... that's a different story.

you are free to wear whatever you want, it's when it becomes mandatory that theres a problem. i will live free. if i am standing close to you am i harming you? you would need to prove your belief. if you don't want people near you stay at home. your fears don't over rule other peoples freedoms. order followers are the cause of slavery

I think if a business owner asks that you wear a mask in his establishment, it is you that can make a choice to either wear one or stay out.

If there's a line at a shop and you're asked to keep social distance and you don't, it is again your choice... just as it's the shop owner's right to ask you to leave.

When you were just complaining about having to stay home, it was more understandable.

If it was just a matter of rights, it would be one thing. But IMO, your attitude borders on rebelliousness and wanting to buck the system. My rights are still just as important as yours.

a business is private property & if that is their rules to wear a mask i will shop elsewhere, if they require six feet distancing i have no problem with that. what if i'm surfing or at a park with no one else around? should that still apply? no everywhere is the same as where you live. you didn't answer if i would be harming you, because you know you can't prove it & it is just your belief, you just feel because your belief is backed by thugs that is over rules my rights

If your respecting my rights is predicated upon my "having to prove" anything to you......... we would have a serious problem.

[Spicoli]

Deceptive. Where exactly? You read what you want not what is written. And why is it an exaggeration to point out that direct OR indirect coughing is a way to transfer. Is that not a possibility?

you say stuff like "No I know how that whole thing works". how what whole thing works? i was asking if you believed the virus can jump from someone else onto you, you admit that you don't really know to what degree they make us sick or what they are exposing us to in actuality & it is proven that just because someone is exposed to a certain disease does not mean they will be infected by it, the household with someone sick & not all getting it as an example, me around sick work mates, ask gandalf if any of his students have ever had a cold around him & if he got sick. i'm saying coughing & sneezing directly on other people is an exaggeration. i'm not sure what sort of people you hang around with but that never happens in my everyday life. people cough & sneeze in my vicinity, most will cover their mouths, not all do, kids are the worst & the disease doesn't transfer to me

But you don't 'know' either. None of it. What a given individual has been exposed to..what they carry..what their family members carry..the immune systems of them..who was in the exact location prior..none of it. So yeh in this climate it's common sense to take precautions.

If you're gonna throw around deceptive you really do need to have that zeroed in and/or hone up reading comprehension. Given your base question of 'do you wear one? if so do you wear it because you believe the virus can jump from someone else onto you?'

"....yeh I wear one. No I know how that whole thing works. A mask is for others so you don't spritz all over them and common sense to negate or minimize it. Handle money you'll get all the bacteria you want. Someone coughs in your face, on your person..yeh things jump onto you.."

two questions..two yeh answers and explanation why I wear one. No deception fella. Seems pretty clear but down the rabbit hole you run.

[TIC]

Deceptive. Where exactly? You read what you want not what is written. And why is it an exaggeration to point out that direct OR indirect coughing is a way to transfer. Is that not a possibility?

you say stuff like "No I know how that whole thing works". how what whole thing works? i was asking if you believed the virus can jump from someone else onto you, you admit that you don't really know to what degree they make us sick or what they are exposing us to in actuality & it is proven that just because someone is exposed to a certain disease does not mean they will be infected by it, the household with someone sick & not all getting it as an example, me around sick work mates, ask gandalf if any of his students have ever had a cold around him & if he got sick. i'm saying coughing & sneezing directly on other people is an exaggeration. i'm not sure what sort of people you hang around with but that never happens in my everyday life. people cough & sneeze in my vicinity, most will cover their mouths, not all do, kids are the worst & the disease doesn't transfer to me

But you don't 'know' either. None of it. What a given individual has been exposed to..what they carry..what their family members carry..the immune systems of them..who was in the exact location prior..none of it. So yeh in this climate it's common sense to take precautions.

If you're gonna throw around deceptive you really do need to have that zeroed in and/or hone up reading comprehension. Given your base question of 'do you wear one? if so do you wear it because you believe the virus can jump from someone else onto you?'

"....yeh I wear one. No I know how that whole thing works. A mask is for others so you don't spritz all over them and common sense to negate or minimize it. Handle money you'll get all the bacteria you want. Someone coughs in your face, on your person..yeh things jump onto you.."

two questions..two yeh answers and explanation why I wear one. No deception fella. Seems pretty clear but down the rabbit hole you run.

i'm not the one saying it's real. you believe it is, then prove it. people get sick because of their weak immune systems. if someone has a compromised immune system they shouldn't be going out, health is the responsibility of the person. so what was it that you know how that whole thing works? so if someone coughs on you & they had the virus it would get on you but the mask can stop it?

[Gandalf]

I am not sure what you are referring to me for on the mask issue Tito. I have masks and wear them. I social distance. I respect the rights of anyone around me.

My issue is stopping healthy people from leaving their homes or earning a living. That is going to potentially destroy them far more than a virus that has a 1 in 240 chance of hurting them. It is still in the moment, but there is going to be a very big economic shock and all those who pushed this that rely on health care systems etc that are funded by a productive economy are in for a very big shock when those services inevitably decline and their children are saddled with huge debts.

Tracking devices for instance. That's the back door to a Chinese model and that is to be rejected at all costs. It is a balance between preserving the economy and individual freedoms. This went too far and there will be consequences to that. If as in Sweden it was shown that you did not need to shut down all small service businesses, then the policies of the other countries were by nature poor policies and then you have to ask 'Was it intentional?'

[TIC]

I am not sure what you are referring to me for on the mask issue Tito. I have masks and wear them. I social distance. I respect the rights of anyone around me.

My issue is stopping healthy people from leaving their homes or earning a living. That is going to potentially destroy them far more than a virus that has a 1 in 240 chance of hurting them. It is still in the moment, but there is going to be a very big economic shock and all those who pushed this that rely on health care systems etc that are funded by a productive economy are in for a very big shock when those services inevitably decline and their children are saddled with huge debts.

Tracking devices for instance. That's the back door to a Chinese model and that is to be rejected at all costs. It is a balance between preserving the economy and individual freedoms. This went too far and there will be consequences to that. If as in Sweden it was shown that you did not need to shut down all small service businesses, then the policies of the other countries were by nature poor policies and then you have to ask 'Was it intentional?'

hey gandalf, if you don't mind could i ask why you wear the mask? do you believe that if someone has covid 19 it can jump from them & infect you?

[Gandalf]

I am not sure what you are referring to me for on the mask issue Tito. I have masks and wear them. I social distance. I respect the rights of anyone around me.

My issue is stopping healthy people from leaving their homes or earning a living. That is going to potentially destroy them far more than a virus that has a 1 in 240 chance of hurting them. It is still in the moment, but there is going to be a very big economic shock and all those who pushed this that rely on health care systems etc that are funded by a productive economy are in for a very big shock when those services inevitably decline and their children are saddled with huge debts.

Tracking devices for instance. That's the back door to a Chinese model and that is to be rejected at all costs. It is a balance between preserving the economy and individual freedoms. This went too far and there will be consequences to that. If as in Sweden it was shown that you did not need to shut down all small service businesses, then the policies of the other countries were by nature poor policies and then you have to ask 'Was it intentional?'

hey gandalf, if you don't mind could i ask why you wear the mask? do you believe that if someone has covid 19 it can jump from them & infect you?

I believe it is infectious, but with so few cases now, the need for masks is almost over. I think it is contagious and for some very risky, but I do not fear for myself. It is hard to get infected if nobody has it.

[TitoFan]

I am not sure what you are referring to me for on the mask issue Tito. I have masks and wear them. I social distance. I respect the rights of anyone around me.

My issue is stopping healthy people from leaving their homes or earning a living. That is going to potentially destroy them far more than a virus that has a 1 in 240 chance of hurting them. It is still in the moment, but there is going to be a very big economic shock and all those who pushed this that rely on health care systems etc that are funded by a productive economy are in for a very big shock when those services inevitably decline and their children are saddled with huge debts.

Tracking devices for instance. That's the back door to a Chinese model and that is to be rejected at all costs. It is a balance between preserving the economy and individual freedoms. This went too far and there will be consequences to that. If as in Sweden it was shown that you did not need to shut down all small service businesses, then the policies of the other countries were by nature poor policies and then you have to ask 'Was it intentional?'

I apologize if I grouped you and TIC together. Clearly the bolded statement is something TIC would never say.

It's a bit of a fine line between believing something and trying to shove your beliefs at others. And that door swings both ways.

[TIC]

I am not sure what you are referring to me for on the mask issue Tito. I have masks and wear them. I social distance. I respect the rights of anyone around me.

My issue is stopping healthy people from leaving their homes or earning a living. That is going to potentially destroy them far more than a virus that has a 1 in 240 chance of hurting them. It is still in the moment, but there is going to be a very big economic shock and all those who pushed this that rely on health care systems etc that are funded by a productive economy are in for a very big shock when those services inevitably decline and their children are saddled with huge debts.

Tracking devices for instance. That's the back door to a Chinese model and that is to be rejected at all costs. It is a balance between preserving the economy and individual freedoms. This went too far and there will be consequences to that. If as in Sweden it was shown that you did not need to shut down all small service businesses, then the policies of the other countries were by nature poor policies and then you have to ask 'Was it intentional?'

I apologize if I grouped you and TIC together. Clearly the bolded statement is something TIC would never say.

It's a bit of a fine line between believing something and trying to shove your beliefs at others. And that door swings both ways.

you highlighted part of the second paragraph, i have been saying that from the beginning. they have made healthy people afraid of healthy people