Fighters who retired at the right time.

[TitoFan]

Looking back through the thread, I can't agree with Hagler either.

C'mon! He loses a decision to Leonard and just walks away? Ok so he may have tried to get a rematch and wasn't able to. He should've tried harder. Called Leonard out. No way Hagler fights the same stupid fight he fought the first time around.

That must've left such a BAD TASTE in Hagler's mouth. Leonard was and ATG, and maybe even TBE in my book... but his reign wasn't middleweight. That was Hagler's domain. For Leonard to take that away from him had to sting like hell.

Especially when Hagler had already dismantled the fearsome Hearns in 3 rounds. Where the hell was THAT Hagler against Leonard?

No... Hagler didn't retire at the right time.

Yeah I agree with that. Hagler may have been exposed as the stereotypical bully that the first time somebody stands up to them and whips them they just totally collapse and that is the end of them.

I believe he should have fought on. What the hell would he want to go out on a bitter note like that?

Oh and there's no way that Sugar Ray Leonard takes another chance and takes on that beast again....because you just know that the next Marvin Hagler that shows up will literally rip his head off.

I can never understand why Hagler decided to fight orthodox against Leonard to try to prove that he could box as well as Leonard.

If anyone ever starts a thread titled "The Stupidest Ring Strategies of All Time", Hagler against Leonard takes top honors.

I think Leonard, being the diva that he was at that time, would have asked for more concessions to face Hagler that would have been too unbearable for Marvin to accept so he just called it a day. Leonard was the Canelo of his time.

OMG... I could not be more in disagreement.

Diva, maybe. But Leonard faced the best at their peaks without worrying about catchweights or waiting for the planets to align before facing them.

Benitez, Hearns, Duran, Hagler...... etc, etc.

In that regard, Leonard and Ginger couldn't be further apart.

[NoSavingByTheBell]

I felt sorry for Leonard but not that sorry because I never really liked his arrogance but then when he said what happened to him as a young boy about the sexual abuse and the repeated rapes then I really felt sorry for him and I realized that he overcompensated for that horrible abusive experience with his bravado and Golden child personality

[Spicoli]

What about Marquez. He was still chasing that 5th weight division and making millions in main events with Bradley and Alvarado. He wasn't at the point of stepping stone or being hurt and close to blown away but just seemed to go away under the radar much like his early career was. Did an evaluation and knew injuries catch up etc. Here one day gone tomorrow.

[Dark Lord Al]

Terry Marsh, he was carefully matched in his career.
Great engine , good boxer , light puncher with strong chin.
Got out before he was found out at top level.

[X]

Diva, maybe. But Leonard faced the best at their peaks without worrying about catchweights or waiting for the planets to align before facing them
.

Oh, I'm not convinced about that Tito.

Leonard was a magnificent and courageous fighter, no doubt about that ......

But he was very very carefully matched on the way up, he agreed to defend against an already ageing Duran having his first fight at Welterweight, then didn't have the rubber match until Duran was truly ancient and fat.

He waited at least 5 years for Hagler to get old and for the planets to align, he made huge events from fighting substandard opposition (Kevin Howard, anyone?) and he cherry picked guys later on.

And you couldn't be more wrong about catchweights. Leonard INVENTED catchweights. The entire super middleweight division was invented to weight drain Donny Lalonde. It was a farce that history has looked kindly upon.

[SlimTrae]

What about Marquez. He was still chasing that 5th weight division and making millions in main events with Bradley and Alvarado. He wasn't at the point of stepping stone or being hurt and close to blown away but just seemed to go away under the radar much like his early career was. Did an evaluation and knew injuries catch up etc. Here one day gone tomorrow.

Probably the best name mentioned here. Roach, Arum couldn't offer him tens of millions with his own chain of gyms, restaurants and a shoe line to rival Air Jordans!! He definitely had at least 2 more fights in him, but left the right way,(on his terms) great pick.

[Master]

Diva, maybe. But Leonard faced the best at their peaks without worrying about catchweights or waiting for the planets to align before facing them
.

Oh, I'm not convinced about that Tito.

Leonard was a magnificent and courageous fighter, no doubt about that ......

But he was very very carefully matched on the way up, he agreed to defend against an already ageing Duran having his first fight at Welterweight, then didn't have the rubber match until Duran was truly ancient and fat.

He waited at least 5 years for Hagler to get old and for the planets to align, he made huge events from fighting substandard opposition (Kevin Howard, anyone?) and he cherry picked guys later on.

And you couldn't be more wrong about catchweights. Leonard INVENTED catchweights. The entire super middleweight division was invented to weight drain Donny Lalonde. It was a farce that history has looked kindly upon.

For the record I was only on about Leonard, after the Hagler comeback.

[TitoFan]

Diva, maybe. But Leonard faced the best at their peaks without worrying about catchweights or waiting for the planets to align before facing them
.

Oh, I'm not convinced about that Tito.

Leonard was a magnificent and courageous fighter, no doubt about that ......

But he was very very carefully matched on the way up, he agreed to defend against an already ageing Duran having his first fight at Welterweight, then didn't have the rubber match until Duran was truly ancient and fat.

He waited at least 5 years for Hagler to get old and for the planets to align, he made huge events from fighting substandard opposition (Kevin Howard, anyone?) and he cherry picked guys later on.

And you couldn't be more wrong about catchweights. Leonard INVENTED catchweights. The entire super middleweight division was invented to weight drain Donny Lalonde. It was a farce that history has looked kindly upon.

No, my friend. Duran was most certainly NOT aging when he fought Leonard... in what should be considered one of history's greatest fights. Duran was 29 years old, and pretty much in his prime.

You mention the rubber match... but no mention of the immediate rematch in which Duran was woefully unprepared (his fault) and given a boxing lesson by SRL.

Hagler? Sure... I'll give you that one. But what about the Who's Who of boxing ATG's on Leonard's resume, like Hearns and Benitez?

Can you imagine Ginger facing the same quality of opponent in their prime?? I can't.

Leonard can be accused of being a diva, arrogant, opportunistic at times.

But please............... PLEASE.......... don't anyone make the unforgivable mistake of putting an ATG and Coddled Ginger in the same sentence, paragraph, book.

[NoSavingByTheBell]

Duran/Leonard 1 is one of my Top 10 all-time favorites --- I read Roberto ate gallons and gallons of ice cream for months, partying after beating Leonard....

I remember Duran giving an interview one time to Howard Cosell, and he was asked why he had gained so much weight so quickly, and he gave a big smile and I remember he said:

"Ice cream! I love ice cream!!"

Hahaha

[SlimTrae]

I can understand when some say Duran was old (in ring) years. I think going the distance with Marvelous Marvin proved he still had a lot left.

[Master]

I can understand when some say Duran was old (in ring) years. I think going the distance with Marvelous Marvin proved he still had a lot left.

Duran is a superhuman who would still be fighting now if he did not have that car accident. He just kept on pulling out performances way past his best weight which was lightweight. How could he beat Leonard, go the distance with Hagler, beat Davey Moore, Barkley, and keep fighting until 50?

[X]

Diva, maybe. But Leonard faced the best at their peaks without worrying about catchweights or waiting for the planets to align before facing them
.

Oh, I'm not convinced about that Tito.

Leonard was a magnificent and courageous fighter, no doubt about that ......

But he was very very carefully matched on the way up, he agreed to defend against an already ageing Duran having his first fight at Welterweight, then didn't have the rubber match until Duran was truly ancient and fat.

He waited at least 5 years for Hagler to get old and for the planets to align, he made huge events from fighting substandard opposition (Kevin Howard, anyone?) and he cherry picked guys later on.

And you couldn't be more wrong about catchweights. Leonard INVENTED catchweights. The entire super middleweight division was invented to weight drain Donny Lalonde. It was a farce that history has looked kindly upon.

No, my friend. Duran was most certainly NOT aging when he fought Leonard... in what should be considered one of history's greatest fights. Duran was 29 years old, and pretty much in his prime.

You mention the rubber match... but no mention of the immediate rematch in which Duran was woefully unprepared (his fault) and given a boxing lesson by SRL.

Hagler? Sure... I'll give you that one. But what about the Who's Who of boxing ATG's on Leonard's resume, like Hearns and Benitez?

Can you imagine Ginger facing the same quality of opponent in their prime?? I can't.

Leonard can be accused of being a diva, arrogant, opportunistic at times.

But please............... PLEASE.......... don't anyone make the unforgivable mistake of putting an ATG and Coddled Ginger in the same sentence, paragraph, book.

OK, I will admit I was wrong about Duran being old in the first fight. I still think Leonard tried to reduce his risk by fighting Duran in his first fight at the higher weight, and the only reason there was an immediate rematch was that Leonard lost! You're right, though, at least there was a rematch.

I was highly critical of Leonard during his career of stacking the odds in his favour and he definitely liked catchweights in his favour!

I am definitely not criticising Leonard's skills, ability or courage. He is an All Time Great without doubt, and always entertaining in the ring. Fantastic fighter. 👍🏼

[SlimTrae]

Sven Ottke most definitely retired at the right time 2004, not 8 years in the game left 34-0.

Ass whoopins was awaiting him on all sides be it Joe Calzaghe or Mikkel Kessler. He fights in 2005, I would've went with Lacy over him. While Jeff was over rated, he wasnt a bad fighter. He was a decent champ who ran into a great champ in Calzaghe.

If Sven fought for a decade he could've been in against the young Jermaine Taylor, Bhop the vet, Commonwealth champ the young cobra, Carl Froch or a young but NABO SMW champ in Pascal. These fighters became the main events for SMW division around 2004-2008. Was Sven constantly injured? Why would he leave the game, when all these boxers were making their name known at SMW? I think it was because Sven knew complimentary ass whoopins was awaiting him from all sides of the earth.

[Master]

Sven Ottke most definitely retired at the right time 2004, not 8 years in the game left 34-0.

Ass whoopins was awaiting him on all sides be it Joe Calzaghe or Mikkel Kessler. He fights in 2005, I would've went with Lacy over him. While Jeff was over rated, he wasnt a bad fighter. He was a decent champ who ran into a great champ in Calzaghe.

If Sven fought for a decade he could've been in against the young Jermaine Taylor, Bhop the vet, Commonwealth champ the young cobra, Carl Froch or a young but NABO SMW champ in Pascal. These fighters became the main events for SMW division around 2004-2008. Was Sven constantly injured? Why would he leave the game, when all these boxers were making their name known at SMW? I think it was because Sven knew complimentary ass whoopins was awaiting him from all sides of the earth.

I hated the feather fisted, home town, protected Ottke.

How he knocked out Mundine or was rated higher than Calzaghe I do not know.

[NoSavingByTheBell]

Poopy pants Sven
Saw the men
Lining up in front
So he quit, the bunt!

What is a bunt?
I know you've never heard:
It's like a little type
Of a kind of a bird