[quote=Chris N. ]
Quote Originally Posted by sleeplessrevolution
Quote Originally Posted by Chris N.
Quote Originally Posted by sleeplessrevolution
in my opinion, reflexes aside i think the 2nd best defense is still the "boxer stance" because it is more likely for a boxer to be hittable when his arms are put down than say a style like winky where his arms are always up and ready for a cover.
It's called timing punches. If your relflexes are shot it doesn't matter if you hands are up or down you're going to hit all day. Arche Moore in his later fights didn't have great reflexes but it was his experience and the perception that went with it that allowed him to counter and draw his opponents. You don't need RJJ/PBF reflexes to set a guy up or counter, but you need enough reflexes and some well trained eyes to time a punch and land your own. This goes hand in hand w/ defense.

A good fighter will drop his arms to invite an attack that they'll counter, that's one way sucker a guy to throw a punch. Look at Archie Moore who's one of the earlier fighters to adopt a defense like Winky's. Moore had his hands up for most of the fight, but when he was trying to set them up he'd drop a hand or two.

I agree with Olympian, for the most part defense is making your opponent miss which weaves into setting your own attacks up.

In regards to a good defensive fighter worth mentioning is "the untouchable" Nocolino Locche. He reminded me of Willy Pep in a few respects, you couldn't land a jab on him with a machine gun, he could shoulder-roll, sucker a guy to throw a punch and turn the tables on them like the fighters before him.

Funny to think that all these moves, even the sharp perception of defense was almost universal in the 40's and 50's. Now it's seldom that you'll see a complete defensive package, but a few names these days bring back that old magic.
"Making your opponent miss whether your hands is up or down" means you still need "reflex" to do that. and the topic says reflex aside, what is the best defense right? "If your hands is down" and you don't have a reflex to support it in order to make the opponent miss, then you'll only be just a live human punching bag.
Mate counter punching needs tremendous reflex because without it you couldn't see where the punches of your opponent coming from in order for you to time and counter punch them right away.