BruceLee

[Scrap]

I know 1 or 2 masters myself personal freinds, superb at what they do,but compete, they dont and you know why.

[TyBuff]

From my limited reading of Bruce Lee, I know that he never participated or want to participate in MA tournaments. Growing up he was invovled in a lot of street fights, that is how he ended up coming to America. I have also read that while filming his movies in Hong Kong the extras where constantly challenging Bruce to fights between takes, he never lost. Like The_One 77 already said there were a lot of people that can testify to how much of a bad a$$ Bruce was. Just because he didnt compete in "tournaments" doesnt mean he couldnt wipe the floor with 90% + of the worlds population.

Since there is so much rumor mixed with truth about Bruce Lee it is hard to say how great he really was. You have to believe the people that saw him and knew MA. People like Chuck Norris and Bob Wall.

[lightweight132]

In a boxing match ali is way too big for little bruce he would probably get hurt. In a street fight it would take bruce awhile but i think he would eventually kung fu his ass.

Any one that says little bruce doesnt know his shit and just made movies doesnt know their shit!
He was a great martial artist and would have been a champion in the ufc.

Back then movies was the only way he could get noticed so thats what he did a long with write his own style of martial arts that was proven to be affective in street fighting. He would have made a good boxer too with his lightning speed and excellent foot work. He knew how to put all of his weight behind everything he threw.

Bruce has nothing on me though

[lightweight132]

Ali almost doulbled bruces weight so id prob put my money on him, 1b for 1b bruce was 1 tough mo fo.

bruce was no more than 150 standing 5'8.......I really beleive he was less than 150.......more like 135-140

Ali 220 standing 6 something

[lightweight132]

I have a few questions:
1) Is the supposition that Ali would stand there and allow all this to happen to him?
2) Is there any doubt that Ali would be able to withstand a shot or two from Lee?
3) In the course of this fight are we to assume that Ali would not lay a glove on Lee, or is it possible that he may sneak in a lucky punch or two?
4) Can Lee take his punch?
5) How does Lee's rip and tear strategy deal with movement and a guy that can ko him with a punch?

It has been documented by that tall ass basketball dude Kareem Abduljabar or whatever that when bruce was teaching him to fight bruce told him to kick this heavy bag that was so heavy Kareem was simply trying to kick it and make it sway.
Bruce steped in and showed him how it should be done and when he kicked it not only did he move it but he busted out all the filling inside it with one kick...........Kareem said this himself.

I have a freind whos dad use to work onset some of bruces movies to take pictures. He said the bruce was the most arrogant asshole in the world and he was always looking for a fight. Any one that questioned his skills would result in their asses geting kicked onset. Bruce didnt hire a bunch of actors either he had real martial artists that knew their stuff.
Sometimes people actually wanted a peice of him and challenged him. Little bruce never lost a match......not even close

Go little bruce Go

[lightweight132]

he didnt compete on the international scene i dont think, wing chun is not a sport and there was no internationals or belts like boxing.

Ali followed a sport tradition, lee started his own by merging all the best bit of martial arts and creating jeet koon do (sp?)

there are hundreds of martial arts masters that have the highest level of skill, because they do not chose to compete for a plastic trophy or plated belt and instead focus on their art, does it make them any less skilled?

There were no tournaments back then for bruce to compete in......There was no ufc........he was too proud to just do some BS Karate tournament because he was above that

I promise you from about 4 old men that i know that actually knew the guy Bruce would be more than willing to prove his skill to ANYONE on the street. If UFC was around little bruce would be the first in line.

GO bruce GO

[Andre]

Scrap,you said you  know William Cheung,I think you would be better off asking him than  karate men.
After all he grew up with Bruce.They both trained under Yip Man when they were teens.They both fought from what William says in the streets of Hong kong and in some local back alley match ups and also against some British soldiers in local boxing matches as well from what I heard from William.

Some people care  what tournaments someone has won and some dont put credit in them.
You cant surely measure everything upon them?
I know it is how the physci of this century has turned out but
even some karate masters from older times would themselves avoid public competition just on higher spiritual disipline reasons and would view it a personal loss and an ego trap even if they won it.
Yip man had no trophys,William had none from what I know but we also trained some world open kung fu champions through that lineage.

This would serve the purpose more:

Ask your karate friends who would win out Ali and themselves in a no rules match  ,i bet they say themselves,cause they would just break the first set of toes or the leg he put forward.
If it was to boxing rules only Ali would walk it in .

[Scrap]

No andre never met the guy never said I did just that I know 1or 2 Im not saying who would beat what when how If I work also with kickboxers,Teaching punching variety and techniuqe and I find them delightful to work with certainly wouldnt like to get kicked around the knees,Isee some of the injurys they get no thank you .Ithink Lee,s case,talking to people a lot of it is Waffle and mystery and a few white lies thrown in, by a good publicist.Then again a freind of mine was the World stick Fighting champ, won it in California a few years back He thinks Bruce is God

[Suleiman]

I have a few questions:
1) Is the supposition that Ali would stand there and allow all this to happen to him?
2) Is there any doubt that Ali would be able to withstand a shot or two from Lee?
3) In the course of this fight are we to assume that Ali would not lay a glove on Lee, or is it possible that he may sneak in a lucky punch or two?
4) Can Lee take his punch?
5) How does Lee's rip and tear strategy deal with movement and a guy that can ko him with a punch?

It has been documented by that tall a** basketball dude Kareem Abduljabar or whatever that when bruce was teaching him to fight bruce told him to kick this heavy bag that was so heavy Kareem was simply trying to kick it and make it sway.
Bruce steped in and showed him how it should be done and when he kicked it not only did he move it but he busted out all the filling inside it with one kick...........Kareem said this himself.
I have a freind whos dad use to work onset some of bruces movies to take pictures. He said the bruce was the most arrogant asshole in the world and he was always looking for a fight. Any one that questioned his skills would result in their asses geting kicked onset. Bruce didnt hire a bunch of actors either he had real martial artists that knew their stuff.
Sometimes people actually wanted a peice of him and challenged him. Little bruce never lost a match......not even close
Go little bruce Go

1. Bruce Lee did lose a match, even not one. Unfortunately, I can not recall his name, but there was a white guy with nick name something like "White Knight of Karate or White Samurai", who was a champion in Kiokushinkai karate. There was an evidence - Bruce's autograph on the book "to the guy who beat me" or something like that. The guy was actually much, much bigger than Bruce , which probably helped him, so physical factor is important for martial arts too. There were several other guys too, I can not recall. Bruce had about 500 unofficial fights and there were 6 to 8 fights that he lost.
2. Bruce Lee did not actually beat Chuck Norris, what happened was that when they met first they had a sparring for several hours. Bruce demonstrated great hand work and Chuck taught him how to use legs, Chuck said that Bruce was one of the most skillful martial artist he knew, he also mentioned that prior to their first encounter Bruce had not used his legs for high kicks (higher than waist). But Chuck was far from estimating Bruce as the "greatest fighter" ever or anything like that, he was implying that they were at about the same level. Now don't you think that Ali would have a very good chance against Chuck Norris?
3. I thought that it was written somewhere that Bruce himself admitted that Ali is of those who could beat him, or something like that.
4. Take a look at UFC, it does seem that karate or kung fu masters do not actually do well in those tournaments. To be fair, boxers do not do very wells either. It seems like grappling masters have an advantage over other disciplinces, at least in UFC. Why it would matter for this discussion? Just proves that there is nothing extraordinary about kung-fu or karate, it is all about physics - speed, power, etc..
5. Anyway, documentation of Bruce Lee's superior skills is weak, mostly memories of people around him, how reliable are they? There is a tons of documentation of Ali's skills.

All in all, although I would still more favor Bruce in street fight, I would say, that Ali has a good chance as well!

[lightweight132]

I have a few questions:
1) Is the supposition that Ali would stand there and allow all this to happen to him?
2) Is there any doubt that Ali would be able to withstand a shot or two from Lee?
3) In the course of this fight are we to assume that Ali would not lay a glove on Lee, or is it possible that he may sneak in a lucky punch or two?
4) Can Lee take his punch?
5) How does Lee's rip and tear strategy deal with movement and a guy that can ko him with a punch?

It has been documented by that tall a** basketball dude Kareem Abduljabar or whatever that when bruce was teaching him to fight bruce told him to kick this heavy bag that was so heavy Kareem was simply trying to kick it and make it sway.
Bruce steped in and showed him how it should be done and when he kicked it not only did he move it but he busted out all the filling inside it with one kick...........Kareem said this himself.
I have a freind whos dad use to work onset some of bruces movies to take pictures. He said the bruce was the most arrogant asshole in the world and he was always looking for a fight. Any one that questioned his skills would result in their asses geting kicked onset. Bruce didnt hire a bunch of actors either he had real martial artists that knew their stuff.
Sometimes people actually wanted a peice of him and challenged him. Little bruce never lost a match......not even close
Go little bruce Go

1. Bruce Lee did lose a match, even not one. Unfortunately, I can not recall his name, but there was a white guy with nick name something like "White Knight of Karate or White Samurai", who was a champion in Kiokushinkai karate. There was an evidence - Bruce's autograph on the book "to the guy who beat me" or something like that. The guy was actually much, much bigger than Bruce , which probably helped him, so physical factor is important for martial arts too. There were several other guys too, I can not recall. Bruce had about 500 unofficial fights and there were 6 to 8 fights that he lost.
2. Bruce Lee did not actually beat Chuck Norris, what happened was that when they met first they had a sparring for several hours. Bruce demonstrated great hand work and Chuck taught him how to use legs, Chuck said that Bruce was one of the most skillful martial artist he knew, he also mentioned that prior to their first encounter Bruce had not used his legs for high kicks (higher than waist). But Chuck was far from estimating Bruce as the "greatest fighter" ever or anything like that, he was implying that they were at about the same level. Now don't you think that Ali would have a very good chance against Chuck Norris?
3. I thought that it was written somewhere that Bruce himself admitted that Ali is of those who could beat him, or something like that.
4. Take a look at UFC, it does seem that karate or kung fu masters do not actually do well in those tournaments. To be fair, boxers do not do very wells either. It seems like grappling masters have an advantage over other disciplinces, at least in UFC. Why it would matter for this discussion? Just proves that there is nothing extraordinary about kung-fu or karate, it is all about physics - speed, power, etc..
5. Anyway, documentation of Bruce Lee's superior skills is weak, mostly memories of people around him, how reliable are they? There is a tons of documentation of Ali's skills.

All in all, although I would still more favor Bruce in street fight, I would say, that Ali has a good chance as well!

Im sorry man but I dont beleive any of that and im sure others agree. It really sounds like you dont know anything about the guy. I own all of his movies and interviews and he was a big inspiration to me when i was little and the made me start martial arts and later boxing.

The whole pupose of jeet koon do was to translate kung fu and others into street reliable ways of fighting. Bruce had to fight a man from china in order to get permission to teach non chinese people the art. He fought chinas best master and won but what he didnt like is that it took too long. So he started making his own style that cuts all the BS out and stickly left effective ways to strike. He was also a master at grappling

[lightweight132]

Form what i know Bruce would have been way too proud to sign some ones book "Guy who beat me" Especially a white mans book!

[Suleiman]

[[/quote]
Im sorry man but I dont beleive any of that and im sure others agree. It really sounds like you dont know anything about the guy. I own all of his movies and interviews and he was a big inspiration to me when i was little and the made me start martial arts and later boxing.

The whole pupose of jeet koon do was to translate kung fu and others into street reliable ways of fighting. Bruce had to fight a man from china in order to get permission to teach non chinese people the art. He fought chinas best master and won but what he didnt like is that it took too long. So he started making his own style that cuts all the BS out and stickly left effective ways to strike. He was also a master at grappling
[/quote]
Both you and I have the same sort of evidence - someone's books, articles, films. What makes you feel that your information is more accurate, reliable? I read article from Chuck Norris's book about their sparrring. I learned about Bruce's loss from a documentary film about martial arts some 15 years ago (that is why I am not sure about details but do remember the subject matter)- they even showed that karate guy (a very respected karate master, follower of Oyama (founder of Kiokushinkai karate school)) and that book with Bruce' autograph, OK, may be, I misstated the exact wording, but it was something with that meaning. They also told about statistics of his unofficial fights. In fact, it could be all b***s**t, I can easily live with that, why you are so sure that your movies and other stuff are so genuine? For example, you said that Bruce beat all best Chinese kung fu masters - how could he do that in reality? Most of China (except for Hongkong) was a closed (in both directions) communist state at that time, how Bruce could physically meet all these masters from all around China ( Shaoline, for instance)? Is it a reasonable comment? All I want to say, you never can be sure about Bruce true abilities, while Ali's abilities are truly well documented.
I guess that you know that Jet Lee (his original name Li Lian-jie) is a five time champion of China in kung-fu (wushu), which is equal to world championship. He is a true proven master of kung fu, but, do you believe in all that flying and other funny s***t that he does in his movies? I hope not really. He is a master of martial arts but not to the degree that it shown in the movies, the same with Bruce, he was a master, but not a god of martial arts, or something.. How can you deny even a chance of winning by prime Ali, with all his natural speed, reflexes and athletic abilities?

[raleights]

I forgot the address but I remember a while back someone posted a link showing 6 mma fights Bruce competeted in, all wins, 5 ended by knockout. So yeah he did some competing

[lightweight132]

I didnt say he fought all the champions i said the chinese kung fu people decided who the best was and arranged him to fight little bruce. go bruce go.

I think ali was fast for a heavy weight but his speed wouldnt have compared to bruces. Although if he landed a shot i think it would do tramendous damage to bruce. because of the weight difference. Every askes what scenerio boxing or street fight? I think it should not be a boxing match because of the weight nobody ever says who would win in a fight pacquio or tyson because its a ridiculous question do to size. if bruce was a boxer and never a martial artist no one would ever ask this question no matter how good he was at his weight. Its only fair to be a street fight

Sorry for saying your sources werent reliable its just i really like bruce. i think hes a bad ass and id like to remember him as a champ with a fro and shades


On to a real question who do you suppose would win out of George Foreman in his prime and Mike Tyson in his..........both were heavy weight boxers

[zacbox]

What a load of b*****ks. I read Bruce would have done this or that, I think more likely;

1) Ali batters him. A heavyweight champ, who has proved he can fight, not like the hearsay and rumours surrounding Bruce, it would be easy. In fact I'd discount any heavy, I reckon you good go to Featherweight (similar weight and size) and those guys would beat him silly. I can only imagine the damage Pac, MAB, Naz would do. Let alone any other Feathers through history.

2) UFC champ?? Do me a favour, He would get beaten VERY easily. We're not talking about a theory he developed 30 years ago (JKD). He'd be against well rounded guys who would easily deal with the speed, before taking him out in brutal fashion.

3) He made some entertaining films and is a true SCREEN Icon, but thats all. Any co-workers will say he was this or that, but the fact is there is no footage, and i'm sure Bruce knew his limitations so let the hype do the work.
How many times do you see interviews where actors say it was a great cast, we all got on so well etc, do you really think that to be the case?

Bruce Lee should not be mentioned on a fight forum, unless in reference to his films as inspiration.