Before Casa starts calling out everyone...

[bzkfn]

Don't you think he owes Santa Cruz a rematch? The WBC even called for an immediate rematch for his interim belt. I know we all want one champion, but its wrong that after the robbery he gets ignored.

[Kev]

Yeah Santa Cruz should get another title shot.

Personally I think Casamayor, Campbell, David Diaz and Santa Cruz are the guys who can reasonably stake a claim to being the divisions champion.

I imagine Casa and Diaz will both fight over Pacquaio, Barrera and maybe Marquez whilst Campbell might get frozen out and need to face Santa Cruz.

Then we should just be a fight or two away from having a universally recognised champ.

Call me crazy but I actully think David Diaz may stun everybody with a win over Pacquaio and then another win over Cambell or Casamayor.

He's underatted imo.

[Pugilistic]

i agree, he should rematch cruz.

[Mikkel_K]

Yeah Santa Cruz should get another title shot.

Personally I think Casamayor, Campbell, David Diaz and Santa Cruz are the guys who can reasonably stake a claim to being the divisions champion.

I imagine Casa and Diaz will both fight over Pacquaio, Barrera and maybe Marquez whilst Campbell might get frozen out and need to face Santa Cruz.

Then we should just be a fight or two away from having a universally recognised champ.

Call me crazy but I actully think David Diaz may stun everybody with a win over Pacquaio and then another win over Cambell or Casamayor.

He's underatted imo.

Campbell, Casamayor and Santa Cruz I can understand, but how exactly does Diaz stake a claim to being the division's champion?

He won a interim title (against Santa Cruz btw, but he didnt exactly have a claim to the title at that point) which was somehow awarded a full title ahead of Casamayor. He then robs Erik Morales, who was hardly the division's champ either, before finally defeating Ramon Montano on a MD last week.

I haven't seen Diaz' last fight, so he might have looked like the shit for all I know, but I still don't get what merits him having a stake of the title?

[bzkfn]

Yeah Santa Cruz should get another title shot.

Personally I think Casamayor, Campbell, David Diaz and Santa Cruz are the guys who can reasonably stake a claim to being the divisions champion.

I imagine Casa and Diaz will both fight over Pacquaio, Barrera and maybe Marquez whilst Campbell might get frozen out and need to face Santa Cruz.

Then we should just be a fight or two away from having a universally recognised champ.

Call me crazy but I actully think David Diaz may stun everybody with a win over Pacquaio and then another win over Cambell or Casamayor.

He's underatted imo.

He's terrible. I'm willing to rep bet with you that Pac whoops him. In fact, if you ever put him in there with Juan Diaz, David would get KTFO.

[Kev]

Yeah Santa Cruz should get another title shot.

Personally I think Casamayor, Campbell, David Diaz and Santa Cruz are the guys who can reasonably stake a claim to being the divisions champion.

I imagine Casa and Diaz will both fight over Pacquaio, Barrera and maybe Marquez whilst Campbell might get frozen out and need to face Santa Cruz.

Then we should just be a fight or two away from having a universally recognised champ.

Call me crazy but I actully think David Diaz may stun everybody with a win over Pacquaio and then another win over Cambell or Casamayor.

He's underatted imo.

Campbell, Casamayor and Santa Cruz I can understand, but how exactly does Diaz stake a claim to being the division's champion?

He won a interim title (against Santa Cruz btw, but he didnt exactly have a claim to the title at that point) which was somehow awarded a full title ahead of Casamayor. He then robs Erik Morales, who was hardly the division's champ either, before finally defeating Ramon Montano on a MD last week.

I haven't seen Diaz' last fight, so he might have looked like the shit for all I know, but I still don't get what merits him having a stake of the title?

I'm not saying he can stake a claim to being the champion, I'm saying he deserves a fight against Casamayor and Campbell as much as Santa Cruz.

He's another belt holder and let's be honest this division is in a complete state of flux right now. Casa looked like shat against Santa Cruz, Cambell was in no man's land only a couple weeks ago and Santa Cruz has never even held the title and got knocked out by Diaz.

None of these four can really lay claim to being the division's best but all four of them deserve a chance to fight for that chance.

The Morales fight was close and competitive, it could have gone either way, it was certainly no robbery. Adding in that Diaz knocked out Santa Cruz prior to that he has as much right for a unification fight as Casa, Campbell and Santa Cruz imo.

Diaz WILL give Manny problems if they fight. He's a relentless pressure fighter with a great chin. He's never been legitimately stopped and although down a couple times always gets up and keeps moving forward. If Pacquaio's power doesn't carry to 135 and I think it's entirely possible that it may not, Diaz could be a nightmare for him in the same way Campbell was for Juan Diaz.

I never understood why he gets so much hate to be honest, only one loss, against a very slick Kendall Holt in a premature stoppage, two wins over Zab Judah in a great amatuer career and wins in the pro ranks over Santa Cruz and Morales.

Sure he's limited and would be no match for a prime Casamayor or a Manny Pacquaio in his natural weight class but imo he's well positioned to cause a couple upsets right now.

He's still very much a factor in this division.

[Kev]

Yeah Santa Cruz should get another title shot.

Personally I think Casamayor, Campbell, David Diaz and Santa Cruz are the guys who can reasonably stake a claim to being the divisions champion.

I imagine Casa and Diaz will both fight over Pacquaio, Barrera and maybe Marquez whilst Campbell might get frozen out and need to face Santa Cruz.

Then we should just be a fight or two away from having a universally recognised champ.

Call me crazy but I actully think David Diaz may stun everybody with a win over Pacquaio and then another win over Cambell or Casamayor.

He's underatted imo.

He's terrible. I'm willing to rep bet with you that Pac whoops him. In fact, if you ever put him in there with Juan Diaz, David would get KTFO.

I'll take a rep bet that if Daiz and Manny fight it will be a really tough fight for Pacquaio.

Close points win at best

[bzkfn]

Yeah Santa Cruz should get another title shot.

Personally I think Casamayor, Campbell, David Diaz and Santa Cruz are the guys who can reasonably stake a claim to being the divisions champion.

I imagine Casa and Diaz will both fight over Pacquaio, Barrera and maybe Marquez whilst Campbell might get frozen out and need to face Santa Cruz.

Then we should just be a fight or two away from having a universally recognised champ.

Call me crazy but I actully think David Diaz may stun everybody with a win over Pacquaio and then another win over Cambell or Casamayor.

He's underatted imo.

He's terrible. I'm willing to rep bet with you that Pac whoops him. In fact, if you ever put him in there with Juan Diaz, David would get KTFO.

I'll take a rep bet that if Daiz and Manny fight it will be a really tough fight for Pacquaio.

Close points win at best

Tell you what, as the bet is clearly in my favour (Manny being the clear favourite), I'll bet you 100 rep points that Diaz doesn't hear the final bell. I'm going for the Manny KO.

[Kev]

He's terrible. I'm willing to rep bet with you that Pac whoops him. In fact, if you ever put him in there with Juan Diaz, David would get KTFO.

I'll take a rep bet that if Daiz and Manny fight it will be a really tough fight for Pacquaio.

Close points win at best

Tell you what, as the bet is clearly in my favour (Manny being the clear favourite), I'll bet you 100 rep points that Diaz doesn't hear the final bell. I'm going for the Manny KO.

Ok you're on

[bzkfn]

I'll take a rep bet that if Daiz and Manny fight it will be a really tough fight for Pacquaio.

Close points win at best

Tell you what, as the bet is clearly in my favour (Manny being the clear favourite), I'll bet you 100 rep points that Diaz doesn't hear the final bell. I'm going for the Manny KO.

Ok you're on

Ok so even if Manny takes a points win, the points are yours. Not that it matters because its rare I'm wrong. I'm the only guy who picked Phillips to win last night!

[ArawakWarria]

[quote=Bilbo;488574][quote=Mikkel_K;488569]

Yeah Santa Cruz should get another title shot.

Personally I think Casamayor, Campbell, David Diaz and Santa Cruz are the guys who can reasonably stake a claim to being the divisions champion.


I never understood why he gets so much hate to be honest, only one loss, against a very slick Kendall Holt in a premature stoppage, two wins over Zab Judah in a great amatuer career and wins in the pro ranks over Santa Cruz and Morales.

Sure he's limited and would be no match for a prime Casamayor or a Manny Pacquaio in his natural weight class but imo he's well positioned to cause a couple upsets right now.

He's still very much a factor in this division.

Bilbo, I loved all of your comments, but you can't be serious about David Diaz...? Early decision? I'm looking for the video right now. Diaz was outclassed that fight, and it is that crude style that will keep him in the L column against all the top Ltwts. Good that he gets some 'up in weight' money.

[Mikkel_K]

Personally I think Casamayor, Campbell, David Diaz and Santa Cruz are the guys who can reasonably stake a claim to being the divisions champion.

Campbell, Casamayor and Santa Cruz I can understand, but how exactly does Diaz stake a claim to being the division's champion?

I'm not saying he can stake a claim to being the champion, I'm saying he deserves a fight against Casamayor and Campbell as much as Santa Cruz.

I' sorry, but I thought you said just that.

And while I don't think Diaz is (as) bad (as people make him), I disagree that he is as deserving of a shot as the others. David Diaz might be a belt holder, but he has never defeated anyone with a belt. Nor has he ever defeated a top lightweight for that matter (especially not if you discount the Morales fight (and while I agree robbery was too strong a word, I will maintain that Morals should have got the decision)).

Should he defeat Pac, he would be an obvious guy in the mix, but as for now, he has as much claim to be at the top as Juan Diaz.

[Kev]

[quote=ArawakWarria;488593][quote=Bilbo;488574]

Bilbo, I loved all of your comments, but you can't be serious about David Diaz...? Early decision? I'm looking for the video right now. Diaz was outclassed that fight, and it is that crude style that will keep him in the L column against all the top Ltwts. Good that he gets some 'up in weight' money.

You mean the premature stoppage against Holt? I have no argument in that Diaz was losing that fight, he did indeed get totally outclassed just as he was outclassed against Santa Cruz.

But its worth noting that he still put Holt down in the 7th and knocked Santa Cruz out.

I'm not suggesting for an instant that Diaz is anywhere near the class and pedigree of Pacquaio or a prime Casamayor,

But he does have tremendous heart, a never say die attitude and a solid chin.

He's never been an easy fight for anybody and whether or not you think he deserved to beat Morales or not nobody can deny that he came back from an early knockdown and from being behind to outworking Morales down the stretch.

All 3 judges gave Diaz all 6 of the last 6 rounds against Morales.

He doesn't give up, he keeps fighting to the very end and for a guy like Manny who will be above his natural weight class and who lets face it has looked increasingly lacklustre in recent fights, and particulalry vulnurable against Marquez he could be a tricky opponent.

[bzkfn]

[quote=Bilbo;488600][quote=ArawakWarria;488593]

You mean the premature stoppage against Holt? I have no argument in that Diaz was losing that fight, he did indeed get totally outclassed just as he was outclassed against Santa Cruz.

But its worth noting that he still put Holt down in the 7th and knocked Santa Cruz out.

I'm not suggesting for an instant that Diaz is anywhere near the class and pedigree of Pacquaio or a prime Casamayor,

But he does have tremendous heart, a never say die attitude and a solid chin.

He's never been an easy fight for anybody and whether or not you think he deserved to beat Morales or not nobody can deny that he came back from an early knockdown and from being behind to outworking Morales down the stretch.

All 3 judges gave Diaz all 6 of the last 6 rounds against Morales.

He doesn't give up, he keeps fighting to the very end and for a guy like Manny who will be above his natural weight class and who lets face it has looked increasingly lacklustre in recent fights, and particulalry vulnurable against Marquez he could be a tricky opponent.

I agree that he has heart, but he never has an easy fight himself. He has poor defence and I don't think this is the right fight for him. I think him against Casa would be close though, as could Casa keep up with Diaz workrate?

[ArawakWarria]

[quote=Bilbo;488600][quote=ArawakWarria;488593]

You mean the premature stoppage against Holt? I have no argument in that Diaz was losing that fight, he did indeed get totally outclassed just as he was outclassed against Santa Cruz.

But its worth noting that he still put Holt down in the 7th and knocked Santa Cruz out.

I'm not suggesting for an instant that Diaz is anywhere near the class and pedigree of Pacquaio or a prime Casamayor,

But he does have tremendous heart, a never say die attitude and a solid chin.

He's never been an easy fight for anybody and whether or not you think he deserved to beat Morales or not nobody can deny that he came back from an early knockdown and from being behind to outworking Morales down the stretch.

All 3 judges gave Diaz all 6 of the last 6 rounds against Morales.

He doesn't give up, he keeps fighting to the very end and for a guy like Manny who will be above his natural weight class and who lets face it has looked increasingly lacklustre in recent fights, and particulalry vulnurable against Marquez he could be a tricky opponent.

all good points again, yoda.

But there is still the question of how he struggled against a person Pacquiao KO's in a few rounds? Was it the weight? Did it drain him for Manny & empower him for Diaz

Side note---Pacqiao v. JUAN Diaz would be a PPV for me. They could still make it happen.