I conceed.

[El Kabong]

KL you like socialism then move to a socialist country and IF America was socialist then stop fucking complaining about it comrade.

You don't like supply side economics, you don't believe in it....that's fine go right ahead. I am not going ot try and argue it with you because you're not going to want to try to understand it so it's pointless to answer your questions KL....understand?

I'm not dodging, I'm saving you and me valueable time. I believe my way you believe your way...tax cuts don't destroy the economy like this, the Fed Rate cuts might but not tax cuts. Over spending might but not tax cuts. When you cut taxes you have to make it worth a citizen's while for them to SPEND their money and right now there's nothing out there to spend it on. Besides the taxes on the oil companies alone SHOULD have made up for any tax cut made by W.

John McCain isn't a crook and also a lot of good your democrats have done lately. John McCain's politics represent more of America than Hillary or Obama because he doesn't tow the party line, he can come across the isle and work with people of other political parties, and he has a heart and takes people into consideration with his policies.

You want to hate him then go right ahead. I'm done for now, I'll be back once you're all done driving the Democrat Party into the ground.....AGAIN

[Kirkland Laing]

KL you like socialism then move to a socialist country and IF America was socialist then stop fucking complaining about it comrade.

You don't like supply side economics, you don't believe in it....that's fine go right ahead. I am not going ot try and argue it with you because you're not going to want to try to understand it so it's pointless to answer your questions KL....understand?

I'm not dodging, I'm saving you and me valueable time. I believe my way you believe your way...tax cuts don't destroy the economy like this, the Fed Rate cuts might but not tax cuts. Over spending might but not tax cuts. When you cut taxes you have to make it worth a citizen's while for them to SPEND their money and right now there's nothing out there to spend it on. Besides the taxes on the oil companies alone SHOULD have made up for any tax cut made by W.

John McCain isn't a crook and also a lot of good your democrats have done lately. John McCain's politics represent more of America than Hillary or Obama because he doesn't tow the party line, he can come across the isle and work with people of other political parties, and he has a heart and takes people into consideration with his policies.

You want to hate him then go right ahead. I'm done for now, I'll be back once you're all done driving the Democrat Party into the ground.....AGAIN

I don't like socialism, I'm an ardent capitalist. I especially don't like corporate socialism. At least in Europe the handouts go to the people, not corporations.

You can't make an argument for supply-side economics, you're not capable of doing it. You just have this touching belief that tax cuts somehow work, in the face of all the facts and evidence.

Bush is making the Fed cut rates so shouldn't Bush get the blame for the damage rate cuts are doing to the economy, especially because they're a reaction to the failure of his other dumbass economic policies?

The oil compnies get tens of billions in government handouts every year, sometimews over a hundred billion. Do you think the government should continue paying them these subsidies?

John McCain is a flip-flopping bullshitter who pretends to be a "maverick." He's a clueless dummy that makes the incumbent clueless dummy look like a great man. He's easily the worst possible choice of all three candidates and it's because he'll carry on the same dumbass Bush policies that I hope he wins. The only way there'll ever be significant change in America is if the current lunatic Republican policies are continues till their inevitable spectacualr failure, and McCain is just the man to do it.

[El Kabong]

OK how do you get jobs to come to you? You give the companies some breaks. I agree that the BIG companies get the big breaks and sometimes it's uncalled for, I didn't like the bail out of Bear Stearns anymore than you.

Bush doesn't make the Fed cut rates the Fed Chair controls what happens in there he is not controlled by the President, I mean the President can replace him but if that was the case Greenspan wouldn't have lasted as long as he did.


Supply side economics is simple, you let the people have more money to spend and make up the difference via sales tax and corporate taxes as business would increase if spending increased but the problem is that sometimes people don't want to spend any money. You don't cut taxes during a war that's a big no-no...I will agree on that. Make an arguement for big tax hikes...should we have to pay this government more for what they have done I'd rather they do more with less instead of less with more.

Kirkland please....PLEASE come vote for Obama I am sure his policies are just going to blow our fucking minds. We've already had an inexperienced elitist prick running the show for 8 years and now you want another one but from another party and you think he's going to be different, how cute.

[Kirkland Laing]

OK how do you get jobs to come to you? You give the companies some breaks. I agree that the BIG companies get the big breaks and sometimes it's uncalled for, I didn't like the bail out of Bear Stearns anymore than you.

Bush doesn't make the Fed cut rates the Fed Chair controls what happens in there he is not controlled by the President, I mean the President can replace him but if that was the case Greenspan wouldn't have lasted as long as he did.


Supply side economics is simple, you let the people have more money to spend and make up the difference via sales tax and corporate taxes as business would increase if spending increased but the problem is that sometimes people don't want to spend any money. You don't cut taxes during a war that's a big no-no...I will agree on that. Make an arguement for big tax hikes...should we have to pay this government more for what they have done I'd rather they do more with less instead of less with more.

Kirkland please....PLEASE come vote for Obama I am sure his policies are just going to blow our fucking minds. We've already had an inexperienced elitist prick running the show for 8 years and now you want another one but from another party and you think he's going to be different, how cute.

The government subdidies have zero to do with job creation. Multinationals have been downsizing and outsourcing and offshoring their taxable liabilities for decades now and they still get their subsidies.

Bush does control the Fed. Alan Greenspan's top priority under the Clinton admin. was to end the deficits and balance the budget and develop a surplus to pay for future increases in Medicare/SS, because that was Clinton's priorities. When Bush took over Greenspan suddenly saw the surplus as dangerous and something that could lead to socialism and his top priority was giving it and much more away in tax breaks to the top 1% of earners, because that was Bush's proority. That's hoe Greenspan lasted as long as he did. Fe dchairs throughout history are endlessly on the record as doing the president's bidding :

White House officials have told us that President Bush intervened forcibly to convince an initially reluctant Federal Reserve to reduce interest rates. "There were some telephone calls from the White House to the Fed in which some very crude language was used."

Swoop, January 28th-February 3rd report


I'll deal with tax cuts and the elitist Obama when I have time later.

[El Kabong]

Swoop doesn't even list it's writers...and yet somehow they are a legitimate source of information


Have fun trying to explain away Obama's socialist political beliefs...he's a radical John Kerry who is better at reading.

[Kirkland Laing]

Swoop doesn't even list it's writers...and yet somehow they are a legitimate source of information


Have fun trying to explain away Obama's socialist political beliefs...he's a radical John Kerry who is better at reading.

That Fed chairs are politically beholden to presidents to keep their job is endlessly well-documented throughout history, not least on the Nixon tapes when Nixon tells Arthur Burns to cut interest rates before the 1972 election.

I notice again no attempt by you to deal with facts and evidence and answer my questions. Here are some more inconvenient facts about supply-side economics -- tax cuts do not pay for themselves in any way, shape or form. Let's look at the Bush tax cuts for the best possible example of disastrous tax cuts which failed to pay for themselves :

Here's how tax revenues have gone over the past few decades, so that we can compare the wonderful revenue success under Bush 43. In 1950 we had $45 billion in revenues, which jumped to $91 by 1960. The link only shows from 1962, so you'll just have to take my word for it.

From $91 billion in 1960, we jumped to $192 billion in 1970.

In 1980, revenues jumped to a massive $517 billion, although the extra revenue was inflation caused by two disastrous external oil price spikes beyond our control.

By 1990, revenues had jumped from $517 to $1032 billion, again doubling.

In 2000, revenues had doubled again from $1032 to $2025.

Bush's 2001 tax cut was backdated to Q1 2001, so the cut was in place from the first day of fiscal year 2001. So by 2005, we should have been looking at revenues in the region of $3000 billion plus the extra revenue growth from the tax cuts, right?

Here are the numbers :

2000 : $2025

Bush tax cut

2001 : $1991

2002 : $1853

Bush tax cut

2003 : $1782

2004 : $1880

2005 : $2153


Here are the numbers for income tax, the tax that is supposed to grow the most in response to a cut :

1960 : $41.7 billion

1970 : $90.4

1980 : $244.1

1990 : $466.9

2000 : $1004.5

Bush tax cut

2001 : $994.3

2002 : $858.3

Bush tax cut

2003 : $793.7

2004 : $809.0

2005 : $927.2

2006 : $1043.9


http://www.cbo.gov/budget/historical.pdf

So from a position of surplus eight years ago Bush has now created an ongoing trillion dollar a year revenue shortfall. Guess which section of American society are going to see their taxes rocket in a couple of years to cover this? Not the top-earning 1%, that's for sure.


And how is Obama an elitist? He's got an immigrant father and had to work his way through college. He got where he is because he's got a brilliant brain. John McCain has been a Senator most of his life and his entire career is down to marrying an heiress to the Coors brewing empire. Now McCain represents the interests of guys like the Coors family and the other richest families in America while Obama represents the interests of working Americans. Which one is elitist?

[El Kabong]

So John McCain is an elitist? John McCain a military man from a military family marries into money and he's an elite now? John McCain's son is also in the service....but nevermind that John McCain is elite.

John McCain is more of you average everyday guy than Barack or Hillary.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UMkQ6OPi3RU


....so apparently I'm "bitter" and have been "beaten down" by the government. And Barack wants to make progress without anyone knowing or seeing it....like some sort of ninja politician.


If all you say is true then why even bother worrying about it KL it's like America is getting ready to be sucked into a black hole so there is nothing anyone could possibly do.....so why not elect Pee Wee Herman as President since no one can do anything about America's problems.....oh wait I know someone who can....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZyPaivOARM


HAHAHAHA