kelly pavlik against past middle and light heavyweights

[Mr140]

Also lets not forget that Ray Leonard was able to capture the 175 pound title as well he was way better Don Curry could hope to be. Sugar Ray Leonard had to speed and the legs to beat the body snatcher by ud. To say that Mike would stop Ray Leonard kinda silly the man had a chin as good as his.

[CFH]

McCullum is an ATG.

Are Haglers really better? MCCullum best 6 wins:

1. James Toney (prime)
2. Don Curry
3. Steve Collins
4. Michael Watson (Who schooled Been and Eubank)
5. Julian Jackson (In 2, first Jackson loss)
6. Herol Graham


McCallum was ducked by all the greats, why? because he was a great.

Listen a bigger Hagler fan you wont find, i still think McCallum (prime) was better all round and takes a UD.

Fair enough, hard to argue with most of that. I feel Hagler's wins are better, but I concede that you can make a case for McCallum.

Both ATG i just feel had Mike fought Tommy and Ray he would get his dues.

Us real fans know how great Mike was in every department

If he had fought and beat Hearns and Leonard he would unquestionably be better than Hagler and nearly any other fighter I can think of.

[ICB]

Also lets not forget that Ray Leonard was able to capture the 175 pound title as well he was way better Don Curry could hope to be. Sugar Ray Leonard had to speed and the legs to beat the body snatcher by ud. To say that Mike would stop Ray Leonard kinda silly the man had a chin as good as his.

SRL got the Light Heavyweight title but he actually wasn't a Light Heavyweight, he fought Donny LaLonde at catch-weight. SRL was 165 and Donny LaLonde was 167, thats why i believe the vacant Super Middleweight title was also up for grabs.

[southakron314]

People always try this and it never holds water. How do you think Ruth and Cobb would do in todays baseball game. Or Nameth. They would get owned. Pavlik would beat Hearns, Manzon , McC and maybe Hagler. He would beat SRR and Lamatta. he would bury Harry Greb. He would have a tough time with Jones Jr. Hopkins in his prime , and Toney and he beats Calzaghe. PAVLIK HAS NOT EVEN HIT HIS PRIME YET. HE IS JUST GETTING INTO HIS PRIME.

[southakron314]

sorry I meant Monzon. typo.

[Spicoli]

McCallum was unttterly robbed in the first Toney fight i will add. Its down as a draw but man it was worse than Lewis v Holyfield I.

Sorry chief,No way.A bit of a role reversal in that one with Consumate thinker and ring master McCallum mixing more brawling in spots and Toney doing nice boxing.Great fight,Great match up but I had Toney edging it off strong finish.Certainly not a Robbery,let alone a fiasco on par with Holyfield/Lewis 1.

[CFH]

People always try this and it never holds water. How do you think Ruth and Cobb would do in todays baseball game. Or Nameth. They would get owned. Pavlik would beat Hearns, Manzon , McC and maybe Hagler. He would beat SRR and Lamatta. he would bury Harry Greb. He would have a tough time with Jones Jr. Hopkins in his prime , and Toney and he beats Calzaghe. PAVLIK HAS NOT EVEN HIT HIS PRIME YET. HE IS JUST GETTING INTO HIS PRIME.

Pavlik would beat the man widely regarded as the best boxer of all time? I am well aware that SRR was not at his best at MW, but that's a ludicrous statement. What could you possible base that on, wins against Taylor and Miranda? That my friend is fanboyism at its highest level.

Imagine how good Robinson would be with today's training, nutrition etc. That works both ways you know.

[Mr140]

Well i while say this about Mike is the only way to beat him is outbox him. I feel Sugar Ray Leonard could outbox and has the chin to go the distance with him alot of fight that did not happen with top guys and Mike in the 1980s but i think alot of it was just bad timing i think. Hagler and Leonard were at the end of there careers and primes when Mick was big. Mike i think if he did not lose to Kalambay would of got a fight with Duran or Hearns not sure which i remeber reading a articale or somthing on it.

[JT Rock]

Kelly Pavlik isn't 1 punch KO artist, even though he is a big puncher it normally takes an accumulation of punches. For Kelly Pavlik to take out his opponents,
.

Just because we were talking about this on another thread, I have to ask how you rate a power puncher Seems like your criteria changes from thread to thread

[ICB]

Kelly Pavlik isn't 1 punch KO artist, even though he is a big puncher it normally takes an accumulation of punches. For Kelly Pavlik to take out his opponents,
.

Just because we were talking about this on another thread, I have to ask how you rate a power puncher Seems like your criteria changes from thread to thread

Kelly Pavlik is a good puncher but he hasn't got the kind of 1 punch KO Julian Jackson has.

[JT Rock]

Kelly Pavlik isn't 1 punch KO artist, even though he is a big puncher it normally takes an accumulation of punches. For Kelly Pavlik to take out his opponents,
.

Just because we were talking about this on another thread, I have to ask how you rate a power puncher Seems like your criteria changes from thread to thread

Kelly Pavlik is a good puncher but he hasn't got the kind of 1 punch KO Julian Jackson has.

Not taking a run at you, but most would consider Pavlik a great puncher with the ability to change a fight at anytime

Not to mention Jackson gives up almost 4 inches in height and 2 inches in reach. I just dont see a Jackson Blowout against such a big middleweight that could starch him just as good, having all the physical advantages over him

[Mr140]

Yea lets not forget that Pavlik has the physical advantges why i might take him over a Jackson or a Hearns because there chins were bad.

[ICB]

Just because we were talking about this on another thread, I have to ask how you rate a power puncher Seems like your criteria changes from thread to thread

Kelly Pavlik is a good puncher but he hasn't got the kind of 1 punch KO Julian Jackson has.

Not taking a run at you, but most would consider Pavlik a great puncher with the ability to change a fight at anytime

Not to mention Jackson gives up almost 4 inches in height and 2 inches in reach. I just dont see a Jackson Blowout against such a big middleweight that could starch him just as good, having all the physical advantages over him

Oh yea he can turn a fight around with 1 punch, i don't disagree with that. He has the height advantage and he gets alot of leverage into his shots, aswell as a good jab to set up the right hand.

But IMO i think it would take him about 6 rounds to get Julian Jackson out of there, Julian Jackson doesn't need to turn a fight around. If Jackson basically hits you flush on the chin with 1 punch your KO'ed, i just think he would be able to get to Pavlik's chin earlier.

[Markusdarkus]

Pavlik has punishing power but in no way has one punch power.

Probably because his shots are straight and are not winged they dont travel far. Miranda, Lacy, Haye type fighters, one punch knock you into next week power.

[kingfrnk]

Kelly Pavlik isn't 1 punch KO artist, even though he is a big puncher it normally takes an accumulation of punches. For Kelly Pavlik to take out his opponents,
.

Just because we were talking about this on another thread, I have to ask how you rate a power puncher Seems like your criteria changes from thread to thread

Kelly Pavlik is a good puncher but he hasn't got the kind of 1 punch KO Julian Jackson has.

agree, kelly has the best kinda punching power you can have which is natural, he doesnt have to use a lot of energy to ko people